Losing the Luster

[Ice350]

My new issue of Automobile Magazine came in. In it is an article called Losing the Luster. It is about the poor quality of German autos. We all pretty know this but it's good to see it reported in a major magazine. Not because I feel negative feelings for the Germans, I just think this news needs to be reported to everyone who spends their bucks on these cars. As an enthusiast, I feel for people who make uninformed decisions and end up paying dearly. The problem is not many publications report the problems. This is good. Now maybe the Germans will try haeder to improve things. I will be happy when they do. I think Benzes are some of the most beautiful cars on the road. In fact, I would love to get my hands on the SL or CL...love em. If they were reliable that is.

[gs400998]

Originally Posted by reggiek

My new issue of Automobile Magazine came in. In it is an article called Losing the Luster. It is about the poor quality of German autos. We all pretty know this but it's good to see it reported in a major magazine. Not because I feel negative feelings for the Germans, I just think this news needs to be reported to everyone who spends their bucks on these cars. As an enthusiast, I feel for people who make uninformed decisions and end up paying dearly. The problem is not many publications report the problems. This is good. Now maybe the Germans will try haeder to improve things. I will be happy when they do. I think Benzes are some of the most beautiful cars on the road. In fact, I would love to get my hands on the SL or CL...love em. If they were reliable that is.

I have a friend who continues to buy German and the only thing that he talks about his BMW or MB is another repair job at the shop. I don't think he uses logic or facts

[mmarshall]

Originally Posted by gs400998

I have a friend who continues to buy German and the only thing that he talks about his BMW or MB is another repair job at the shop. I don't think he uses logic or facts

This is just part of the "image" and auto stereotyping that I have written about so many times.
It never has and never will be based on logic, intelligence, or common sense.

[L-Finesser]

The Germans are way overrated these days. There are, however, three Teutonic machines I do lust after.
1. The BMW 6-series coupe.
2. The Mercdes new "4-door coupe."
3. The new BMW 540
After that, every other Benz, Bimmer and Audi look like boring, bland appliances with a ton of electrical problems waiting to happen.

[Ice350]

Originally Posted by L-Finesser

The Germans are way overrated these days. There are, however, three Teutonic machines I do lust after.
1. The BMW 6-series coupe.
2. The Mercdes new "4-door coupe."
3. The new BMW 540
After that, every other Benz, Bimmer and Audi look like boring, bland appliances with a ton of electrical problems waiting to happen.

I also love the new 645. The article does say that BMW is the most reliable German car. Maybe it's time to give them more thought!

[Vegassc400]

Originally Posted by reggiek

I also love the new 645. The article does say that BMW is the most reliable German car. Maybe it's time to give them more thought!

Saying that BMW is the best of the worst isn't really that much of a compliment. I thought that Porsche was the most reliable German car?

[gs400998]

Subscriber-survey of Annual Auto Issue of Consumer Report indicates Porsche has a higher reliability than BMW, VW and MB. Porsche is still 20% worse than average. BMW is 40% worse than average and MB is 80% worse than average. Pontiac, Buick and Chevrolet are abourt average in reliability. Lexus/Toyota is about 50% better than average.

[RA40]

The whole thing just makes you want to
The mentality behind tolerating the problems amazes me. The manufacturers have access to some fine examples of reliability...why not study them and integrate.

[mmarshall]

Originally Posted by gs400998

Subscriber-survey of Annual Auto Issue of Consumer Report indicates Porsche has a higher reliability than BMW, VW and MB. Porsche is still 20% worse than average. BMW is 40% worse than average and MB is 80% worse than average. Pontiac, Buick and Chevrolet are abourt average in reliability. Lexus/Toyota is about 50% better than average.

The Buick Regal and similiar Century have been well above average in reliability....the 2004 issue of CR actually put it in the Camry's class in reliability (no, I'm not kidding). This year it ranks just under a few Toyota and Lexus products....but, of course, it is being discontinued for the new and untested Lacrosse.
Ditto for the non-supercharged Pontiac Grand Prix ( the same frame, chassis, and powertrain as the Regal) but the supercharged GTP gets a distinct black mark....don't know why except maybe for the stresses the blower puts on it or the way they are driven. For some reason CR does not break down the Regal and supercharged Regal GS....perhaps not enough GS'es were sold.

[retrodrive]

Originally Posted by L-Finesser

The Germans are way overrated these days. There are, however, three Teutonic machines I do lust after.
1. The BMW 6-series coupe.
2. The Mercdes new "4-door coupe."
3. The new BMW 540
After that, every other Benz, Bimmer and Audi look like boring, bland appliances with a ton of electrical problems waiting to happen.

I love the 6 series beemer but I really can't hate on CL line of Benzes either.

[CK6Speed]

I would love for the German cars to take note and get their reliability act together. I started off with Toyota/Honda cars, moved to Lexus/Acura cars, then to BMW, and back to Lexus/Toyota. My most importent reason for moving out of BMW or even trying Mercedes is the reliability. I make a modest living and I can't afford their reliability. I have to be honest though, I like Mercedes style and more so BMW up until the Bangles years. They are really beautiful cars. If money were not a problem for me I would still buy BMW or Mercedes dispite their reliability problems. At that point I could care less about dumping money into the car as it wouldn't be a problem. For the time being, I like the fact that the Japanese cars are starting to put the whole driving feel that the Germans cars have. Aside from my NSX, the BMW had the best driving feel of any car I've owned. That is one thing I hate about my Lexus. The steering sucks. It sould's like they are trying to turn that around with the new GS and IS though.

[IsraelRX]

From CR:

[mmarshall]

Originally Posted by CK6Speed

I Aside from my NSX, the BMW had the best driving feel of any car I've owned. .

BMW is even starting to lose that, too, in the new " Active Steering" cars.

It's a shame to see Jaguar back down on the bottom again. They were making real progress in reliability for years after Ford bought them out. Can't deny the quality drop, though.....I've looked at some recent Jaguars that were so shoddy that trim parts fell right off when you opened and closed the doors. On one S-2000 that I looked at one of the outside door handles didn't work AT ALL.

[CK6Speed]

Originally Posted by mmarshall

BMW is even starting to lose that, too, in the new " Active Steering" cars.

Yes, I'm a little worried about this new craze to make everything from steering to brakes active. I haven't really driven those newer cars with them so I can't really say one way or another if I like the feel or not. I do like inovation and technology, so I hope these manufacturers get it right. The one thing I do like is the idea of active shocks though. Having a smooth ride over minor bumps and low speeds then firming up at higher speeds and corners is something I do like. When I was growing up I was looking forward to owning and trying all different types of cars. Now, I'm sticking with Honda/Acura and Toyota/Lexus until the Europeans get their act together. WhenI had the BMW I enjoyed it right up until I my SRS system started acting up, my ABS system started acting up, my window regulator was about to snap, and that iritating brake light sensor failure on the OBC keep showing up. I was glad when Lexus gave me $7000 for it as a trade in on my RX330 The again though, I'm getting all the usual problems on my SC like control arm bushings, steering rack bushings, fuel pump ECU failure, so I guess nothing is perfect At least I can get Toyota and Lexus parts cheap since my friend used to be the manager at the local Toyota/Lexus parts distribution center.

[Milla...]

Dang Look at Land Rover, they're at the bottom of the list.