Acura dealers expect cheaper RL
Kathy Jackson
Automotive News / February 20, 2006 - 6:00 am

http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...t=newsletter02

 

ouch, that hurts......

although personally i think the RL is priced pretty good already?

 

I just reviewed one on Saturday. It is an astoundingly good car in many ways...especially body / hardware and the AWD system, but there are a lot of electronic toys on it....some of which IMO are needless. I think it is a good idea for Acura to produce a decontented version of it...in fact I mentioned that to the salespeople at the time.

 

THESE ACURA AND INFINITI PRESS RELEASES RECENTLY MAKE ME LOOK LIKE A DAMN CAR PROPHET!!!

To those that argued with me.


HA!

Can I make this press release my new signature??????

Sales chief Dick Colliver told Automotive News that the RL's content will change next year but gave no details. He acknowledged that the RL "hasn't performed to expectations."

It's at a price point in foreign territory for us," Mike McGrath, chairman of the Acura dealer council, said at the National Automobile Dealers Association convention here. "Maybe Acura doesn't have the brand image" to sell a vehicle at that price.

I am a damn genius, plain and simple.

ALL HAIL SICK!!!!!!!

 

I ' ve said a few times before that theRL isn't doing that poorly given that it has a loaded only model offered at a relatively high price compared with more flexible choices for the M35 & GS300.
In Canada it's even worse at C$70K,I've seen only 2 RL's on the road here so far LOL, I hope they offer less equipped models here too.

So this isn't necessarily good news for Lexus & Infiniti since a less well equipped & cheaper RL may attract customers who would have previously turned to the M35/GS3 because they don't want to pay more for unwanted options. I don't particularly like the exterior design of the RL, but think the interior is great, & no one can deny it's a very technologically sophisticated car, it won Japan Car of the Year Award last year over the Nissan Fuga V6 (third placed).

 

I don't think Acura should start stripping their cars and then have stuff that came standard be expensive options. That is one of the main things I like about Acura is that all their cars come loaded and the only option is usaully just a navigation system besides it being standard with the RL. To me it feels like your getting ripped off by most other high end cars when the base price may seem pretty attractive but they really are "base models" and once you start adding options that come standard with Acuras and what most consider should be standard on expensive cars their prices skyrocket and are much more expensive then what Acura offers. A 996 Porsche 911 bases in the high 60s to low 70 range but once you start adding just a few options that are insanesly expensive the car quickly gets into the high 80K-90K territory. Base E46 3 series were in the mid to upper 20K range but once you added the more powerful engine and options that came standard with Acura and most Lexus/Infiniti the car was in the 40's and getting close to 50K. Thing is those base or stripper models are extremely rare and very few dealerships will order any to keep in stock so you end of having to pay alot of money in expensive option packages just to get a few things you want. It costs manufactures more to offer optional soundsystems or other options, and to have so many configurations of cars so they end up charging thousands in option packages just for a stereo upgrade, HID lights, heated seats, leather interior, power seats, moonroof, etc where it would cost less to just have these things standard and put the base price higher. These things should be standard in a expensive luxury car anyway.

Alot of people are attracted to Acuras like the TSX, TL, MDX, because they come one way and that is loaded. The only option is a navigation system as well as a few cosmetic add ons, and the A spec for the TL. HIDs, power everything, moonroof, leather, good 6 disc cd soundsystem, cruise control, multiple airbags, power heated seats, dual climate control, all come standard in all these models and you don't need some expensive option package to get them. The base price may be slightly higher then some of its competitions decontented models but once you add most of these options the prices are much higher.

The RL would probrably sell better if there were more engine/drivetrain configurations like having a rwd model for areas that don't have alot of bad weather which could lower the price a few thousand and a v-8 option to offer what the M/GS/E class, 5 series, A6, competition has but that would cost alot of money for Acura to do and may not be worth it in the end. The RL needs more recognition too considering the dissapointing RL model before it and how many people might not know it was the excellent Legends successor. There is nothing wrong with the RL either as it gets very good reviews in car mags besides them wanting a more powerful v-8 option. Watering down the RL just for a lower base price is not going to make a huge difference in sales because in that price range people are just going to want those options anyway and they may feel they are getting ripped off by having to pay extra for them. The car has found more buyers at around 44-46K which is what many dealers are selling them at now. Even the newer Lexus GS and Infiniti M are being offered at lower prices because people do not want to pay near MSRP for them any more. Perhaps a RL without SH-AWD would lower the price, lighten the car up, get better gas mileage, greatly improve acceleration, and sell more cars but one of the things that make the RL amazing and its selling point is the highly advanced AWD system. In the future Acura will probrably have a rwd model and a v-8, hybrid, or even v-10 option which might sell more but right now you can only get one model that only comes loaded with SH-AWD and I like it that way not having to pay for expensive option packages. I have seen more RLs on the road now then new GSs and I have only seen 1 Infiniti M35 on the road and no M45s.

 

Wow, how are they suppose to differentiate an optioned down RL with a TL? Besides real wood and the more advanced navigation system, I can't really see much of a difference between a FWD RL and a TL, or even a really optioned out Honda Accord. If you think about it, they probably would have to lower the HP on the engine to avoid the torque steer without the SHAWD. Anyways, my point is that 10K is alot of money to pay for different styling, real wood, and an upgraded navigation (no matter how cool it is).

 

I think the lack of a V-8 is not a big problem for Acura. It's not not like the GS430 is selling in huge numbers compared to the GS300 (I think it's about 1:6) either. It's the presence of their sub-$25k cars that hurts their image the most IMO. Drop or rebadge the RSX/RSX-S/EL back to Honda first and they may actually start earning some respect in the luxury car market.

 

Well if they knock off the Navi that would probably reduce the price by about 2-3 grand. The fancy XM and a few other small things would get it down maybe an extra grand or so. After that you really cant do much. Everything else comes standard on the TL(well even XM does for the first 3 months). These are okay cars, and are really a nice drive. But they are obviously having a lot of trouble selling them. Two of my friends who work for them are having such a hard time selling them. They sit on the lots for months. A lot of their customers just go for the TL after they get all the numbers in front of them.

 

Yes I can see where customers may go for the TL once they see the numbers and I think that Acura is not loosing alot of customers for the RL to its competition like the Infiniti M and Lexus GS but to the less expensive TL. After test driving the 2 the TL feels a little quicker and it is since it is a good deal lighter and does not have to channel its power to a all wheel drive system. The RL is not much larger nor does it have much more room then the TL and the TL does get very good gas mileage plus there is a 6 speed manual option. The TL also comes loaded with most of the options the RL has besides the SH-AWD, real wood, tracking headlights, NAV, and a few others so many shoppers may feel the TL is a much better deal. The TL may not come standard with NAV or AWD or have as nice an interior but it does offer a lot for the money.

I think the same thing happend with the last gen RL and 99+ TL. The 99+ TL had 225hp where the RL had 215hp and the TL had just about all the RLs options standard besides the RLs real wood interior yet the TL cost much less then the 40K+ RL. The TL then had a 260hp option which blew the RLs 215-225hp away. I think that potential RL customers felt the TL was the better deal and just went with a TL instead of the RL in alot of cases. The 99+ TLs have sold extremely well and were one of the top selling luxury cars in the U.S. for a few years so I am sure many RL customers have just went with the much less expensive TL once they saw the numbers and debated if it was really worth spending all that much more on a RL.

 

Some of you still don't see it.

1. Acura has never suceeded at selling cars over 40k. They just cannot command those prices. Even a 42k RL is a hard sell. This new RL is a very good car yet lost in the shuffle. The majority of people want brand and image and style at this price. So maybe just stop trying.

2. You can begin throwing value out the door the higher priced a car is. Value is great in the 25-35k range, in the 45k+ range, its not about value, people can afford what they want and could care less about value. BMW sells 189hp 525s at 45k at a rate of 1800 a month.

3. The lack of a V-8. Please name to me any serious contender in this class without this option. How about the past 10 years? They all offer a V-8. At 50k, it starts to be about excess. I don't care if your V-6 has 500hp, in the luxury market the smoothness and quiet and torque of a V-8 is what DEFINES the class. Name a true luxury brand without a V-8. You can't b/c there is no such thing.

4. Bascially the flagship sedan of Acura's line, is the equivilent to a AWD GS/M/5/E 4matic. Think about that for a second. No V-8, no higher level car. On the other hand, Acura saturates the market with value sub 35k cars which will expand with the upcoming RD-X. When you start dropping 50k coin on a car, you don't want to be sitting in the dealer next to 1,000 Integra and RSX owners. You also notice that the perks are pretty much no different than a Honda dealer. You realize you might have a luxury car, but not a luxury brand.

5. The name. To this day, I don't care what everyone else does, they should have kept the name LEGEND. I am CONFIDENT, if they used the name Legend, sales would lift 20% on the brand name. Yes, its a shame that the name Legend means more than Acura but its life. If you talk to people and say "Acura Legend" everyone knows what car your talking about. You say Acura RL and the look of confusion as well as the clueless look on peoples' faces is amusing.


6. Clealry, there is a small market for it, they are selling a few of them. SO maybe just lower production and expectations and ACCEPT your niche. A lot of people don't want flashy looking cars, a lot of people are loyal to Honda, a lot of people like the tech and like the fact there are pretty much no options, makes the buying easier. So maybe Honda should just realize their management has no clue what true luxury is, and sell over 200k cars a year as an entry level brand and live with it.

7. JPA had the best idea in another thread, its too late for them. IF they want to compete, they need to create another brand, a true luxury brand.

8. The TL is just a great car for the money and if you read the Acura forums, Acura has a huge problem. Very, very few TL owners respect or see the RL as truly superior. And they have a case. Now if you look at other brands, you cannot say that. The more expensive car is CLEARLY the better car than its cheaper sibling.


All in all, didn't I say this? Didn't I say things will ONLY get worse for this car. The signs were there;
1. They didn't meet 1st year sales expectations
2, Sales were declining in fall month after month.
3. Looking around car forums (BMW, Benz, Lexus, Nisaan, ACura, Audi etc), the RL didn't win much anyone over. The conclusion was it was a good car, possibly the best Acura ever but styling was blah and not many would buy it over what their favorite brand is offereing.

This is a good car. It won a 10 best award and places well in comparisons (except hte Automobile one). But against BRANDS, it will lose everytime.


Finally, the MAIN arguement for the RL is, you do get a awesomely loaded car for 50k. That is the point of the car.

You start selling it not loaded for less and well, whats the point?

TL anyone?

 

Among flagships, the Saab 9-5 and Volvo S80 do not have V8 engines, but of course, it can be debated whether those two are true " luxury " cars or not.

I agree the Legend name should have been kept......along with the Integra.

Having reviewed both cars I feel the RL is FAR superior to the TL in almost every way....but I respect other opinons.......yours especially.

 

From what's being reported, you get to take the S80 off that list as the next gen is supposed to get a Yamaha built or tweaked V8 I believe. Saab 9-5? The General seems to be bound and determined to kill a once good marque here.

 

You know if you go back to the nasty threads about the RL, I have to agree that I am one of those people who just had a hard time with it at 50K. And we are not even talking about 50K today but for several years. I have a feeling that the very attractive pricing that Acura put in last year didn't increase sales as much as they had hoped, and that was for the fully loaded vehicle. Maybe it is that the rest of the line doesn't let the RL shine, I don't know. If that's the case, maybe Honda has to figure out what they want Acura to be, not just one model. Who knows, maybe that will help, maybe it won't. But decontenting may or may not make sense. If they go with a FWD model to knock some price off I am not sure what market they will then be going for. As for deleting navi, until all the gottahaves out there will quit buying what they are peddling now and force the OEMs, yes even including Lexus in my mind, to charge for navi what it is worth instead of this ridiculous $3K, I am not sure Acura will want to get rid of that much profit per car.

 

I've heard the V8 S80 rumors too.....we'll wait and see.

As far as the General killing off the Saab 9-5, Saab's have never had V8's to start with....you can't kill what never existed. Only the recently introduced 9-7X has a V8 option........a GM 5.3L......and that is not a true Saab but a Chevy-designed SUV with a couple of Saab touches.

Keep in mind that I'm not arguing with 1SICKLEX or denying what he said......I basically agree with him that Acura's lack of a V8 is hurting their image. It's just that have a DAMN good substitute for a V8, that's all.