Last weekend, I test drive both a 750LI and MB S550.

Both cars have the stupid "I-Drive" or "Command" joystick/mouse which you have to move.

Being that both cars are higher in price compared to the LS, why don't the German auto makers install touch screen Navigation systems?

Why so cheap?

Do they understand that using a stick/mouse is not easy. Touch screen is the way to go?

You they don't use touch screen because of cost?

What's your opinion?

You'll get both sides debating on this. There are pros and cons to the touch-screen Nav, such as ease of use, but fingerprints and driving hazards while reaching for the screen.

It isn't about being cheap. It may actually be more expensive to create a Nav screen and a joystick/rotary device. It's a matter of philosophy...

VW was developing a touchscreen system which also incorporated tactile feedback...but I don't know if this is in the same 'far off' realm as hydrogen vehicles, etc.

IMO, touchscreen is the way to go. :thumbup:

May be be a little hard to have to touch the screen at the height and depth it's at on both the BMW and MB compared the Lexus.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by tactile feedback, but they already have portable navs where the screen gives you a little "bump" to your fingers any time you press a button on the screen... so that you know you've pressed it. I tried it out at Best Buy and thought it was pretty cool.

Don't most people do almost everything by voice command now anyway? I know I do.

VW was developing a touchscreen system which also incorporated tactile feedback...but I don't know if this is in the same 'far off' realm as hydrogen vehicles, etc.

IMO, touchscreen is the way to go. :thumbup:
Alpine has had that for a few years now. I have that on my Alpine touch screen monitor headunit. Alpine calls it "Pulse Touch" where you get a pulse feeback that mimmicks a button being pressed. It works okay. Smaller buttons give less feeback so those do't really feel realistic, but larger buttons seem to go an acceptable job of recreating the button feel.

May be be a little hard to have to touch the screen at the height and depth it's at on both the BMW and MB compared the Lexus.

That could very well be a possibility. For example. Acura uses both touch screen and joystick on their nav system. The TL is touch, but the RL is not. If you look at where the nav screen is on the RL it would be a little difficult to reach. I personally like when companies put the screen as high up and back as possible. For me it just makes it easier to see without turning my head too much away from the road. I kind of like that line of sight position.

That could very well be a possibility. For example. Acura uses both touch screen and joystick on their nav system. The TL is touch, but the RL is not. If you look at where the nav screen is on the RL it would be a little difficult to reach. I personally like when companies put the screen as high up and back as possible. For me it just makes it easier to see without turning my head too much away from the road. I kind of like that line of sight position.
The EU now requires that nav screens be put within a certain degree from the drivers view for that very reason.

I think MB/BMW's philosophy is that the driver shouldn't have to 'reach out' to touch the screen to do stuff. This kind of makes sense. Touch screens are fun geek technology, but many 'non-techies' still have trouble with it.

Granted, if a 'user' can't handle a touch screen they probably can't handle iDrive, MMI, or COMAND. :p

Voice commands over time may become the 'easiest'.

The EU now requires that nav screens be put within a certain degree from the drivers view for that very reason.

Do you happen to know what the degree is? Tha is good. I've always liked them that way. There are still diffrences between manufacturers so it would be interesting to see what the allowable off axis specs are.

Do you happen to know what the degree is? Tha is good. I've always liked them that way. There are still diffrences between manufacturers so it would be interesting to see what the allowable off axis specs are.
I'm not sure. I don't even have solid evidence of the new regulations. Let me go find out.


Edit/Add: Eh, that site is so huge. This might take a while. I remember a while ago in some auto magazine like Motor Trend or something. They had a short article on the S-Classes new Night Vision and showing off the new stuff. It mentioned the EU and the regulations. I think it was in 2005 when they started to debut the S-Class.

I think MB/BMW's philosophy is that the driver shouldn't have to 'reach out' to touch the screen to do stuff. This kind of makes sense. Touch screens are fun geek technology, but many 'non-techies' still have trouble with it.

Granted, if a 'user' can't handle a touch screen they probably can't handle iDrive, MMI, or COMAND. :p

Voice commands over time may become the 'easiest'.

Yeah. I think touching a screen that spells out the letters in big blocks is much easier than scrolling through them with a roller or a joystick. Touchscreen is much more intuitive honestly.

"Don't fix something that ain't broke" has a paired phrase: "Don't invent something that works like it's broken" (i-Drive)

ive been saying it but someone needs to combine the 2 technologies together. It would be practical to have a touchscreen to input letters and numbers, but a scroll wheel type thing for the menus. Having an ipod, i like the scroll option when scrolling through menus, songs, decreasing and increase stuff. So yah theres my 2 cents.

doesnt matter all that much nowadays since voice command is getting better and better

the new S apparently has kick ass voice recognition

doesnt matter all that much nowadays since voice command is getting better and better

the new S apparently has kick ass voice recognition
very good point. i know bmw has pretty good ones already, and the new s class seems to have much improved ones too.

for jdm, acura has some of the best voice recognition system out there imho. the ones lexus have so far, honestly, it's a bit subpar. i don't find the system on my sc430 particularly impressive....

but about touch screen and not, i agree it has a lot to do with locations. the locations where bmw and mb put their navs (especially the new models), it's too far. just like the is300, it doesn't have touch screen coz' it's way too far to reach. all other lexus models are very easy to reach.

in any case, starting next gen i think voice is going to start to take over anyway

the new infinity G35's LCD nav screen and the cursor buttons are set quite deep into the plastic trim making it even harder to reach and use

but this is all because the improvements of voice recognition nowadays

http://www.newswheel.com/files/Infiniti/G35/10-2007-infiniti-g35-sedan.jpg

i have to say though, the directional buttons on the old 2005 S class was very hard to use when typing in address
took me forever just to move the cursor to the right alphabet and select it

Last weekend, I test drive both a 750LI and MB S550.

Both cars have the stupid "I-Drive" or "Command" joystick/mouse which you have to move.

Being that both cars are higher in price compared to the LS, why don't the German auto makers install touch screen Navigation systems?

Why so cheap?

Do they understand that using a stick/mouse is not easy. Touch screen is the way to go?

You they don't use touch screen because of cost?

What's your opinion?
They r placing their faith in I-drive and the like systems........

Last weekend, I test drive both a 750LI and MB S550.

Both cars have the stupid "I-Drive" or "Command" joystick/mouse which you have to move.

Being that both cars are higher in price compared to the LS, why don't the German auto makers install touch screen Navigation systems?

Why so cheap?

Do they understand that using a stick/mouse is not easy. Touch screen is the way to go?

You they don't use touch screen because of cost?

What's your opinion?

It's not technology nor cost issue.

It depends on what each company perceive as more important. Have screen close to your sight but out of reach, or have it closer within your reach, but further away from your eyesight.

Each one has its benefit and issues. Although I do prefer touch screen better.

Yeah. I think touching a screen that spells out the letters in big blocks is much easier than scrolling through them with a roller or a joystick. Touchscreen is much more intuitive honestly.

"Don't fix something that ain't broke" has a paired phrase: "Don't invent something that works like it's broken" (i-Drive)

Very true - if you are sitting still. But if you are moving, the touch screen requires more eye time away from the road and the ultimate goal with a tactle feedback system like i-drive was to allow the driver to focus better on driving and less time looking at the dash and/or touch screen. Let's be honest here, it is a 1.0 version (well 2.0 now) and has a long way to go - but it is a step in the right direction. I can honestly say this is true .... after having both systems. Is it more intuitive? No way! Does it allow the driver to spend more time looking at the road? You bet (but you have to learn it first).

having owned an 06 GS and now a 330 i really am impressed at how far BMW has come w/ their idrive. within an hour of my short tutorial at the dealership, i was banging away at the thing no sweat. The NAV and other command features are accessible to the driver while the car is in motion, I HATED that you couldnt on the GS or the RRS. i bet you that has to do w/ the fact that w/ touch screen as others have said, your eyes are off the road longer? than if you were scrolling and clicking.

oh and the dam bt on the 330 is crazy...i have a verizon razr and within 15 secs of being paired ALL my 300+ number/names uploaded and voice dial works great on it as well.