o_man_76-Horrible Buyer
02-09-07, 02:33 PM
#1
o_man_76-Horrible Buyer
Now I was going to keep this confidential and strictly through PM, but after receiving threat of defamation by 0_man_76, I feel the need to put this out on the CL table for review and comments.
I was recently posting a For Sale Ad for a Focal Utopia speaker set about a week back. I received PM from the above mentioned who was interested in the deal.
Here is the inital negotiation:
01-31-07, 12:34 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm very meticulous about things being perfect. Even though the rubber surround isn't torn, bottom line is that it ain't perfect. On that note I'm still interested in making an offer to purchase your speakers. $250 shipping and PayPal fee included. Let me know.
Since he was a local CL member, I offered to do a local cash only pickup so that the speakers would be safely transported by myself, and inspected by him in the 1st person.
Here is my insistence on a local pickup and an offer for more detailed pictures. WHICH HE DID NOT ASK FOR AND I WAS MORE THAN HAPPY TO OFFER TO HIM FOR A MORE METICULOUS REVIEW.
01-31-07, 01:30 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm in Riverside County, I'll be in Whitttier on Super Sunday. Let me know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PushinLEX
Hmmmmmmm, let me think about that bid. I can send you more pics if you'd like. Where in Cali are you located? If you are close to the Los Angeles area, we can arrange a cash pickup. The pics online do NOT do the speakers justice. They are much better in person...
02-01-07, 11:01 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll let you know tomorrow if I'll be able to meet up with you in person to buy the speakers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PushinLEX
I'll be in downtown Los Angeles
at my friends BBQ this Sunday for Super Bowl. Call me up and let me know if you want to meet me there. Of course, I can always ship it if u want....
Its your call as of now.
Chris: (310) 985-4308
This next quote specifies that he wants me to ship:
02-03-07, 07:50 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 FW: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by o_man_76
Won't have time to meet up, so go ahead and ship. My address:
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
(EDITED FOR PRIVACY)
What is your PayPal, I'll be sending payment of $250.
That being said, he promptly sent payment the next day in the sum total of $250.00 via paypal. I packed the speakers very tightly(the original Focal speaker box has TWO sets of packaging)and filled in the rest with newspaper for damping material.
Within 24 hrs of payment received, I sent the package via DHL Ground Service (no insurance) and gave him a tracking number asap. He received the shipment the next day. Then I receive this message:
Yesterday, 11:51 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The speakers arrived this morning. I hope you bought insurance because one of the speakers is damaged. The phase plug from one of the mids is broken off. I signed for the package because there was no visible damage.
I'm assuming that you were unaware of this. There is some other damage that wasn't mentioned previously. The ring or lip on one tweeter housing is seperating and there is a crease on the cone of one mid. These were not noticeable from the pics. Please advise on what to do.
[quote=PushinLEX]DHL Tracking Number: 866-6851-664
Shipment sent out today. Don't be alarmed that the package is arriving in a Kove Audio box, its the only box i could find that size. The contents are still Focal....
Chris
Now this is where is gets a bit hairy. I initially decided on refunding his money (minus 3% paypal fee and shipping charges), but decided that I wanted to see picture evidence of the damage before we could end this transaction in an civil manner.
Today, 12:44 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm very disappointed with this transaction. I'm even more upset that your penalizing me for the packaging and shipping, which I had no control over. You decided how to package the speakers and you chose the courrier(DHL). The fact they arrived damaged is not my fault and you should take that up with DHL and demand to get reimbursed. Your the seller and should take full responsibility for this transaction. I'm expecting a full refund, nothing more and nothing less.
[quote=PushinLEX]I was NOT aware of the damaged phase plug or the crease in the cone. The tweeter housing (the metal piece) was bent from de-installation but I figured was easily replacable. You can see the difference in the up close tweeter picture. I tried to pack as much newspaper in the box to prevent damage, so I'm not sure what happened.
If you are not satisfied with the speakers, please ship them back to me (at your expense), and I will refund your paypal (minus the $7.xx paypal fee).
Let me know your course of action.
Chris: (310) 985-4308
More argumentation:
Today, 01:10 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a statement taken from your ad that you wrote. "Taking $275.00 FIRM plus shipping and 3% paypal fee. Locals can pick up for the principal price."
From that statement it's obvious that you were willing to ship regardless of where the buyer was located. I appreciate the fact that you were willing to meet, but it wasn't convenient at the time. It's not like it was down the street. The fact that you lowered your price was ultimately your decision. You can see from the pics(check your email) what the unmentioned damage is. The only damage that was dicussed was of the rubber surround. Your description on the speakers stated that they were in "Great condition", which they are not. I'll be returning the speakers and expect a full refund within 24 hrs. of them being delivered and signed for. The bottom line is I received a product from you that is inferior to what we negotiated on.
[quote=PushinLEX]I'm a bit irritated now. Look at the discourse below. I specifically asked to arrange a LOCAL CASH PICK UP with you before anything else. I did this so I could carefully transport the speakers myself and have you inspect the speakers yourself to make sure all is well. YOU were the one who request the shipping course of action, not me. So please don't point your finger at me. I was the one who was nice enough to agree to your lower price bid and stomach the loss in paypal fees and shipping (which I have already paid for). I did not insure the package, but I will call DHL.
Please at least do me the courtesy to send pics of the damage you mentioned.
Chris
Me standing my ground, and him threatening defamation of my character on this board:
Today, 01:45 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, that's how you sent them. First you agree to take them back and now you change your mind. Have it your way. Not only am I going to notify PayPal, I'm also going to post a review of this transaction on Club Lexus so everyone will know what kind of seller your are.
[quote=PushinLEX]You got to be kidding me man. What the hell happened to my speakers? I'm not accepting this. If you want to take this to paypal for a contest. Please do. This is unacceptable.
Chris
Last quote: Pretty self-explanatatory.
Private Message: Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
Today, 02:01 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We'll let PayPal decide the outcome of this transaction. I wonder who will be in favor of the outcome?
[quote=PushinLEX]I signed for the package because there was no visible damage.
There was no visible damage was there? One of the center cones is decapitated. I was willing to give you a refund, but after seeing the pictures, there is no way I can salvage these speakers. If you had refused to sign, and DHL notified me, I would definitely have known that fault could be blamed on the courier, or myself.
That was not the case. For all I know, you did all the damage yourself, and DHL had no responsiblity.
Go ahead and post. I did my part, gave you pictures and a discount. Shipped in 1 day with a tracking number. And you send me pictures of my speakers, completely destroyed. Not acceptable. Please post in the Buyer/Seller Feedback section.
Chris
Nicholas, please feel free to retort. As of right now, paypal will end this issue.
I was recently posting a For Sale Ad for a Focal Utopia speaker set about a week back. I received PM from the above mentioned who was interested in the deal.
Here is the inital negotiation:
01-31-07, 12:34 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm very meticulous about things being perfect. Even though the rubber surround isn't torn, bottom line is that it ain't perfect. On that note I'm still interested in making an offer to purchase your speakers. $250 shipping and PayPal fee included. Let me know.
Since he was a local CL member, I offered to do a local cash only pickup so that the speakers would be safely transported by myself, and inspected by him in the 1st person.
Here is my insistence on a local pickup and an offer for more detailed pictures. WHICH HE DID NOT ASK FOR AND I WAS MORE THAN HAPPY TO OFFER TO HIM FOR A MORE METICULOUS REVIEW.
01-31-07, 01:30 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm in Riverside County, I'll be in Whitttier on Super Sunday. Let me know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PushinLEX
Hmmmmmmm, let me think about that bid. I can send you more pics if you'd like. Where in Cali are you located? If you are close to the Los Angeles area, we can arrange a cash pickup. The pics online do NOT do the speakers justice. They are much better in person...
02-01-07, 11:01 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll let you know tomorrow if I'll be able to meet up with you in person to buy the speakers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PushinLEX
I'll be in downtown Los Angeles
at my friends BBQ this Sunday for Super Bowl. Call me up and let me know if you want to meet me there. Of course, I can always ship it if u want....
Its your call as of now.
Chris: (310) 985-4308
This next quote specifies that he wants me to ship:
02-03-07, 07:50 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 FW: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by o_man_76
Won't have time to meet up, so go ahead and ship. My address:
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXX
(EDITED FOR PRIVACY)
What is your PayPal, I'll be sending payment of $250.
That being said, he promptly sent payment the next day in the sum total of $250.00 via paypal. I packed the speakers very tightly(the original Focal speaker box has TWO sets of packaging)and filled in the rest with newspaper for damping material.
Within 24 hrs of payment received, I sent the package via DHL Ground Service (no insurance) and gave him a tracking number asap. He received the shipment the next day. Then I receive this message:
Yesterday, 11:51 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The speakers arrived this morning. I hope you bought insurance because one of the speakers is damaged. The phase plug from one of the mids is broken off. I signed for the package because there was no visible damage.
I'm assuming that you were unaware of this. There is some other damage that wasn't mentioned previously. The ring or lip on one tweeter housing is seperating and there is a crease on the cone of one mid. These were not noticeable from the pics. Please advise on what to do.[quote=PushinLEX]DHL Tracking Number: 866-6851-664
Shipment sent out today. Don't be alarmed that the package is arriving in a Kove Audio box, its the only box i could find that size. The contents are still Focal....
Chris
Now this is where is gets a bit hairy. I initially decided on refunding his money (minus 3% paypal fee and shipping charges), but decided that I wanted to see picture evidence of the damage before we could end this transaction in an civil manner.
Today, 12:44 AM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm very disappointed with this transaction. I'm even more upset that your penalizing me for the packaging and shipping, which I had no control over. You decided how to package the speakers and you chose the courrier(DHL). The fact they arrived damaged is not my fault and you should take that up with DHL and demand to get reimbursed. Your the seller and should take full responsibility for this transaction. I'm expecting a full refund, nothing more and nothing less.
[quote=PushinLEX]I was NOT aware of the damaged phase plug or the crease in the cone. The tweeter housing (the metal piece) was bent from de-installation but I figured was easily replacable. You can see the difference in the up close tweeter picture. I tried to pack as much newspaper in the box to prevent damage, so I'm not sure what happened.
If you are not satisfied with the speakers, please ship them back to me (at your expense), and I will refund your paypal (minus the $7.xx paypal fee).
Let me know your course of action.
Chris: (310) 985-4308
More argumentation:
Today, 01:10 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a statement taken from your ad that you wrote. "Taking $275.00 FIRM plus shipping and 3% paypal fee. Locals can pick up for the principal price."
From that statement it's obvious that you were willing to ship regardless of where the buyer was located. I appreciate the fact that you were willing to meet, but it wasn't convenient at the time. It's not like it was down the street. The fact that you lowered your price was ultimately your decision. You can see from the pics(check your email) what the unmentioned damage is. The only damage that was dicussed was of the rubber surround. Your description on the speakers stated that they were in "Great condition", which they are not. I'll be returning the speakers and expect a full refund within 24 hrs. of them being delivered and signed for. The bottom line is I received a product from you that is inferior to what we negotiated on.
[quote=PushinLEX]I'm a bit irritated now. Look at the discourse below. I specifically asked to arrange a LOCAL CASH PICK UP with you before anything else. I did this so I could carefully transport the speakers myself and have you inspect the speakers yourself to make sure all is well. YOU were the one who request the shipping course of action, not me. So please don't point your finger at me. I was the one who was nice enough to agree to your lower price bid and stomach the loss in paypal fees and shipping (which I have already paid for). I did not insure the package, but I will call DHL.
Please at least do me the courtesy to send pics of the damage you mentioned.
Chris
Me standing my ground, and him threatening defamation of my character on this board:
Today, 01:45 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You tell me, that's how you sent them. First you agree to take them back and now you change your mind. Have it your way. Not only am I going to notify PayPal, I'm also going to post a review of this transaction on Club Lexus so everyone will know what kind of seller your are.
[quote=PushinLEX]You got to be kidding me man. What the hell happened to my speakers? I'm not accepting this. If you want to take this to paypal for a contest. Please do. This is unacceptable.
Chris
Last quote: Pretty self-explanatatory.
Private Message: Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
Today, 02:01 PM
o_man_76
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 9 Re: Focal Utopia Mids & TN51 Tweeters
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We'll let PayPal decide the outcome of this transaction. I wonder who will be in favor of the outcome?
[quote=PushinLEX]I signed for the package because there was no visible damage.
There was no visible damage was there? One of the center cones is decapitated. I was willing to give you a refund, but after seeing the pictures, there is no way I can salvage these speakers. If you had refused to sign, and DHL notified me, I would definitely have known that fault could be blamed on the courier, or myself.
That was not the case. For all I know, you did all the damage yourself, and DHL had no responsiblity.
Go ahead and post. I did my part, gave you pictures and a discount. Shipped in 1 day with a tracking number. And you send me pictures of my speakers, completely destroyed. Not acceptable. Please post in the Buyer/Seller Feedback section.
Chris
Nicholas, please feel free to retort. As of right now, paypal will end this issue.
02-16-07, 01:21 PM
#3
Just to give you guys an update on this situation. The dispute was escalated to a claim, which was reviewed by a paypal dispute specialist in the Resolution Center.
I win!
Dispute History Log - Most Recent 5 of 9 Last 5 Show All
The Dispute History Log displays all actions related to your claim.
Date Actor Action Details
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Case closed.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Does not comply with filing policies.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Email sent to Seller.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Email sent to Buyer.
Feb. 9, 2007 Seller Escalated Dispute to a Claim.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total Messages: 4
From PayPal: PayPal on 2/9/2007 14:40 PST
Seller escalated this dispute to a Claim.
From seller: Christopher Kim on 2/9/2007 14:40 PST
Please refer to the initial dispute message. I will be happy to provide any and all evidence of claim, courier service and/or tracking number/release signature. Pictures are also available. Thank you, Chris
From seller: Christopher Kim on 2/9/2007 14:37 PST
Detailed pictures were send via online forum www.clublexus.com. Agreed price was reached, tracking number provided (DHL Ground Service: 866-6851-664)and shipment was received by buyer in one business day. Buyer signed release form provided by DHL courier, signifying no visible damage seen and thus assumed responsibility of product.
From buyer: Nicolas Ostos on 2/9/2007 13:44 PST
The items you sent me were delivered to me damaged. I'm asking for a full refund because I received items that are inferior to what we negitiated on.
I win!
Dispute History Log - Most Recent 5 of 9 Last 5 Show All
The Dispute History Log displays all actions related to your claim.
Date Actor Action Details
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Case closed.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Does not comply with filing policies.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Email sent to Seller.
Feb. 9, 2007 PayPal Email sent to Buyer.
Feb. 9, 2007 Seller Escalated Dispute to a Claim.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total Messages: 4
From PayPal: PayPal on 2/9/2007 14:40 PST
Seller escalated this dispute to a Claim.
From seller: Christopher Kim on 2/9/2007 14:40 PST
Please refer to the initial dispute message. I will be happy to provide any and all evidence of claim, courier service and/or tracking number/release signature. Pictures are also available. Thank you, Chris
From seller: Christopher Kim on 2/9/2007 14:37 PST
Detailed pictures were send via online forum www.clublexus.com. Agreed price was reached, tracking number provided (DHL Ground Service: 866-6851-664)and shipment was received by buyer in one business day. Buyer signed release form provided by DHL courier, signifying no visible damage seen and thus assumed responsibility of product.
From buyer: Nicolas Ostos on 2/9/2007 13:44 PST
The items you sent me were delivered to me damaged. I'm asking for a full refund because I received items that are inferior to what we negitiated on.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
