LexFinally

"Supply and demand" is not some natural law unchangeable by humans. The reason that "the demand for labor talent in the US is much less than it once was" is because our corporations successfully bribed our government officials to allow manufacturing to be exported to Mexican and Chinese sweatshops. You praise this because it "efficiently" inflates corporate profits. I condemn it because it gutted the livelihoods of millions of Americans. I don't find "let them eat cake and learn coding" a sufficient answer. You do.

SW17LS

Sorry, thats ridiculous. We live in a world economy, and we have to compete on the world stage. Companies can't pay people more than is reasonable for their position just out of the goodness of their hearts. Do you pay the person who cleans your house $150 an hour? Of course not, you pay what is a reasonable amount of money compared to what other similar people are being paid.

We don't "allow" manufacturing to be exported...we live in a free society where people and companies do what the best thing for them is. If you want to go live in a country where wages are propped up by the government then there are countries you can go live in where thats the case. If you want manufacturers to keep manufacturing here then you need to support policies that provide tax breaks or credits to companies for keeping their manufacturing here. Otherwise, they will and should take their manufacturing to where it makes more business sense for them.

"Supply and demand" is a business reality in a free market. When you "change that" you are creating an artificial market.

LexFinally

Sorrry, THAT'S ridiculous.

•"We don't "allow" manufacturing to be exported." Yes, that's exactly what we do. Are you too young or too unread to have ever heard of NAFTA? It was the corporate-driven treaty that explicity—paying attention here?—allowed manufacturing to be exported. That was not an inevitability. It was a political choice.

•"'Supply and demand' is a business reality in a free market." Do you sincerely believe that the American economy is a "free market"? We subsidize some industries (like oil and airlines) and cripple others (like independent competitors to government-backed oligopolies like Big Pharma). We make policy choices like Fed interest-rate hikes that distort economic behavior on purpose. We provide tax breaks (you admitted that yourself, right here—remember?) specifically to distort the "free market" in the direction of the chosen outcomes. America is no more a "free market" than China, the EU, or pretty much anyplace else. It's a fiction like "America is a beacon of freedom" or "Columbus discovered the New World" that is easily disproved on even minimal adult intellectual curiosity, and exists only to justify the continued power of the powerful.

You disguise your lack of knowledge — maybe oblivious by accident, maybe blind on purpose — behind platitudes like these. Here's a truth you refuse to recognize: F. Scott Fitzgerald said, "The rich are not like the rest of us." Ernest Hemingway replied, "Yes, they have more money."

SW17LS

Not going to get into a pissing match with you lol, I will ask again, how many businesses do you own and how many employees do you have? If it’s more than 2 and 28 then we’ll talk.

Manufacturing could be taken offshore before NAFTA, and China and Korea etc are not a part of NAFTA. All NAFTA did was eliminate tariffs which made it easier. Not going to get dragged into a political debate either. We clearly have different viewpoints on this and we will leave it at that.

mmarshall

It looks like a Canadian UNIFOR strike against GM will be settled. Workers approved a new contract.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu...e/71195861007/

This, of course, will not affect strikes in the U.S., but will prevent the strikes from spreading further (and lasting longer) into Canada.

LexFinally

Because your claim that you were already an employer at 22, indicating you were born into privilege, proves that you can **** farther?

Fun Fact: At the dawn of our Republic, only those who owned property were granted the right to vote. At some point, that rule was changed. Adjust accordingly.

And, "all NAFTA did was make it easier." And so, much more of it suddenly began to happen. Thank you kindly for making my point for me.

LexFinally

Then, I assume you treat all your 28 employees with the same dismissive disrespect, since none of them owns a company or has any employees either. Wonder how that affects their attitude toward working for you. Wonder if you'd even know. You don't seem like a big listener.

SW17LS

So the answer to "How many businesses and employees do you have?" is Zero. Shocker.

I love my employees and they love working for us, but I don't pay wages that are outside of what the prevailing labor market dictates, no responsible business owner would. You can go out and start your own business and pay people the wages they WANT not what they DESERVE and see how long you stay in business.

All of this is great in some think tank or in a university classroom, but when you're out in the world actually responsible for running a business that people depend on for their livelihood and that you also depend on for your family's livelihood you have a different perspective.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Sw17LS, exit this thread. No need for the personal comments and dismissive posts

Lexfinally, also exit this thread. Also posting personal responses and political / debate content.

situman

Both sides cant have their cake and eat it too. They need an adult in the room.

LeX2K

"Eat the rich" union guy doesn't strike me as a reasonable person.

mmarshall

That's the whole reason for the strike to start with....the manufacturers have been getting most of the cake. Time to at least share it a little.

Margate330

Hi mmarshall, do you think the strike demands are reasonable?

I'm not sure if they are or aren't but just wondering what you think of the progress of where this is going.

LeX2K

What cake? GM went bankrupt Ford almost did. Chrysler is no longer an American company. UAW workers sure have the Midas touch don't they.

mmarshall

Set your clock, Lex. We're talking about conditions today, not 15 years ago when GM and Chrysler were in such deep trouble.