SW17LS

You're only focusing on the powertrains.

This is a JDM Celsior from 1990:





Current model ES from Bahrain with power and massaging rear seats:

Allen K

iTrader: (4)

I'm very jealous of some of those executive seating packages they get in the Asian and Middle Eastern markets. Granted, I'm the driver so I wouldn't be able to enjoy them but they are cool

geko29

I think you're conflating "Expensive" and "Overpriced". Expensive is a relative term, and subject to individual value judgements. Overpriced is an economic term, which means something is so expensive that the seller is losing out on potential revenue, because the additional margin is eaten up and then some by lower volume. Ie if they were to lower the price, they would make more money overall because of the large increase in unit volume.

I'll give you a non-car example. Yesterday, I bought a superautomatic espresso machine. This vendor's top selling model for over a decade is currently $2500. That's expensive by almost anyone's definition. But the fact that it's their top-selling model--and particularly that it's usually the 3rd or 4th bestselling model, regardless of brand, even though some competitors are <$600--means that it's not overpriced. The one I bought was 2 models up from that, and is even more expensive. But I feel the incremental value of its featureset is worth the incremental cost. It is selling well, so it is also not overpriced.

Striker223

Haha! No! We need we get the true spec of anything here

Stroock639

very unfair, idk why toyota assumes nobody would care here... or maybe there was an absolute MSRP limit they were doing their best not to exceed

another example: in the early 90s you could get a toyota mobile FAX machine in your celsior!

AJT123

$22 not including tip for a small plastic cup with no celery or olives and a just ok drink isn't overpriced?? We live on different planets. Is there anything in the world that's overpriced or "too expensive" for what it is?? I can name plenty of stuff. CVS is overpriced, just about everything in there. There's an independent grocery store down the street that is outrageously overpriced but people pay it. Red Lobster is really overpriced but I still go every now and then.

Another example: Disney is extremely overpriced, and the cost actually does prevent many from going. I know people personally who couldn't afford it. It's unfortunate because every child should see Disney World. My mother told me that in the late 80s when she took me it wasn't cheap but it wasn't outrageous, nothing like now.

SW17LS

And note that 1LS has a navigation screen!

You don't understand. Read this:

No, if people pay the prices its not overpriced. Disney is PACKED, to capacity. So no, a Disney vacation is not overpriced. You may feel these things are too expensive for you to spend your money on them, but they are not economically overpriced because consumers do pay their prices.

Stroock639

being an avid skiing fan, around this time of the year that's what i point to for being overpriced... i was up at Sugarbush in VT this most recent weekend and the crowds (or rather somewhat lack of) would be evidence of this

the more accurate statement would be that single day tickets have become overpriced, there are absolutely fewer people buying them (nearly $200 per day at times!!!) since resorts are all pushing toward season passes and more long term tickets... which absolutely make more sense if you go skiing fairly often, otherwise for someone who just decides lets go skiing tomorrow you'll be forking over some serious dough

Toys4RJill

You’ve provided an excellent example, and I don’t disagree with you. For example, the Lexus LX470 I owned did not come with the cool box. But, the point I am making is that Japan Toyota imports to the US usually get the top spec models, and that almost always starts with the powertrain.

For example, the Lexus LS460 in specific markets received only the 2UR-FE whereas the United States received the 2UR-FSE engine. Same thing the GS, when the US updated to the 3.5 V6 and the 4.6 V8, most other markets kept the outgoing I6 and UZ motor. GX470 and LX570 were predominantly USA spec only…there are many examples of this, the 2UZ 4.7 Reciever engine updated long for the US models where outside of the US, the 2UZ received these updates later… 100% there will be instances where other markets are packaged in a different way with options not available in the US spec, but almost across fhe US receives the full spec powertrain and I cannot think of any instance where the US did receive the full spec powertrain that was available elsewhere.

‘A few other examples come to mind, the Lexus LS600h never made it to the US whereas the full Lexus 600hl did. The fourth generation Supra was available with any turbo whereas the US spec received the twin turbo option. (Perhaps the Supra a few exclusive options that were not in the US spec)


here are some features in the ES that US does not receive






Back to the Land Cruiser 250…

‘the US gets the top spec powertrain. Perhaps there might be a few features in the non-hybrid version that you can’t get in the US, but if you don’t have the full spec powertrain, what difference does that make?



there is a 48V diesel there too…and Toyota has a hot vee V6 diesel too





here is the LS350

SW17LS

Thats only true if the powertrain is the only feature you're looking at.

Striker223

It's not too because in Japan you can get the true top spec. Same way I had to import a bunch of stuff for my W12 you would need to import stuff for an LS

Toys4RJill

this colour just doesn’t work on this model.





Ferrari had a lot of cars at the show





@AJT123 this truck had a column shifter

for some reason. Ford hoods were sealed closed. They wouldn’t let you open the hood

IMO, new Ford Mustang was a huge let down. The Dark Horse was there as well as the convertible and one other. Apparently the chassis is not all new, it’s a carry over

AJT123

The new Ram is out. The highest priced trim the Tungsten is $90,000.

540hp from 3.0 liters, sort of insane. Can’t wait to see how this new Hurricane engine holds up and how much people like it.

I-6 is wayyyyyy better than V6. There’s that, at least.

I don’t care for the styling, it’s just too bland.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a45753248/2025-ram-1500-refresh-details/

Toys4RJill

I will say, the GM trucks and especially the RAM blows the Tundra out of the water. Like the interior is nowhere close. I’d saw the Tundra is a tier below…maybe even two tiers lower. Thats not good.

it really is cool that they have an in-line six.
a new V8 would still be superior

JDR76

Side note. Superautomatics will change your life. We're on our second. Both Saeco Xlesis models. OMG. Well worth the $2.5-3k.