Toys4RJill

Oh right. that is correct. Timing chain

Stroock639

something else to factor in here, i'd wager that the average toyota/lexus owner doesn't look after their car as well because the assumption of reliability is stronger... the maintenance is more likely to be neglected on a toyota/lexus

Toys4RJill

I bet Mercedes owners are more lacking on following scheduled maintenance than Toyota owners are. Especially the younger MB owners who buy them second hand.




I don’t think I have ever seen a Toyota having to replace the fuel filter ever 5 years or 60K

Do you really think MB onwers follow this?

mmarshall

Possibly not. Mercedes and Porsche are notorious for making you mortgage your house to get even basic vehicle-maintenance,




Under the right circumstances, in any vehicle, just one tankful of badly-contaminated fuel can plug up a fuel filter and make it useless.

Toys4RJill

I had said German cars cost more to run than other cars. I think I am right.

But that doesn't get away from the "Scheduled maintenance" of the Mercedes I posted. I bet most skip this service. (that doesn't exits on other brands)

geko29

You're probably not wrong about some services being skipped, but just because a thing isn't specified, doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. A fuel filter has a limited capacity for crap, and should be replaced at some interval (not saying 60k is the correct interval), regardless of brand. In validating your bolded statement (which does appear to be the case, btw), I found posts from folks who changed the "lifetime" fuel filter in their Toyotas at 100-150k, and reported that the fuel that poured out of the intake side looked "like mud". Some even posted pictures of their filter media after cutting it open, and they were pretty ugly. Probably changing it was the right idea, even though Toyota says it's not necessary.

In that regard, "skipping" the scheduled change on a Mercedes is much the same as not making an unscheduled change on a Toyota. You can probably get away with it on both brands. Right up until you can't.

But you see this stuff in various places. BMW claims that both their coolant and transmission fluid are "lifetime", and they clearly are not--in the case of the trans fluid, the actual manufacturer of the transmission specifies a change interval. Toyota makes the exact same bogus claims about their coolant and trans fluid. I change them because it's the right thing to do, even though the mfr doesn't tell me I have to. Others will make different choices.

Striker223

Oh yeah.....lord do they just lean on that reputation. Then they are shocked when it needs anything at all

Toys4RJill

I have never had to change a fuel filter in 30 years of Toyota/Lexus ownership. I have always just followed the scheduled maintenance recommendations. Although I have skipped on some items here and there

I don’t agree with this. for example, Mercedes claims that owners are supposed to change their brake fluid every two year…but a Lexus the brake fluid is supposed to be changed every three years… I think the manufacturer is right

I have heard this. But I have never seen the evidence

You are incorrect on the coolant part. My 4Runner for 2021 is 10 years and 120k and then after that, it’s always 5 years and 60K after the initial change. As per transmission oil, my SUVs say to change it if I tow or it if haul heavy loads

Would you change a timing chain? When the manufacturer never says to do it?

SW17LS

So a big difference between German cars insofar as maintenance is concerned and Lexus/Toyota is the Germans tend to require more maintenance than is required to keep the car running at peak performance, where with Lexus/Toyota they are more content to allow a level of diminished performance as the car ages. Hence spark plugs in my S560 at 50k miles, nobody who has replaced them has found they needed to be replaced, but Mercedes clearly found that performance tends to drop off after 50k miles so they recommend replacement at 50k miles.

You can likely never change the fuel filter on a Mercedes either...

Like was said before, all Toyota/Lexus specialists suggest maintaining those cars more frequently than the manufacturer recommends

Toys4RJill

Nice try and nice spin. Lexus and Toyota have spark plug intervals early like your S560 as well, but only when they are turbos. (or specific Toyotas that do not have long life plugs)....the naturally aspirated engines do not necessarily need the spark plugs changed for a long time (depending on the model) and this counts for some AMG products like the ML55

Striker223

Call Aisin or ZF and ask about the AA80E, A650E, 6HP, 8HP transmissions and see what the companies who actually make them think the correct service interval is. You can also find documentation from them if you don't want to call.

Timing chains fail often, I did 3 this last month and I have one coming in next week. If they have an issue then they need fixed. Simple as that. Toyotas fail less since they overbuild to account for owners not maintaining properly, same reason they have unusually high coolant capacity vs rival brands. That allows it to last longer when people without a doubt never service it since "it's a Toyota"

Striker223

Bingo. That's also because the Germans are trying to ensure the car retains its new performance like you said so that the cars can still perform at speed as expected.

Same reason the LS460 had a much shorter spark plug interval for the first year and shorter oil changes, but Lexus decided to lower total cost of ownership and "environmental fees" by moving many things to longer interval or "lifetime" specs.

A lot of fluid specs are lengthened due to that last one, the most telling proof is when you call the makers of the gear unit or look at the same engine in an industrial application. Intervals are drastically shorter

Striker223

Do you know how much stuff I had to replace on my Lexus cars for them to be able to hit factory specs? It was a lot, and most of it was not "needed" according to the maintenance suggestions

But hey, if you don't demand much or need much then if it drives it drives right?

Toys4RJill

Spark plug interval for the LS460 were the same for 2007-2017 years.

SW17LS

Its not spin, its the truth.

But you don't know how performance falls off after a certain point and if Lexus just figures its not a big deal. With turbocharged engines the performance losses are more pronounced, hence why they move the intervals up. Your argument though doesn't make sense, if Toyota required the same spark plug intervals as Mercedes for turbocharged engines, then the statement "the germans require more maintenance" wouldn't be true. Apples to Apples they would require the same maintenance.