General Car Conversation 2024 - part 1

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06-27-24, 09:40 AM

#5071

JDR76

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Quote:

Originally Posted by LH1

I think some kind of update during the 2GR-FSE life would have been better than doing nothing. I guess it's just a Japanese vs German mindset.

Could you imagine BMW coming out with the N54 in 2007 and doing nothing for 17 years? That would never happen.

Well to be fair, they did update it in 2016 when it went from the 2GR-FSE to the 2GR-FKS. I've had both and found the FKS to be a lot smoother and quieter. It's slightly more efficient with the inclusion of the Atkinson cycle under low load. Sadly, it only gained 5 hp (311 vs 306).

06-27-24, 10:17 AM

#5072

Toys4RJill

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Quote:

Originally Posted by LH1

Could you imagine BMW coming out with the N54 in 2007 and doing nothing for 17 years? That would never happen.

Good for BMW but it looks like the N54 has lots of problems. I would take the 2GR every day over a BMW engine. I also never knew BMW never had (if true) a twin turbo until 2007, Toyota was like 20 years ahead

Quote:

But the long-term reliability of those early turbo BMWs has been poor. The common issues are aplenty. There is an oil leak that causes belts to slip, which causes the front main seal to fail, which clogs the oil pickup with rubber, thereby starving the engine of oil and blowing the engine. The cutting-edge piezoelectric fuel injectors (meant for European models that lean-burn, not for us in the U.S.) have a tendency to stop injecting fuel, as does the high-pressure fuel pump. Valve covers crack and leak. The twin Mitsubishi TD03 turbos explode with regularity, and the wastegates rattle.

https://www.thedrive.com/guides-and-...-more-reliable

06-27-24, 10:18 AM

#5073

Striker223

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Toys4RJill

Good for BMW but it looks like the N54 has lots of problems.

https://www.thedrive.com/guides-and-...-more-reliable

They are on the B58 now so why don't you compare to that? Hell you should love it, it's the Supra engine

06-27-24, 10:20 AM

#5074

LH1

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Quote:

Originally Posted by JDR76

Well to be fair, they did update it in 2016 when it went from the 2GR-FSE to the 2GR-FKS

You're right I forgot about that update.

06-27-24, 10:27 AM

#5075

LH1

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Toys4RJill

The early N54's did have high pressure fuel pump issues. My analogy was more about the Germans making an engine and doing nothing to it for almost 20 years, which would never happen.

Look where they are now with the B58. It's universally praised as an amazing engine and reliability does not seem to be an issue. BMW did an outstanding job here.

06-27-24, 10:36 AM

#5076

Toys4RJill

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Quote:

Originally Posted by LH1

The early N54's did have high pressure fuel pump issues. My analogy was more about the Germans making an engine and doing nothing to it for almost 20 years, which would never happen.
.

‘But that is not true. The 2GR ranges from having 245HP to up to 316HP in naturally aspirated for, updated numerous times. Supercharged 2GR motors used in Lotus sports cars hit 430HP. There was even a 2GR 4.0litre used in the 24 Le Mans (for Lotus) making 470HP naturally aspirated. So when you say they did nothing is simply not true.

2GR-FE
2GR-FKS
2GR-FSE
2GR-FXE
2GR-FXS
2GR-FZE (factory Toyota supercharged)

Quote:

Look where they are now with the B58. It's universally praised as an amazing engine and reliability does not seem to be an issue. BMW did an outstanding job here.

Thats great! I just have no interest in a BMW motor

Last edited by Toys4RJill; 06-27-24 at 10:44 AM.

06-27-24, 10:41 AM

#5077

TheRas900

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SW17LS

So I heard from the dealer, this is actually kind of cool.

The car has 1,100 miles on it because its one of 6 identical spec cars that was used in Las Vegas to drive the Mercedes team F1 drivers around while they were there for the F1 race. There is a $2,500 rebate on the car from Mercedes which is great. I told him to make sure to vacuum all the cocaine out of the carpets and we will be good haha

Very cool backstory, and nice it comes with an extra rebate!

We went to F1 Weekend in Miami this year and it was a blast. Highly recommend attending an F1 race, it's like the Super Bowl for car fans!!

06-27-24, 10:44 AM

#5078

SW17LS

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRas900

Yeah I wanted to go to the one in Vegas! At least my car was there lol

Signed the handwritten lease disclosure today and the car is on the way!

06-27-24, 10:51 AM

#5079

LH1

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Toys4RJill

You're bringing up a highly modified race engine used only for Le Mans as a 2GR update? Come on.

I'm talking updates for mass market consumers to stay competitive with the Germans. The 2GR got one minor update that JDR mentioned in 2016. It was so minor I forgot about it lol.

06-27-24, 10:57 AM

#5080

Toys4RJill

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Quote:

You're bringing up a highly modified race engine used only for Le Mans as a 2GR update? Come on.

That’s true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LH1

I'm talking updates for mass market consumers to stay competitive with the Germans. The 2GR got one minor update that JDR mentioned in 2016. It was so minor I forgot about it lol.

Yet the 2UR engine in the IS500 received how many updates? Not everyone wants a German car or motor.

06-27-24, 11:00 AM

#5081

LH1

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Toys4RJill

Yet the 2UR engine in the IS500 received how many updates? Not everyone wants a German car or motor.

Way more significant. The 2UR was 416 hp when the IS F debuted. That same engine is 472 hp/ 395 tq now.

06-27-24, 11:07 AM

#5082

Toys4RJill

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Quote:

Originally Posted by LH1

Way more significant. The 2UR was 416 hp when the IS F debuted. That same engine is 472 hp/ 395 tq now.

And the original 2GR when it debuted in the Avalon had 268HP and a fully updated 2GR engine in the Mark X had 314HP.

just like some accept the 2UR and how old it is, some accept the 2GR for what it is.

06-27-24, 11:11 AM

#5083

Margate330

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Toys4RJill

I care about serviceability more than HP usually.
The 2GR is jammed in the engine bay sideways so tight on the RX350's, you have to drop the whole engine to get access to the timing chain or pull a cylinder head

My next SUV will be rwd with the engine going the proper direction.