jrmckinley

I saw a brand new G90 on the highway yesterday; a very dark blue color. It looked absolutely awesome. Beautiful car, certainly looks like a very high end luxury car.

SW17LS

That has delayed their growth for sure

Many of the people here did not own Lexus vehicles in the 90s. I remember having to tell people what a Lexus was with our 98 LS400, and that was 8 years into Lexus’ existence, and Lexus was all over advertising and had big imposing dealers. I remember my aunt sitting in it and saying “it’s an Alexis?”

It takes time…

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

doesn't look like much from this photo i took driving by but the local genesis dealership is nearly done. looks very nice up close.

SW17LS

Looks great! That will help a lot.

1111GS

It will be very nice and inside too. Their new waiting room looks like a fancy Magnolia show room. They certainly realized shared/cheap dealership is one of the reasons holding some customers.

peteharvey

Time?
Sedan vs SUV's?
Oversized & overweight design.
Premium RWD-based mechanicals.
New and more dealerships.
Let's hope they help Genesis.


However, we must accept the truth.

Time?
Hyundai's Genesis division is simply not on the same level as Toyota's Lexus division which debut in 1989.

Compacts
Genesis G70 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Ageing Lexus IS still clobbers G70 sales.
Lexus IS Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Ditto 3 Series and C Class:
BMW 3-Series Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)
Mercedes-Benz C-Class Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)


Midsize
2015 Hyundai Genesis performed admirably with >30,000 units.
Hyundai Genesis Sales Figures | GCBC (goodcarbadcar.net)
Even name changed 2017 Genesis G80 did well with 16,000 units.
However, ALL new 2nd generation G80 has gone backwards to a paltry 4-6k.
Genesis G80 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Cheaper 7ES romps away with 36-51k:
Lexus ES Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive 5 Series and E Class still romps away from G80 with 20-43k and 20-51k respectively:
BMW 5-Series Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)
Mercedes-Benz E / CLS-Class Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)


Full Size
Old Genesis G90 with 4.4k actually sells better than all new G90 with a paltry 1,288.
Genesis G90 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Even ageing 5LS sells twice all new G90:
Lexus LS Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive 7 Series still sells >8k:
BMW 7-Series Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive S Class still sells >14k:
Mercedes-Benz S-Class Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)




CUV
Even if sedan sales falling, Genesis SUV sales not rising!
GV70 sales a fraction of cheaper or more expensive competitors.
Genesis GV70 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

NX sells 3x more!
Lexus NX Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive X3 still sells 3x more than GV70:
BMW X3 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive GLC still outsells G70 nearly 3x:
Mercedes-Benz GLC-Class Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)


SUV
GV80 under 20k.
Genesis GV80 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Cheaper RX sells 5.5x more than GV80 with 110k to <20k!
Lexus RX Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive X5 still more than 4x > than GV80 at >80k.
BMW X5 Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

More expensive GLE still more than 3x more than GV80 at 65k:
Mercedes-Benz GLE-Class Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)



One of the hallmarks of Genesis design is to make their vehicles oversized and overweight - for example, G80 is noticeably bigger and heavier than GS, 5 Series and E Class - however, being oversized and overweight doesn't really work.
In fact, this oversized, overweight, with 3.7 L V6 that is thirstier and coarser and less manoeuvrability and inferior handling - was what made me purchase 2015 4GS over 2015 Hyundai Genesis.

Price? As evidenced above, more expensive Benz and Beamers still outsell the pants off Genesis.

New and more dealerships? The consumer demand simply isn't there.

Just accept the truth...

Motorola

I think you should follow your own advice rather than ignore the multiple responses that you have no answer for, instead of repeating the same defeated talking points ad nauseum for the past five years. I could literally turn you into an AI chatbot - that's how banal and predictable your responses have become.

SW17LS

I have to agree…

Genesis is doing fine. Success looks different for every company.

mmarshall

There are several areas, however, where heft and weight can be a good thing. One, it can make for a more solid-feeling body/frame and Thunk-solid door-closings....something that, IMO, Hyundai/Genesis and Kia did very well until the last couple of years, Two, all else equal, it can make for a smoother ride, better tracking, and better traction on wet/slippery roads. Three, (again also depending on a number of other factors), it can improve safety and protection in an accident.

peteharvey

First ten years of Lexus (1989-99), and Genesis (2015-25) - is no comparison.
The former is a marvel, while the latter is only second rate.

Yes, true Mike.

I was attracted by the 2015 Hyundai Genesis': Spaciousness, 3.7 L bottom end torque, deft ride, and deft quietness.
However, that extra size and weight would compromise the: The supposed need to be midsize, the fuel consumption, the engine smoothness, the maneuverability, and the handling.

In the end - just me - but I thought that being 1/2 a size bigger than the midsize class wasn't for me.
If I want a full size luxury car, I will buy one.
I wasn't interested in a budget luxury full size car.
According to the EPA, the new G80 is smaller inside than the old G80.

SW17LS

The comparison makes no sense, just because Genesis is not as successful as Lexus doesn’t mean they aren’t successful. It’s not a zero sum game.

Today I would not buy any Lexus, but I would buy several Genesis models. So, to me as a consumer that’s a big success.

Margate330

Selling the most doesn't always means it's the best either.

The Ford Escort was always a crap box but they sold like hot cakes. Haha. 🤣

Motorola

Genesis as a brand didn't even exist until 2017. As for the "first ten years of Lexus" I'd like you to point out which vehicles they sold back then are still relevant best-sellers today.

Comparing sales from two different time periods generally never makes any sense. Lexus's bread and butter RX didn't even exist back then lol.

mmarshall

The term "Best", in the automotive industry, can have a number of different meanings.


Well, it wasn't the most reliable or well-built car, but it was inexpensive, had a widespread dealer network for sales/service, and was relatively easy to get parts for. That appealed to a lot of potential buyers.

peteharvey

You're right Motorola.
Genesis was only publicly announced in 2015; it did not debut till 2017 - but petty.


Just as Acura is a luxury division of Honda, Lexus is a luxury division of Toyota, and Infiniti is a luxury division of Nissan - by all rights, Genesis is a luxury division of Hyundai - to be equally respected.


The OP bitkahuna has summed it up beautifully in his opening post.
I totally agree with the OP.


True.
Volume does not necessarily mean quality, but volume is a strong indicator of quality and success.

If it's not selling like Infiniti, then you must question if something is going on?
This thread according to the OP is all about Genesis celebrating the fact that Genesis is now outselling dead-beat Infiniti.

Interestingly, unlike Infiniti which has always sold poorly, Acura used to sell well, yet now Acura sales have tanked.
Remember the good old days when Acura sold like hot cakes?
Look at Acura's styling and products today?
Look at Acura sales today?

How is this gorgeous 1998-03 Acura TL sharing platforms with Accord.
Acura TL sales used to romp away with as much as 78k/year USA!
Nowadays, TL and TLX sales absolutely disgusting.
Acura TL Sales Figures | GCBC (goodcarbadcar.net)
Acura TLX Sales Figures | US Car Sales Figure (carfigures.com)

Calendar yearhideUS sales
1995 16,539[36]
1996 24,700[36]
1997 23,151[36]
1998 31,883[36]
1999 56,566[37][36]
2000 67,033[36]
2001 69,484[38][36]
2002 60,764[36]
2003 56,770[39][36]
2004 77,895[36]
2005 78,218[40][36]
2006 71,348[36]
2007 58,545[41][36]
2008 46,766[36]
2009 33,620[42][36]
2010 34,049[36]
2011 31,237[43][36]
2012 33,572[36]
2013 24,318[44][36]
2014 10,616[45][36]
2015 88






38 years ago, the beautiful Acura Legen coupe is still a beauty today:




The second generation Acura Legend with the massive wheelbase, and the longitudinal engine mounted behind the front axle:


Below, notice how Acura Legend sales used to be hot.
Nowadays, Acura RL/RLX sales is the pits.
Even when compared to modern luxury rivals like ES, 5 Series and E Class sales.

Calendar year Total US sales[11]
1986 25,062
1987 54,713
1988 70,770
1989 64,638
1990 53,666
1991 65,689
1992 49,926
1993 38,866
1994 35,709
1995 18,259
1996 629
1997 4

1996 15,848
1997 16,004
1998 15,024
1999 13,366
2000 14,827
2001 10,723
2002 9,392
2003 6,829
2004 8,753
2005 17,572
2006 11,501
2007 6,262
2008 4,517
2009 2,043
2010 2,037
2011 1,096
2012 379

Nowadays, Acura products plummeted, and their sales plummeted too.
Thus, there is a normally a strong correlation between sales and success.

Genesis has overtaken dead-beat Infiniti, but Genesis is yet to overtake modern day dead-beat Acura...