Buick totally redesigns the 2025 Enclave.
#31
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by Toys4RJill
I like everything in the interior aside from the screens. Love the steering wheel colour.
Yes, the blue/Ivory Avenir interior is very attractive. I'm not wild about the screens, either, but they have some good points.
I think the new Avenir version will win over some former Cadillac XT5/XT6 owners. I know that Cadillacs, in general, for the money, do not impress me.
too bad no smooth shifting slick V6.
I could see Buick folding in North America
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-04-24 at 09:23 PM.
#32
With today's vehicles, each one at the factory, in its electronic speedometer/odometer electronic sensors, is programmed for exactly the size wheel, suspension, and tire that was installed there. If you try and change it, it can mess up the sensors.
I'm not saying that you yourself didn't have reasonable success with it (you probably did).....I'm just not sure I'd want to try it, for several reasons.
I'm not saying that you yourself didn't have reasonable success with it (you probably did).....I'm just not sure I'd want to try it, for several reasons.
The OEM is 235/40 R19.
My Minus 1 is 235/45 R18.
My future Minus 2 is 235/50 R17.
I will probably use Minus 2 at 225/55 R17.
Because instead of the OEM 235 mm tread width on OEM 8" rim width, a slightly narrower 225 mm tire tread on 7.5" rim width is lighter in weight, hence less unsprung mass, less momentum on bump impact, and a smoother ride - but most importantly, I get to use my favorite Pirelli Cinturato P7 Series II, which rides better than both Series I and Series III; if I am not wrong, the Cinturatos don't come in 235/50 R17.
At 235/50 R17, I would have to use the Michelin Primacy 4's, and I did not like the hard rubber compound and bump thump and slight droning on Michelin Primacy 3's which I have owned in the past.
The third line from the bottom are the +/- speedometer variations.
Notice how ALL four sizes have less than 3% in speedometer error and hence legal?
Green means within the 3% legal limit, while red means greater than the 3% legal speedo variation and illegal.
At the bottom of the webpage, slide the horizontal bar across to see all four tires.
235-40R19 vs 235-45R18 vs 235-50R17 vs 225-55R17 - Tire and Wheel Plus Sizing | Tire Size Calculator (1010tires.com)
Mike, click on this link below, and it will actually show you the cross-section of your existing tire/wheel against the cross-section of your proposed new tire/wheel.
Below is my original 235/40 R19 in orange outline, against my proposed forthcoming Minus 2 sizing [ie 2" smaller wheel diameter] at 225/55 R17 in green outline.
Notice how the rolling diameter/circumference is almost exactly the same at -1.28%?
You substitute your own tire/wheel dimensions, and hey presto...
Alloy Wheel and Tyre Fitment Calculator. Offset, Tyre Stretch and Speedo Error | Will They Fit
Last edited by peteharvey; 05-05-24 at 02:23 AM.
#33
You don’t understand how tire sizes work. “45 series tires” are not all the same sidewall height. The aspect ratio (the 45) means that the sidewall height is 45% of the tires tread width. So yes, a 45 series tire can have a taller sidewall than a 50 series tire if the 45 series tire is wider.
Your Lacrosse had wider tires than your Encore GX, so the sidewalls are very similar despite being different aspect ratios.
Your Lacrosse had wider tires than your Encore GX, so the sidewalls are very similar despite being different aspect ratios.
However, also keep in mind that even if the wheel diameter and sidewalls are exactly the same height, the wider tread width with lower profile tires - not only does the wider tread width have more grip, but the lower profile/aspect ratio results in a "more rigid" sidewall that is more instantaneously responsive to steering input for faster changes in direction, at the expense of a "stiffer" sidewall resulting in both a firmer ride and higher noise levels.
Plus, the extra mass from the wider tread and the wider 9" rims won't do the ride any favors either.
Below is hypothetical 245/40 R19 vs 265/35 R19, ie same sidewall height, but a wider tread, and a lower profile aspect ratio.
Alloy Wheel and Tyre Fitment Calculator. Offset, Tyre Stretch and Speedo Error | Will They Fit
#34
Super Moderator
Aspect ratio is not a measurement, it is one factor used in a calculation. I have a set of 40-profile 21s that have the exact same 4.6" of sidewall that your Lacrosse's 18s did.
Last edited by geko29; 05-05-24 at 07:14 AM.
#35
Lexus Fanatic
#36
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Yes, quite. Your Lacrosse had 235/50/18s, which have 4.6" of sidewall. The 245/45/19s on the Encore GX Avenir have just over 4.3" of sidewall, about a quarter inch less. If one wants to be pedantic, 5/16" less is about as accurate as we can get with imperial measurements.
Aspect ratio is not a measurement, it is one factor used in a calculation. I have a set of 40-profile 21s that have the exact same 4.6" of sidewall that your Lacrosse's 18s did.
Aspect ratio is not a measurement, it is one factor used in a calculation. I have a set of 40-profile 21s that have the exact same 4.6" of sidewall that your Lacrosse's 18s did.
Well, you can toss around all the numbers you want, but I can note (and sometimes clearly note) similarities and differences in ride quality between all of them...especially between cold/hot weather and varying pavement-temperatures. It's an ability I have finely-honed in 50+ years of owning and test-driving vehicles. In general, all else equal, at least as far as the tires are concerned, the lower the profile, the harder the tread compound, and the colder the tire-temperature, the firmer/noisier the ride over bumps, and the more crisp and immediate the steering response, and the worse the traction on wet/slick roads is going to be. A number of other factors are also involved, though, including suspension design/firmness, the temperature of the shock/hydraulic fluid, and the amount of wear on the suspension itself.
A few manufacturers can do what I call comfortable-riding vehicles with 45s (and an older BMW 330i I sampled was comfortable even with 35s)..but most cannot. For my tastes, they need 50s or above....60 or above is best.
#37
Lexus Champion
I will bet money my 20 inch rims ride smoother than anything you have driven lol!
The tires can be compensated by the suspension so you can have directness AND smooth
The tires can be compensated by the suspension so you can have directness AND smooth
#38
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Well, Friend, I clearly mentioned suspension-design in my last comment...if you had bothered to read it. But, even so, I have never sampled 20-inchers that I thought rode what I would call comfortably. In fact, that is about the only reason I decided not to go with a Buick Cascada convertible when they came out...which I thought was (otherwise) a superb small fun-in-the-sun machine, and extremely well-built for an inexpensive ragtop. Its standard 20s (there was no option) rode like a Go-Kart over bumps, even at moderately warm temperatures with recommend PSIs.
#40
Lexus Fanatic
To cut through the gaslighting, nobody is saying higher profile tires don’t ride better than lower profile tires. We are saying that the aspect ratio of two tires being different doesn’t necessarily mean the thickness of their sidewalls are different, since aspect ratio is a ratio of sidewall height to tread width. Hence, two 45 series tires can have widely different sidewall thicknesses.
Last edited by SW17LS; 05-05-24 at 06:58 PM.
#41
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
And, like I said.....I'm back on thread-topic. Have a nice evening.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-05-24 at 07:09 PM.
#42
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Anyhow, on topic, depending on your point of view, more good or bad news about the 2025 Enclave........it, along with the Chevy Traverse and the next-generation GMC Acadia, will be built at the Lansing, Michigan plant, with American UAW labor. To me, of course, that is good news...........no Chinese sweat-shops for this one.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/2025...t-look-review/
https://www.motortrend.com/news/2025...t-look-review/
#43
Lexus Fanatic
Your experience tells you that sidewall height of a tire with a 45 aspect ratio is always the same regardless of the width of the tire?
You are entitled to your own opinion not your own facts.
You are entitled to your own opinion not your own facts.
#44
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Joe Raiti also loves the new Avenir...he made his video on (obviously) the same show-floor as most of the rest of the reviewers did. He has some good close-ups of the interior.
Unfortunately, apparantly no new Enclaves have been officially turned over to the auto-press yet......so there are no actual road-tests. But, based on the static-reviews alone, from Joe and others, I'm confident that it is going to do very well in the market, and even convert some Cadillac XT5 and XT6 fans. I'm especially anxious to hear what Alex Dykes has to say, since I consider him to be (arguably) the best You-Tube auto-reviewer in the buisness.
Steve.....if you want to stop arguing about tires for a minute, here may (?) be a serious possibility for replacing your Pacifica when the lease runs out. I think your family will love that interior.
Unfortunately, apparantly no new Enclaves have been officially turned over to the auto-press yet......so there are no actual road-tests. But, based on the static-reviews alone, from Joe and others, I'm confident that it is going to do very well in the market, and even convert some Cadillac XT5 and XT6 fans. I'm especially anxious to hear what Alex Dykes has to say, since I consider him to be (arguably) the best You-Tube auto-reviewer in the buisness.
Steve.....if you want to stop arguing about tires for a minute, here may (?) be a serious possibility for replacing your Pacifica when the lease runs out. I think your family will love that interior.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-05-24 at 10:19 PM.
#45
Lexus Champion
Well, you can toss around all the numbers you want, but I can note (and sometimes clearly note) similarities and differences in ride quality between all of them...especially between cold/hot weather and varying pavement-temperatures. It's an ability I have finely-honed in 50+ years of owning and test-driving vehicles. In general, all else equal, at least as far as the tires are concerned, the lower the profile, the harder the tread compound, and the colder the tire-temperature, the firmer/noisier the ride over bumps, and the more crisp and immediate the steering response, and the worse the traction on wet/slick roads is going to be. A number of other factors are also involved, though, including suspension design/firmness, the temperature of the shock/hydraulic fluid, and the amount of wear on the suspension itself.
A few manufacturers can do what I call comfortable-riding vehicles with 45s (and an older BMW 330i I sampled was comfortable even with 35s)..but most cannot. For my tastes, they need 50s or above....60 or above is best.
A few manufacturers can do what I call comfortable-riding vehicles with 45s (and an older BMW 330i I sampled was comfortable even with 35s)..but most cannot. For my tastes, they need 50s or above....60 or above is best.