bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

whether losing money on low end or making more money on higher models, it's the same result... dealers make more money if they can sell more expensive cars and they've shown there's enough demand for higher models for them to be successful. want a cheap car? get a used one.

exactly... those cheap cars are or were cheap for a reason. most of them are horribly compromised and crappy.

the car business is the same as it's always been, dealers/manufacturers know how to make money and will always try to sell the most profitable ones if possible.

it's also why the electric car makers in particular, come out with the highest end models and even special editions or founder's editions or whatever, FIRST, because they know those who have 'got to have it' will pay it, even though there's VERY little value in the extra money paid. those buyers will get killed in depreciation, but they had their shining moment when they got it.

tesla in fact had it both ways by saying they'd have a cheap ev then bringing out a most expensive model first, and then NEVER EVER releasing the promised cheap ones or at least at nowhere near the price promised. that's pure bait and switch, a tactic as old as the business, but no one's being forced to buy anything.

and geko has this exactly right... she talks about 20k cars over a decade including a recent period of rampant inflation and higher interest rates.

SW17LS

This is Business 101. We've had these arguments over and over, manufacturers of EVERYTHING spend their manufacturing capacity making what makes them the most money. Thats a big "no duh".

LexBob2

What a concept! lol

Margate330

That's not how business works.
They need to make what I WANT. 🤓.

geko29

Only works that way if you have control of the business. For example, I own a headphone amp that I'm 99% sure only exists because the founder of the company wanted one for himself. I figure the thought process went something like "If I design and build one just for me, it will cost me $200k. But if I build 250 and sell most of them for $1800 each, I can cover the development and production costs and get mine for free."

Same deal in the automotive world, only the $200k is more like $800M, and so you obviously have to sell a LOT more units at a larger total margin per unit to cover your costs. But solve that little math problem, and you can have anything you want.

SW17LS

It’s good to be the boss lol

FrankReynoldsCPA

You just described how the Ineos Grenadier came to be lol.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

they may be able to make what you want, but maybe not at a price you will buy.

you really own a headphone amp that cost $1800?

i'd love to have you do blind hearing tests to see if you could appreciate its value.

has its own headaches though, but yeah.

geko29

I guess you don't want to hear about the DAC and headphones then.... Would be happy to do a single- or double-blind test, but they're tricky with headamps since you have to physically move cables. But it's really not all that necessary, as the difference tubes bring to the table are not subtle in the slightest. It's like asking if I could tell, blindfolded, whether I was riding in a Corvette or a Tesla. I've done single-blind DAC tests (meaning I don't know what I'm listening to but the the "proctor" does) and can clearly pick out the differences, which are far more subtle than the differences between amps. Like in any industry/hobby though--including cars--returns are sharply diminishing. I also have a $165 amp that sounds nearly as good for a nontrivial percentage of recordings, and actually sounds better for some.

Anyway, it was just intended as an example.

Striker223

Dear god that does that describe the audio world well....

Striker223

Oh that's nothing in the audio world, my dads reference system has a $12k preamp.....that's just one component.

Margate330

Yeah, I know but I can dream. Lol

I want it fast, good quality, and for a good price.
I want it all... Haha

SW17LS

I think my accountant said it best when he said going off on his own is equally the best and the worst decision he ever made lol

mmarshall

Good point, Margate......Bingo. I've said that for years. You ignore too many customers, you suffer....even if those customers don't necessarily want the most profitable vehicles.

That's how GM, for example, went from being the country's premier (and perhaps the world's premier) automaker in the 1960s and 70s, within some 60% of the market share, to bankruptcy in 2008. They have recovered from that some, but still trail a number of other corporations today.

So, what's your definition of "fast" and a "good price"?

We all want things as well-built and cheap as possible, but every mass-produced vehicle, to some extent, is a compromise. If the company spends more on one aspect of the vehicle, it may have to economize on others.

Steve's new S580 is a good example. It is unrealistic (and probably impossible) to try to build a sedan like that for the price of a Camry.

Margate330

I was just joking around but that's the consumerism world we live in.

We want it now, fast and cheap. Lol

On one hand I can see them tanking production of the lower cost vehicles but that just opens up opportunity for others to offer it up.

Yeah, maybe they can tell the cheaper car buyers to take a hike but if we ever end up in another recession, their premium models might not sell as well and then what do they have to sell? Lol