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BMW also used to have that kind of Teutonic-Tank-solidity, but their products also went noticeably downhill in the solidity department when Chris Bangle came along. He not only introduced the complex/annoying I-Drive and what was (IMO) goofy-looking body styling, but also thinner/lighter construction that was apparently done to cut costs, although the lighter weight might have also helped with CAFE averages,.
Absolutely not. The older ones were cheap as hell and if you even THOUGHT about touching the console with a knee in an E46 the whole thing damn near breaks off. Extremely cheap feeling vs same era Lexus and it's scare to touch anything.....the Bangle era 7 is the first BMW I interacted with that I actually felt quality
The newer ones finally feel like the S and A8 and it has extended down the line, I wouldn't and didn't consider anything older than the 7 series prior to current due to how cheap and frail they felt vs their contemporaries.
See that's what I mean - the newer BMW's used more aluminum than the ones from the 90's especially on areas like doors and body panels which made them feel lighter. But aluminum costs much more than steel to manufacture, and now the newest BMW's also use carbon composites which are even lighter and another level up in expensive manufacturing. But because of the tactility and heft of the old ones from the 90s, you feel like you are getting a more expensive, better product than the new one even though the opposite is true.
You can have a fully alum car (not just the skins) that still feels and sounds exceptional, just ask Audi....BMW is always about 20-30% behind Audi on structural stiffness because they were late to game with advanced materials.
You’re really not a car guy and/or don’t frequent YouTube watching racing/build series. Cleetus and his friends have built/raced some impressive cars/trucks over the years. He owns a race track.
it probably wouldn't help the situation if Bit knew the name of the race track lmfaooooo
a brit would go "well mental" at the idea of such an expressive, consequence free environment
A partner at my firm recently traded his Lexus in for an Elantra because he just wanted a basic car that gets him from A to B and was done with all the features. Different strokes for different folks.
lol, and how does he like the elantra? how do you like it (for what it is)? and the elantra probably still has more features than his lexus did.
Originally Posted by SW17LS
Remember, we live in America where everybody with experience is at the mercy of those with opinions lol
but experiences doesn't always mean expertise. you for example, may have driven a lot of vehicles, but it doesn't sound like you've repaired or worked on many.
Originally Posted by FrankReynoldsCPA
Everybody is entitled to an opinion and on a public forum that opinion can be debated or criticized.
100%
Originally Posted by BayeauxLex
You’re really not a car guy and/or don’t frequent YouTube watching racing/build series.
you're entitled to your opinion about whether i'm a 'car guy'. but yes i couldn't care less about watching racing / build videos. the two aren't automatically connected.
Cleetus and his friends have built/raced some impressive cars/trucks over the years. He owns a race track.
cletus - not even his real name - does what he does to make money, and it seems like his staff does most of the work. he's more video producer and 'star'. but again more power to him, he's found a very successful niche.
Originally Posted by FrankReynoldsCPA
yeah I really am not surprised that Bit dislikes Cleetus McFarland. Definitely an affront to British sensibilities.
haha, nothing to do with my place of birth. plenty of dumb video originates there too!
See that's what I mean - the newer BMW's used more aluminum than the ones from the 90's especially on areas like doors and body panels which made them feel lighter. But aluminum costs much more than steel to manufacture, and now the newest BMW's also use carbon composites which are even lighter and another level up in expensive manufacturing. But because of the tactility and heft of the old ones from the 90s, you feel like you are getting a more expensive, better product than the new one even though the opposite is true.
I'm not referring to aluminum.....I know aluminum usually costs more than steel. I'm referring to thinner, less-durable sheet steel.
That "complex/annoying iDrive" revolutionized the automotive infotainment landscape...just sayin.
A lot of people disliked it when it first came out, however......me included. We found it complex, difficult to use, and made it hard to keep one's eyes on the road. Now they are developing self-driving cameras that apparantly even do that for you......watch the road LOL.
This excellent article from Motor trend is a couple of years old, but IMO sums up the controversy over the early versions of the I-Drive very well.
Lol don't dump a 200 you'll regrettttt it. Everyone who sells them does, or lots of people. Just knowing it's there outside is comforting. End of the world and need to get off the trail? No problem. Less dramatic---I had so much fun with it when we got the 10" of snow, winter 2024 will never be forgotten.
Trust me. I know the gas mileage is horrible but it won't be any better, anything significant at least, in any other BOF around the city.
edit: What hybrid??
Lexus TX hybrid or Grand Highlander hybrid max. Our LX is a pavement princes. My wife DD it. Gas mileage isn’t an issue. My wife wants something with newer tech and little more cargo/3rd row space. I personally like the LX and not opposed to keeping it. We average little over 300 miles per tank in town. We haven’t taken a roadtrip in it in couple years.
10” of snow?? We won’t step foot outside let alone drive anywhere unless there’s an emergency.
Originally Posted by AMIRZA786
I don't know anything about Cletus, but it looks like he plays a certain stereotype, and makes fun of it and monetizes it at the same time. Just the impression I get
you're entitled to your opinion about whether i'm a 'car guy'. but yes i couldn't care less about watching racing / build videos. the two aren't automatically connected.
cletus - not even his real name - does what he does to make money, and it seems like his staff does most of the work. he's more video producer and 'star'. but again more power to him, he's found a very successful niche.
Lexus TX hybrid or Grand Highlander hybrid max. Our LX is a pavement princes. My wife DD it. Gas mileage isn’t an issue. My wife wants something with newer tech and little more cargo/3rd row space. I personally like the LX and not opposed to keeping it. We average little over 300 miles per tank in town. We haven’t taken a roadtrip in it in couple years.
10” of snow?? We won’t step foot outside let alone drive anywhere unless there’s an emergency.
Got it. My modding days are pretty much over, and I'm not into racing, in fact I don't really watch car videos in general anymore. Most stuff I watch is mostly independent media and informational videos. Sad, huh 🤣. But I do read your back and fourth debates and learn new things, so it's not all bleak. I work for a startup, so most of my time is divided between work and family, not much time for cars these days
BMW also used to have that kind of Teutonic-Tank-solidity, but their products also went noticeably downhill in the solidity department when Chris Bangle came along. He not only introduced the complex/annoying I-Drive and what was (IMO) goofy-looking body styling, but also thinner/lighter construction that was apparently done to cut costs, although the lighter weight might have also helped with CAFE averages,.
MM, you bring up those "goofy" designs a lot. Bangle didn't design either of the cars you think he did. Adrian van Hooydonk was the lead designer of the E63 7 Series, and Davide Arcangeli designed the E60 5 Series. Sure, Bangle ran the team, but the designs weren't his. And to your other points, i-Drive was revolutionary and the aluminum construction was part of what made the E60 faster and better handling than the E39 - along with other things like active roll stabilization and active steering. Both of which I had on my 545i and my 550i.
Got it. My modding days are pretty much over, and I'm not into racing, in fact I don't really watch car videos in general anymore. Most stuff I watch is mostly independent media and informational videos. Sad, huh 🤣. But I do read your back and fourth debates and learn new things, so it's not all bleak. I work for a startup, so most of my time is divided between work and family, not much time for cars these days
I’ve had a “need for speed” for years. I like the rush. I used to be in an import car club years ago (body kits, wheels, coilovers, turbo kits, car shows, etc) Got into sport bikes (had a 600, 750, 1000). I use to drag my Gixxer 750 (ran 10.4@136mph) then I got into road racing it. Retired from bikes took a break from the speed/adrenaline rush until I got my Honda (had a LS460 prior). This is why I appreciate the performance of EVs!!
I understand trying to balance work and family. Little free time, I sneak away to the track. Sometimes the family will tag along.
May sound crazy but I don’t mind modding a cars but I don’t like to work on cars or should I say repair cars. It’s a difference. I will if I have to but I prefer not.
I’ve had a “need for speed” for years. I like the rush. I used to be in an import car club years ago (body kits, wheels, coilovers, turbo kits, car shows, etc) Got into sport bikes (had a 600, 750, 1000). I use to drag my Gixxer 750 (ran 10.4@136mph) then I got into road racing it. Retired from bikes took a break from the speed/adrenaline rush until I got my Honda (had a LS460 prior). This is why I appreciate the performance of EVs!!
I understand trying to balance work and family. Little free time, I sneak away to the track. Sometimes the family will tag along.
May sound crazy but I don’t mind modding a cars but I don’t like to work on cars or should I say repair cars. It’s a difference. I will if I have to but I prefer not.
Last part, I totally get. In my younger days I did my own brakes, oil changes etc out of necessity, but loved modding. Modded my Si, and my IS350, I actually had plans to put in a locking diff, F-Sport exhaust, and RR Racing super charger which would have gotten me 455 to the wheels. But after going EV, all that became moot because I have all the power I need. $1200 for a performance upgrade to the Polestar boosted me from 408 HP to 476. Performance upgrade for the Y would give me 100 more boosting me to 484. It already has Brembo's, all I would need is suspension from unplugged to make it track ready. I call them cheat codes 😂
My Dad had an E38 740. The car was fantastic, built like a tank. Yes, rolling junk reliability wise but when new it was a fabulous car that felt very overbuilt….. like a proper flagship.
Also we had a ‘96 328i manual which I taught myself how to drive a stick with and snuck out every chance I got. Also very nice car, high quality and fit and finish.
09-11-24, 05:50 PM
