Mercedes Cuts S-Class Production Because of Lower Sales
08-23-24, 07:11 AM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
EQS sells so poorly its not a factor.
Issue with the S Class has been a few things...from an owner who talks to other owners a lot:
1. The car is very tech forward which alienates a lot of older buyers, while at the same time it doesn't appeal to younger buyers. The glitchy tech and the poor rollout frought with problems have created a stigma amongst the S Class/flagship buyer that the car is very problematic. This has been largely solved but stigmas are hard to break.
2. S63 variants were VERY late which reduces buzz.
3. The car is too expensive. When you spec out a Range Rover and come to the conclusion its a better value...thats a problem. IMO My S580 is $10,000 overpriced.
4. Lease support has been very poor. Up until the past 3 months or so leasing the S580 I have was a $2,500 a month proposition because of poor residuals, lack of dealer cash and poor money factors. They have improved that in a big way...thats the only reason I got one. I never would have paid $2,500 a month, I would have gotten a 7 Series for $1,000 a month less. A returning S560 customer like me was looking at $700-1,000 a month more to replace theirs with the same car which is insane. I'm at $366 a month more and thats within inflation.
The 7 series is polarizing, but it is attracting younger buyers. I have a friend with one who is 37, and he would never consider an S Class...maybe an S63. It also is better built with better materials inside on the whole...hence why its outselling the S Class which is very unusual.
LOL, its not garbage, but its not as good inside as it should be. I've had mine almost 2 months now and overall I am very satisfied with the interior. It has a few places where it really misses though and those are a problem. Worst area is the screen/console implementation. The edges around the screen are sharp plastic, and the black plastic console top is ridiculous, that should be wood to match the wood interior. You also have the hard black plastic door threshhold areas. Other than that the leather is all excellent, carpeting is excellent, controls all feel great...the ride and drive of the car is a definite step up from the W222 and it best in class (outside of the i7, but better than the 740 and 760). Mine has exclusive nappa which has the full leather doors, console and dash and suede headliner. Its a very nice car, but the interior does not "wow" like the 7 does or a Range Rover does. It needs to "wow"
Still plenty of us who like an understated car.
Issue with the S Class has been a few things...from an owner who talks to other owners a lot:
1. The car is very tech forward which alienates a lot of older buyers, while at the same time it doesn't appeal to younger buyers. The glitchy tech and the poor rollout frought with problems have created a stigma amongst the S Class/flagship buyer that the car is very problematic. This has been largely solved but stigmas are hard to break.
2. S63 variants were VERY late which reduces buzz.
3. The car is too expensive. When you spec out a Range Rover and come to the conclusion its a better value...thats a problem. IMO My S580 is $10,000 overpriced.
4. Lease support has been very poor. Up until the past 3 months or so leasing the S580 I have was a $2,500 a month proposition because of poor residuals, lack of dealer cash and poor money factors. They have improved that in a big way...thats the only reason I got one. I never would have paid $2,500 a month, I would have gotten a 7 Series for $1,000 a month less. A returning S560 customer like me was looking at $700-1,000 a month more to replace theirs with the same car which is insane. I'm at $366 a month more and thats within inflation.
The 7 series is polarizing, but it is attracting younger buyers. I have a friend with one who is 37, and he would never consider an S Class...maybe an S63. It also is better built with better materials inside on the whole...hence why its outselling the S Class which is very unusual.
LOL, its not garbage, but its not as good inside as it should be. I've had mine almost 2 months now and overall I am very satisfied with the interior. It has a few places where it really misses though and those are a problem. Worst area is the screen/console implementation. The edges around the screen are sharp plastic, and the black plastic console top is ridiculous, that should be wood to match the wood interior. You also have the hard black plastic door threshhold areas. Other than that the leather is all excellent, carpeting is excellent, controls all feel great...the ride and drive of the car is a definite step up from the W222 and it best in class (outside of the i7, but better than the 740 and 760). Mine has exclusive nappa which has the full leather doors, console and dash and suede headliner. Its a very nice car, but the interior does not "wow" like the 7 does or a Range Rover does. It needs to "wow"
Still plenty of us who like an understated car.
08-23-24, 08:30 AM
#17
Lexus Champion
I don't disagree with that since I'm one of them......
You are also dead on with why the current S is having problems, the lack of AMG really hurt it since while yes most will not buy it the lack of halo effect did the same thing as Lexus constantly has going on.
You are also dead on with why the current S is having problems, the lack of AMG really hurt it since while yes most will not buy it the lack of halo effect did the same thing as Lexus constantly has going on.
08-23-24, 09:18 AM
#18
Lexus Test Driver
Saw another fake AMG badge in an S class the other day.
Even worse it had a tune that made it pop, pop, blat while he was hitting the gas and decelerating over and over.
Very obnoxious. Lol
08-24-24, 07:09 AM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
the 7 "wows" because it is anything but understated.
living with that disco on wheels though would get old to me.
and the s-class has always been 'boring' inside compared to say a bentley. mercedes has a particularly style philosophy that is reserved but screams quality, comfort and elegance (generally). bentley, rolls, and now bmw 7 are much more over the top, flashy, blingy, "look at me".
08-24-24, 12:16 PM
#20
Lexus Test Driver
LOL, its not garbage, but its not as good inside as it should be. I've had mine almost 2 months now and overall I am very satisfied with the interior. It has a few places where it really misses though and those are a problem. Worst area is the screen/console implementation. The edges around the screen are sharp plastic, and the black plastic console top is ridiculous, that should be wood to match the wood interior. You also have the hard black plastic door threshhold areas. Other than that the leather is all excellent, carpeting is excellent, controls all feel great...the ride and drive of the car is a definite step up from the W222 and it best in class (outside of the i7, but better than the 740 and 760). Mine has exclusive nappa which has the full leather doors, console and dash and suede headliner. Its a very nice car, but the interior does not "wow" like the 7 does or a Range Rover does. It needs to "wow".
Compared to a Corolla - yes its nice.
The steering wheel alone is an embarrassment.
Previous one had wood and such better materials.
The seats are much less comfortable.
The dash layout with the ipad screens is ridiculous.
08-24-24, 02:23 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
those 2 statements seem at odds.
the 7 "wows" because it is anything but understated.
living with that disco on wheels though would get old to me.
and the s-class has always been 'boring' inside compared to say a bentley. mercedes has a particularly style philosophy that is reserved but screams quality, comfort and elegance (generally). bentley, rolls, and now bmw 7 are much more over the top, flashy, blingy, "look at me".
the 7 "wows" because it is anything but understated.
living with that disco on wheels though would get old to me.
and the s-class has always been 'boring' inside compared to say a bentley. mercedes has a particularly style philosophy that is reserved but screams quality, comfort and elegance (generally). bentley, rolls, and now bmw 7 are much more over the top, flashy, blingy, "look at me".
Having had both, I don't agree at all. There are some areas where they clearly took a step back from the 222 I agree, but to say its "garbage" is ridiculous. Its covered in leather and metal and wood and high quality carpet, alcantara, excellent OLED screens and incredible ambient lighting, awesome seats...hardly garbage.
The other big benefit of the W223 is the processing speed of the infotainment, its MUCH faster than the W222 which was ridiculously slow. The basic Burmester audio is also dramatically better. Went from being quite poor, to being without a doubt the best audio system I've ever had in a car.
The steering wheel alone is an embarrassment.
Previous one had wood and such better materials.
Previous one had wood and such better materials.
The seats are much less comfortable.
The dash layout with the ipad screens is ridiculous.
Plus like I said the W223 rides better and is considerably quieter. I don't miss my W222 at all.
But please tell me more about the car I currently own and how it compares to the one I had before lol
Last edited by SW17LS; 08-24-24 at 02:58 PM.
08-24-24, 04:17 PM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
08-24-24, 05:08 PM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Yep. I’ve seen that too
08-24-24, 05:40 PM
#25
My local Mercedes dealership had a Maybach exactly like that in that picture a few days ago. I would prefer solid black myself but I remember the older Maybachs coming in a similar color combination.
I don't care for the crazy screens and steering wheel in the newer S-Class. I also don't have that kind of money either. I see more W223's than the other flagship sedans here. I live within 4 miles from all of the luxury brand dealerships though so I see a lot more flagships around every day.
I don't care for the crazy screens and steering wheel in the newer S-Class. I also don't have that kind of money either. I see more W223's than the other flagship sedans here. I live within 4 miles from all of the luxury brand dealerships though so I see a lot more flagships around every day.
08-24-24, 05:59 PM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
When you’re used to and driving the car fhe screens are not crazy at all lol
08-24-24, 11:26 PM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
Compared to a Bentley sure, Bentleys cost twice as much but I think my W222 had a "wow" interior. The W223 is less wow. What wows me about the interior of the 7 is the product quality and the design.
Having had both, I don't agree at all. There are some areas where they clearly took a step back from the 222 I agree, but to say its "garbage" is ridiculous. Its covered in leather and metal and wood and high quality carpet, alcantara, excellent OLED screens and incredible ambient lighting, awesome seats...hardly garbage.
The other big benefit of the W223 is the processing speed of the infotainment, its MUCH faster than the W222 which was ridiculously slow. The basic Burmester audio is also dramatically better. Went from being quite poor, to being without a doubt the best audio system I've ever had in a car.
My S580 steering wheel has a full wood rim. Materials are the same, leather stitched horn pad, wood and leather wheel. You have piano black plastic instead of matte silver painted plastic...but its still plastic.
Again I have had both, I don't agree. It takes more time to dial in the seats of the W223 but now that they are dialed in they are great. The seats also have additional massage, massage in the base of the seat vs just the back, and the seat kinetics which actually make an incredible difference on long trips. I have spent hours at a time now behind the wheel of the 223 and the seats are very comfortable.
Layout doesn't bother me at all anymore...it did but it feels totally normal now. I do agree that the interior layout in general was better in the 222.
Plus like I said the W223 rides better and is considerably quieter. I don't miss my W222 at all.
But please tell me more about the car I currently own and how it compares to the one I had before lol
Having had both, I don't agree at all. There are some areas where they clearly took a step back from the 222 I agree, but to say its "garbage" is ridiculous. Its covered in leather and metal and wood and high quality carpet, alcantara, excellent OLED screens and incredible ambient lighting, awesome seats...hardly garbage.
The other big benefit of the W223 is the processing speed of the infotainment, its MUCH faster than the W222 which was ridiculously slow. The basic Burmester audio is also dramatically better. Went from being quite poor, to being without a doubt the best audio system I've ever had in a car.
My S580 steering wheel has a full wood rim. Materials are the same, leather stitched horn pad, wood and leather wheel. You have piano black plastic instead of matte silver painted plastic...but its still plastic.
Again I have had both, I don't agree. It takes more time to dial in the seats of the W223 but now that they are dialed in they are great. The seats also have additional massage, massage in the base of the seat vs just the back, and the seat kinetics which actually make an incredible difference on long trips. I have spent hours at a time now behind the wheel of the 223 and the seats are very comfortable.
Layout doesn't bother me at all anymore...it did but it feels totally normal now. I do agree that the interior layout in general was better in the 222.
Plus like I said the W223 rides better and is considerably quieter. I don't miss my W222 at all.
But please tell me more about the car I currently own and how it compares to the one I had before lol
The few times I drove it, I don’t have much good things to say about interior.
At the end of the day - it’s down in sales in a big way and I’m not surprised at all.
08-25-24, 07:37 AM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
Well i can only go by my parents opinion who are on their 4th Sclass and they both HATE the new one. My mom has to use a pillow bec the seats are so uncomfortable.
The few times I drove it, I don’t have much good things to say about interior.
At the end of the day - it’s down in sales in a big way and I’m not surprised at all.
The few times I drove it, I don’t have much good things to say about interior.
At the end of the day - it’s down in sales in a big way and I’m not surprised at all.
Your mother would be very happy with the seats if she could adjust them...but she can't because of the tech interface...which is part of the issue.
Your parents is also an S500 if I remember correctly and lacks the interior upgrades mine has which makes a HUGE difference in the interior (hence your no wood on the wheel comment). I drove an S500 and immediately turned around and took it back.
Its absolutely down in sales numbers (all of them are), but the more surprising bit is that the 7 Series is outselling it. That never happens. They just didn't hit their target with the tech forward nature yet staid and classic look and feel, but the car is an excellent car.
Last edited by SW17LS; 08-25-24 at 07:43 AM.
08-26-24, 08:54 AM
#29
Lexus Test Driver
^
Yes they have S500.
I thought the options and interiors were the same.
They have AMG pack and bunch of other options.
I also disagree that young people don’t want Sclass. The styling of the car from exterior is great. It lacks sporty driving feel obviously but most young ppl could care less.
I see about 10 new Sclass for each new 7.
To me the styling of the 7 is hideous both inside and out. The interior fit/finish is ok but much better than new 5er.
Besides RR / Bentley, the only interiors I have been impressed by is from Genesis. The G90 and GV80 coupe were just great. It’s what Lexus should be if it evolved properly.
Yes they have S500.
I thought the options and interiors were the same.
They have AMG pack and bunch of other options.
I also disagree that young people don’t want Sclass. The styling of the car from exterior is great. It lacks sporty driving feel obviously but most young ppl could care less.
I see about 10 new Sclass for each new 7.
To me the styling of the 7 is hideous both inside and out. The interior fit/finish is ok but much better than new 5er.
Besides RR / Bentley, the only interiors I have been impressed by is from Genesis. The G90 and GV80 coupe were just great. It’s what Lexus should be if it evolved properly.
08-26-24, 11:31 AM
#30
Pole Position
