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The $1b investment in 1986 for the LS is only about $2.6b in today’s dollars. If Lexus spend the same amount every 10 years on the same principals and discipline as the LS, they would be a market leader in the luxury segment.
Instead, Lexus is just a poor cousin of Toyota and gets minimal benefit from the $10b a year R&D - towards relentless pursuit of cutting production costs.
$2.6 billion is insane money for any car development project. Here's what else took $2.6 billion to develop - the Bugatti Veyron ($1.6 billion when it came out in 2005). The Tesla Model S, which was essentially made from scratch, took $2.1 billion to develop ($1.5 billion in 2011 dollars). Meanwhile Lexus's most expensive project since the LS400, the LFA, cost $800 million in 2010 dollars which is only $1.2 billion in today's money. All of these aforementioned cars also took huge losses per unit sold.
The LS400 wasn't just an expensive car to develop, it's a demonstration of just how insane Japan's economy was at the time when it was actually profitable despite selling at half the price of the S-Class. Such circumstances will never happen again in our living history for Japan or any other country.
$2.6 billion is insane money for any car development project. Here's what else took $2.6 billion to develop - the Bugatti Veyron ($1.6 billion when it came out in 2005). The Tesla Model S, which was essentially made from scratch, took $2.1 billion to develop ($1.5 billion in 2011 dollars). Meanwhile Lexus's most expensive project since the LS400, the LFA, cost $800 million in 2010 dollars which is only $1.2 billion in today's money. All of these aforementioned cars also took huge losses per unit sold.
The LS400 wasn't just an expensive car to develop, it's a demonstration of just how insane Japan's economy was at the time when it was actually profitable despite selling at half the price of the S-Class. Such circumstances will never happen again in our living history for Japan or any other country.
$2.6 billion also seemed to get put to better use by 80s/90s toyota, like i'd always championed toyota for being particularly efficient and making the most of its spending but idk about that anymore
I can't believe I'm reading this. Engineers have 'discovered a lack of body rigidity'?
That's like 101 - affects cabin noise, suspension tuning, handling, ride and comfort, how well your interior joints/fastenings etc. hold up over time - like one of the most fundamental things.
How're they just 'discovering' this in 2024?! Where have they been all these years? I don't get it.
A rigid chassis makes all the difference in the world (drive a lower-end convertible if you don't believe me). So crazy this news...
I can't believe I'm reading this. Engineers have 'discovered a lack of body rigidity'?
That's like 101 - affects cabin noise, suspension tuning, handling, ride and comfort, how well your interior joints/fastenings etc. hold up over time - like one of the most fundamental things.
How're they just 'discovering' this in 2024?! Where have they been all these years? I don't get it.
A rigid chassis makes all the difference in the world (drive a lower-end convertible if you don't believe me). So crazy this news...
Its been on the back burner because Toyota/Lexus owners are myopic enough to drive a suv from 2006 all the way through 2023 with no changes and fork over 60k+ every 4 years for an unchanged version of the same thing. If people buy anyway why change?
Its been on the back burner because Toyota/Lexus owners are myopic enough to drive a suv from 2006 all the way through 2023 with no changes and fork over 60k+ every 4 years for an unchanged version of the same thing. If people buy anyway why change?
That's better than changing for changes sake. Now even those long time Lexus owners are reluctant to stay with the brand.
There has been plenty of rigidity improvements from 2010 to 2013 and from 2016 to 2020 RXs. Driven them all and I can tell.
Its been on the back burner because Toyota/Lexus owners are myopic enough to drive a suv from 2006 all the way through 2023 with no changes and fork over 60k+ every 4 years for an unchanged version of the same thing. If people buy anyway why change?
Amazes me people kept going back over and over for this melatonin inspired interior
$2.6 billion also seemed to get put to better use by 80s/90s toyota, like i'd always championed toyota for being particularly efficient and making the most of its spending but idk about that anymore
$2.6 billion also seemed to get put to better use by 80s/90s toyota, like i'd always championed toyota for being particularly efficient and making the most of its spending but idk about that anymore
That's better than changing for changes sake. Now even those long time Lexus owners are reluctant to stay with the brand.
There has been plenty of rigidity improvements from 2010 to 2013 and from 2016 to 2020 RXs. Driven them all and I can tell.
Yeah but they should actually make meaningful improvments over time, the difference from a 2010 RX to a 2020 is minimal at best and only like 12% stiffer and a wet noodle vs contemporaries. That's not a hard and fast BAD thing though, a softer structure can lend a particular character to a car I guess......I like the BOF feel in a truck or SUV myself.
Lexus should benchmark their new cars against the original LS
You are living in a strange distorted past.
Originally Posted by 703
see all the areas they have regressed on over the last 20 years.
Absurd Lexus now offers sedan awd. Superior fuel economy. Better towing capabilities with their BOF trucks. LS400 had a stupid timing belt (VW still uses them) why don’t we NOT go back to that stupidity. New Lexus models look better than the LS era which were boring and dull.
I will say Lexus should go back to the SC430 design. Way better looking than the LC (inside and out). … but that dumb timing belt..and no AWD on the LC500
Absurd Lexus now offers sedan awd. Superior fuel economy. Better towing capabilities with their BOF trucks. LS400 had a stupid timing belt (VW still uses them) why don’t we NOT go back to that stupidity. New Lexus models look better than the LS era which were boring and dull.
I will say Lexus should go back to the SC430 design. Way better looking than the LC (inside and out). … but that dumb timing belt..and no AWD on the LC500
You are completely missing the point. Benchmarking is about areas that it can improve on, not areas that it is already better at.
Just like Lexus benchmarked BMWs chassis for rigidity , not their engines for unreliability.
what is the big deal about a belt? Most people don’t even need to change the timing belt in their life time of ownership, and it’s actually quieter.
Sc430 was a fail. Had the worse reviews ever, wasn’t a proper replacement for the Sc400.
Marketing has taken a huge hit in the last 10 years too.
From this smokeshow...
To this dude.
Their cars aren't the only place they should have noticed a dramatic loss of rigidity.
I think that’s sums it all up. From Lexus who were proud of their flagships, to have nothing to show but jumping on the bandwagon social trends to be relevant.
08-30-24, 02:16 AM
Lexus now offers sedan awd. Superior fuel economy. Better towing capabilities with their BOF trucks. LS400 had a stupid timing belt (VW still uses them) why don’t we NOT go back to that stupidity. New Lexus models look better than the LS era which were boring and dull.