Honda Ridgeline starts at $28,215
02-05-05, 09:27 AM
#16
Originally Posted by flipside909
The Ridgeline may have all this HP, but it's high end horsepower that will have it struggling for the low end torque that most Honda engines lack for towing purposes. Sure it will have 255 hp, but by the time you're at the crest of a grade, it's just now hitting VTEC for the power.
02-05-05, 10:36 AM
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
The history behind this vehicle.
Honda has been selling more than ever. They are very conservative and only sold cars even until the mid 90s. Dealers were SCREAMING for a SUV and a Truck, as loyal Honda owners were simply going elsewhere.
The first deal was with Isuzu. Remember the Acura SLX? Probably not but that was one of the 1st luxury SUVs (it was a redadged Isuzu Trooper) and a huge failure. Honda got the Passport, which was a rebadged Isuzu Trooper. That SUV sold well.
Honda develped the small Odyessy and gave Isuzu their version as part of the deal, the Oasis. The Odyessy did not sell well but showed promise.
Then Honda gave us the CR-V which was one of the first small SUVs with the Toyota Rav4, it was and is a huge success.
Dealers were still SCREAMING for a Honda truck, the SUvs are selling, why not a truck. Honda kept saying NO, we don't do trucks.
Honda made the 2nd gen Odyessy which was the best minivan ever and was a trememndous success. Next came the Acura MDX and Honda Pilot based off the Odyessy, 2 more successes for them. The Element was supposed to be the "Scion" for Honda, but the average buyer is like 50. But it sells well.
WE WANT A TRUCK. WE WANT A TRUCK screamed the dealers.
Honda finally gave in but remember, they are conservative and can be stubborn. So they gave them a car based truck.
Remember the RX 300 was the 1st car based SUV. It invented the segment. Many thought it might be a disaster. It is the best selling Lexus and the leader in the segment.
So there is a possibility, that this Ridgline may do the same for trucks, if people can get past the simply horrible looks.
Honda has been selling more than ever. They are very conservative and only sold cars even until the mid 90s. Dealers were SCREAMING for a SUV and a Truck, as loyal Honda owners were simply going elsewhere.
The first deal was with Isuzu. Remember the Acura SLX? Probably not but that was one of the 1st luxury SUVs (it was a redadged Isuzu Trooper) and a huge failure. Honda got the Passport, which was a rebadged Isuzu Trooper. That SUV sold well.
Honda develped the small Odyessy and gave Isuzu their version as part of the deal, the Oasis. The Odyessy did not sell well but showed promise.
Then Honda gave us the CR-V which was one of the first small SUVs with the Toyota Rav4, it was and is a huge success.
Dealers were still SCREAMING for a Honda truck, the SUvs are selling, why not a truck. Honda kept saying NO, we don't do trucks.
Honda made the 2nd gen Odyessy which was the best minivan ever and was a trememndous success. Next came the Acura MDX and Honda Pilot based off the Odyessy, 2 more successes for them. The Element was supposed to be the "Scion" for Honda, but the average buyer is like 50. But it sells well.
WE WANT A TRUCK. WE WANT A TRUCK screamed the dealers.
Honda finally gave in but remember, they are conservative and can be stubborn. So they gave them a car based truck.
Remember the RX 300 was the 1st car based SUV. It invented the segment. Many thought it might be a disaster. It is the best selling Lexus and the leader in the segment.
So there is a possibility, that this Ridgline may do the same for trucks, if people can get past the simply horrible looks.
02-05-05, 10:39 AM
#18
Dysfunctional Veteran
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Couple of things I'd like to point out. First, there is some truth to your statement that unibody vehicles can more easily and more extensively get frame damage on impact than ladder-frame vehicles, and sometimes require frame-rail machines to repair, but you are exaggerating it somewhat. Today's unibodies and space-frame vehicles are designed and tested on super-computers using high-strength alloy metals and other materials and are given extensive crash tests before they are ever put into production. We are also talking about a multi-ton vehicle here, not a small subcompact.
Second, as far as your comment about geezers driving trucks and SUVs being dangerous, statistics show that inexperienced teen-agers and young people roll them over at a significantly higher rate than older people.....mostly because teens often try to corner them too hard for their high centers of gravity or let them tilt too far over at an angle off-road. Older people usually flip them trying to avoid obstacles like deer. Newer SUVs are making stability systems standard, and one, the Volvo XC-90), even has a roll-stability system in addition to the more common yaw-sensor one.
Second, as far as your comment about geezers driving trucks and SUVs being dangerous, statistics show that inexperienced teen-agers and young people roll them over at a significantly higher rate than older people.....mostly because teens often try to corner them too hard for their high centers of gravity or let them tilt too far over at an angle off-road. Older people usually flip them trying to avoid obstacles like deer. Newer SUVs are making stability systems standard, and one, the Volvo XC-90), even has a roll-stability system in addition to the more common yaw-sensor one.
I also commented on teenagers getting ahold of them, but you are mostly correct. I think the teenagers rolling them more goes without saying, but i shoudl have mentioned it, sorry.
My main concern is that people in general will think they are in a car while driving and as such will drive it like they do a car. But its not a 2000lb Civic, Its a 5,000 lb truck.
I have worked around engine and auto body repair for most of my life. the fact is, that unibodies only need a tap in 1 area and they are toast. I dont believe i am exxagerating at all. I have seen a 98 GS400 get tapped on the left corner of the rear bumper which pushed it into another car (which was arguably too close) on the left corner of the front bumper. Speeds involved never exceeded 20MPH. That GS's doors didnt line up, the trunk didnt close, the hood had a 1/2 inch gap between it and the fender going from headlight to windshiled and a 1 inch separation in the air, .the roof panel had ot be repalced, but only after the car was stretched back into position on that side. then the entire car had to be sanded, reinforced where the metal was weak from stretching, sanded again and then repainted. To a cost of more than $5,000.
Industry standard fro frame straightening is currently $975 an inch. This car was straightend and 2 inches of slack were removed. Then the floorpan had to be re-welded where it was straightened it and it tore.
Unibodies are the worst idea ever as far as repairs go. But they are innovative in that they help keep you from dying because they allow things like crumple zones to be used. The US has not seen a full frame compact car since the GEN I Corolla. But in that time, injuries from auto accidents have gone up only relative to the increase in drivers. So they must be doing something right as far as saftey goes.
And i stand by my statemenet that the first time you do any kind of substantial off roading, you will be in for frame straightening.
i hope this is a more fair statement.
Last edited by ArmyofOne; 02-05-05 at 10:44 AM.
02-05-05, 10:41 AM
#19
Lexus Champion
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 2,175
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by flipside909
This is not even a truck. It's a chopped up Honda Odyssey. It's a pansy truck if anything. 
wont be long when you'll hear stories of trannies failing on these because it strained to carry a load of groceries in the cargo area.
wont be long when you'll hear stories of trannies failing on these because it strained to carry a load of groceries in the cargo area.Caveat Emptor.
M.
02-05-05, 02:11 PM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by ArmyofOne
I also commented on teenagers getting ahold of them, but you are mostly correct. I think the teenagers rolling them more goes without saying, but i shoudl have mentioned it, sorry.
My main concern is that people in general will think they are in a car while driving and as such will drive it like they do a car. But its not a 2000lb Civic, Its a 5,000 lb truck.
I have worked around engine and auto body repair for most of my life. the fact is, that unibodies only need a tap in 1 area and they are toast. I dont believe i am exxagerating at all. I have seen a 98 GS400 get tapped on the left corner of the rear bumper which pushed it into another car (which was arguably too close) on the left corner of the front bumper. Speeds involved never exceeded 20MPH. That GS's doors didnt line up, the trunk didnt close, the hood had a 1/2 inch gap between it and the fender going from headlight to windshiled and a 1 inch separation in the air, .the roof panel had ot be repalced, but only after the car was stretched back into position on that side. then the entire car had to be sanded, reinforced where the metal was weak from stretching, sanded again and then repainted. To a cost of more than $5,000.
Industry standard fro frame straightening is currently $975 an inch. This car was straightend and 2 inches of slack were removed. Then the floorpan had to be re-welded where it was straightened it and it tore.
Unibodies are the worst idea ever as far as repairs go. But they are innovative in that they help keep you from dying because they allow things like crumple zones to be used. The US has not seen a full frame compact car since the GEN I Corolla. But in that time, injuries from auto accidents have gone up only relative to the increase in drivers. So they must be doing something right as far as saftey goes.
And i stand by my statemenet that the first time you do any kind of substantial off roading, you will be in for frame straightening.
i hope this is a more fair statement.
My main concern is that people in general will think they are in a car while driving and as such will drive it like they do a car. But its not a 2000lb Civic, Its a 5,000 lb truck.
I have worked around engine and auto body repair for most of my life. the fact is, that unibodies only need a tap in 1 area and they are toast. I dont believe i am exxagerating at all. I have seen a 98 GS400 get tapped on the left corner of the rear bumper which pushed it into another car (which was arguably too close) on the left corner of the front bumper. Speeds involved never exceeded 20MPH. That GS's doors didnt line up, the trunk didnt close, the hood had a 1/2 inch gap between it and the fender going from headlight to windshiled and a 1 inch separation in the air, .the roof panel had ot be repalced, but only after the car was stretched back into position on that side. then the entire car had to be sanded, reinforced where the metal was weak from stretching, sanded again and then repainted. To a cost of more than $5,000.
Industry standard fro frame straightening is currently $975 an inch. This car was straightend and 2 inches of slack were removed. Then the floorpan had to be re-welded where it was straightened it and it tore.
Unibodies are the worst idea ever as far as repairs go. But they are innovative in that they help keep you from dying because they allow things like crumple zones to be used. The US has not seen a full frame compact car since the GEN I Corolla. But in that time, injuries from auto accidents have gone up only relative to the increase in drivers. So they must be doing something right as far as saftey goes.
And i stand by my statemenet that the first time you do any kind of substantial off roading, you will be in for frame straightening.
i hope this is a more fair statement.
I made it clear in my post that unibodies were more susceptable to impact damage than box-ladder frames, but auto makers have had to balance that fact against a number of other issues such as space efficiency, vehicle weight, the ability of unibodies to make a vehicle more rattleproof, and the tendency for large ladder-frame SUV's to inflict catastrophic damage on small cars.
Since you are experienced in this area, one of the best ideas, IMO, to come along yet for accident repair has been Saturn's space-frame body with the plastic panels clipped to them....you just unclip the panel, remove the damaged one, repaint, plug the lights and reflectors back in, and that's it. Sometimes you can order the panels from the factory pre-painted, which makes it even easier. Look at the low insurance rates for Saturn plastic-panel cars...that alone tells a lot of the story. The cheapest car I ever owned, hands-down, to insure was an SL-2. Unfortunately, the bean-counters at GM are forcing Saturn to become just another GM division instead of the unique company it has been.....and the plastic-panels will soon be gone. They are already gone from the new Saturn Relay minivan.
02-05-05, 02:36 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
The history behind this vehicle.
Honda has been selling more than ever. They are very conservative and only sold cars even until the mid 90s. Dealers were SCREAMING for a SUV and a Truck, as loyal Honda owners were simply going elsewhere.
The first deal was with Isuzu. Remember the Acura SLX? Probably not but that was one of the 1st luxury SUVs (it was a redadged Isuzu Trooper) and a huge failure. Honda got the Passport, which was a rebadged Isuzu Trooper. That SUV sold well.
Honda develped the small Odyessy and gave Isuzu their version as part of the deal, the Oasis. The Odyessy did not sell well but showed promise.
Then Honda gave us the CR-V which was one of the first small SUVs with the Toyota Rav4, it was and is a huge success.
Dealers were still SCREAMING for a Honda truck, the SUvs are selling, why not a truck. Honda kept saying NO, we don't do trucks.
Honda made the 2nd gen Odyessy which was the best minivan ever and was a trememndous success. Next came the Acura MDX and Honda Pilot based off the Odyessy, 2 more successes for them. The Element was supposed to be the "Scion" for Honda, but the average buyer is like 50. But it sells well.
WE WANT A TRUCK. WE WANT A TRUCK screamed the dealers.
Honda finally gave in but remember, they are conservative and can be stubborn. So they gave them a car based truck.
Remember the RX 300 was the 1st car based SUV. It invented the segment. Many thought it might be a disaster. It is the best selling Lexus and the leader in the segment.
So there is a possibility, that this Ridgline may do the same for trucks, if people can get past the simply horrible looks.
Honda has been selling more than ever. They are very conservative and only sold cars even until the mid 90s. Dealers were SCREAMING for a SUV and a Truck, as loyal Honda owners were simply going elsewhere.
The first deal was with Isuzu. Remember the Acura SLX? Probably not but that was one of the 1st luxury SUVs (it was a redadged Isuzu Trooper) and a huge failure. Honda got the Passport, which was a rebadged Isuzu Trooper. That SUV sold well.
Honda develped the small Odyessy and gave Isuzu their version as part of the deal, the Oasis. The Odyessy did not sell well but showed promise.
Then Honda gave us the CR-V which was one of the first small SUVs with the Toyota Rav4, it was and is a huge success.
Dealers were still SCREAMING for a Honda truck, the SUvs are selling, why not a truck. Honda kept saying NO, we don't do trucks.
Honda made the 2nd gen Odyessy which was the best minivan ever and was a trememndous success. Next came the Acura MDX and Honda Pilot based off the Odyessy, 2 more successes for them. The Element was supposed to be the "Scion" for Honda, but the average buyer is like 50. But it sells well.
WE WANT A TRUCK. WE WANT A TRUCK screamed the dealers.
Honda finally gave in but remember, they are conservative and can be stubborn. So they gave them a car based truck.
Remember the RX 300 was the 1st car based SUV. It invented the segment. Many thought it might be a disaster. It is the best selling Lexus and the leader in the segment.
So there is a possibility, that this Ridgline may do the same for trucks, if people can get past the simply horrible looks.
I'd like to add just two comments. First, as far as Honda selling just cars till the mid-90's, Honda DID sell a car-based tall-body Civic AWD wagon in the mid-80's that was actually a cross between a small car and a micro-van. Nissan, at the time, also sold a similiar tall-body crossover AWD Sentra along the same lines....as were the Mitsubishi, Plymouth, and Eagle triplets.
Don't know if this fits your definition of a "car" or not, but just thought I'd mention them.
Second, I remember the Acura SLX well. It was indeed a rebadged, better-trimmed Isuzu trooper. Honda decided to do their first SUV's this way instead of spending the money to develop their own because they had a large and extensive buisness partnership with Isuzu going back some years. When Isuzu dropped the I-Mark sedan here in the U.S. it continued the I-Mark in Japan but relied on Honda for rebadged Civics to market in Japan as the new I-Mark....we never saw that car here in the U.S. In return, Isuzu agreed to allow Honda to borrow its Rodeo, which became the Honda Passport, and the Trooper, which became the Acura SLX.
The Passport sold OK but never had anywhere near the Rodeo's popularity, partly because of the Rodeo's lower price and better warranty. The SLX, I agree, was a failure, but I think mostly from the panning that Consumer Reports gave it from the roll-over tests and the Not Acceptable rating.....a rating, of course, shared by the somewhat more popular Trooper, which also suffered declining sales from that.
02-06-05, 02:25 PM
#22
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IL
Posts: 2,854
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by ArmyofOne
I also commented on teenagers getting ahold of them, but you are mostly correct. I think the teenagers rolling them more goes without saying, but i shoudl have mentioned it, sorry.
My main concern is that people in general will think they are in a car while driving and as such will drive it like they do a car. But its not a 2000lb Civic, Its a 5,000 lb truck.
I have worked around engine and auto body repair for most of my life. the fact is, that unibodies only need a tap in 1 area and they are toast. I dont believe i am exxagerating at all. I have seen a 98 GS400 get tapped on the left corner of the rear bumper which pushed it into another car (which was arguably too close) on the left corner of the front bumper. Speeds involved never exceeded 20MPH. That GS's doors didnt line up, the trunk didnt close, the hood had a 1/2 inch gap between it and the fender going from headlight to windshiled and a 1 inch separation in the air, .the roof panel had ot be repalced, but only after the car was stretched back into position on that side. then the entire car had to be sanded, reinforced where the metal was weak from stretching, sanded again and then repainted. To a cost of more than $5,000.
Industry standard fro frame straightening is currently $975 an inch. This car was straightend and 2 inches of slack were removed. Then the floorpan had to be re-welded where it was straightened it and it tore.
Unibodies are the worst idea ever as far as repairs go. But they are innovative in that they help keep you from dying because they allow things like crumple zones to be used. The US has not seen a full frame compact car since the GEN I Corolla. But in that time, injuries from auto accidents have gone up only relative to the increase in drivers. So they must be doing something right as far as saftey goes.
And i stand by my statemenet that the first time you do any kind of substantial off roading, you will be in for frame straightening.
i hope this is a more fair statement.
My main concern is that people in general will think they are in a car while driving and as such will drive it like they do a car. But its not a 2000lb Civic, Its a 5,000 lb truck.
I have worked around engine and auto body repair for most of my life. the fact is, that unibodies only need a tap in 1 area and they are toast. I dont believe i am exxagerating at all. I have seen a 98 GS400 get tapped on the left corner of the rear bumper which pushed it into another car (which was arguably too close) on the left corner of the front bumper. Speeds involved never exceeded 20MPH. That GS's doors didnt line up, the trunk didnt close, the hood had a 1/2 inch gap between it and the fender going from headlight to windshiled and a 1 inch separation in the air, .the roof panel had ot be repalced, but only after the car was stretched back into position on that side. then the entire car had to be sanded, reinforced where the metal was weak from stretching, sanded again and then repainted. To a cost of more than $5,000.
Industry standard fro frame straightening is currently $975 an inch. This car was straightend and 2 inches of slack were removed. Then the floorpan had to be re-welded where it was straightened it and it tore.
Unibodies are the worst idea ever as far as repairs go. But they are innovative in that they help keep you from dying because they allow things like crumple zones to be used. The US has not seen a full frame compact car since the GEN I Corolla. But in that time, injuries from auto accidents have gone up only relative to the increase in drivers. So they must be doing something right as far as saftey goes.
And i stand by my statemenet that the first time you do any kind of substantial off roading, you will be in for frame straightening.
i hope this is a more fair statement.
Basically, I think everyone is missing the intended market for a truck like this. It is the guy who needs to carry some stuff occasionally - but for the most part he/she drives to work everyday on regular roads. I doubt that many of the Ridgeline buyers will ever take it off road (I should say I hope they don't) - but the fact is the vehicle will provide car like qualities (or dis-qualities) while allowing the ability to carry stuff occasionally. It is not a work truck.
PS - no stealing my new word dis-qualities
02-06-05, 05:33 PM
#23
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 2,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Great discussion!
I must admit that when I saw the MSRPs listed in the beginning of this thread I just about choked on my Sierra Nevada. But then I thought about a possible pricing strategy... If you'll allow me to stereotype here for a moment, your average American truck buyer is a Ford or Chevy loyalist. One of the things they've come to expect from those companies is rebates--HUGE rebates! American car companies are offering multi-thousand dollar deals off of their sticker prices, and the gullible consumer (well, at least some guillible consumers) is falling for it. "Look, Della! I got me this here truck for FIVE THOUSAND off sticker!" Never mind that it's an overpriced piece of crap even at that big discount, and that they would have been better off buying a higher-quality vehicle, maybe even for less money, but that wasn't discounted so heavily.
So Honda could just be setting their sticker prices artificially high, knowing that they can offer big ol' rebates to draw in the truck buyer who's come to expect that sort of thing. Thoughts?
I must admit that when I saw the MSRPs listed in the beginning of this thread I just about choked on my Sierra Nevada. But then I thought about a possible pricing strategy... If you'll allow me to stereotype here for a moment, your average American truck buyer is a Ford or Chevy loyalist. One of the things they've come to expect from those companies is rebates--HUGE rebates! American car companies are offering multi-thousand dollar deals off of their sticker prices, and the gullible consumer (well, at least some guillible consumers) is falling for it. "Look, Della! I got me this here truck for FIVE THOUSAND off sticker!" Never mind that it's an overpriced piece of crap even at that big discount, and that they would have been better off buying a higher-quality vehicle, maybe even for less money, but that wasn't discounted so heavily.
So Honda could just be setting their sticker prices artificially high, knowing that they can offer big ol' rebates to draw in the truck buyer who's come to expect that sort of thing. Thoughts?
02-06-05, 07:45 PM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by Iceman
Great discussion!
I So Honda could just be setting their sticker prices artificially high, knowing that they can offer big ol' rebates to draw in the truck buyer who's come to expect that sort of thing. Thoughts?
I So Honda could just be setting their sticker prices artificially high, knowing that they can offer big ol' rebates to draw in the truck buyer who's come to expect that sort of thing. Thoughts?
Of course, they have never tried to break into the American pickup market before, either.....the very DEFINITION of owner loyalty. For Honda, that could be a whole new ball game.
Last edited by mmarshall; 02-06-05 at 07:51 PM.
02-07-05, 04:11 PM
#25
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 2,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree with you--what I theorized WOULD be a big departure for Honda in terms of pricing.
But then they always tend to undercut the market--the MDX is a great example. When it came out, it was far and away the best product in its class, at a price thousands less than the competition. Honda has also mastered the art of production management--they don't tend to end up with inventory sitting on their lots. They also don't create such a huge shortage that folks who want the product get totally fed up. They balance it so that demand just exceeds supply, leading to those sticker price (or slight mark-up) sales, where people are happy to have gotten the product and don't care.
So this is the first time they've come out with a new product that leaves most of us scratching our heads, thinking it's overpriced. Maybe, just maybe, they're going to use a different pricing model if the thing doesn't fly out of the showrooms at that high sticker price.
But then they always tend to undercut the market--the MDX is a great example. When it came out, it was far and away the best product in its class, at a price thousands less than the competition. Honda has also mastered the art of production management--they don't tend to end up with inventory sitting on their lots. They also don't create such a huge shortage that folks who want the product get totally fed up. They balance it so that demand just exceeds supply, leading to those sticker price (or slight mark-up) sales, where people are happy to have gotten the product and don't care.
So this is the first time they've come out with a new product that leaves most of us scratching our heads, thinking it's overpriced. Maybe, just maybe, they're going to use a different pricing model if the thing doesn't fly out of the showrooms at that high sticker price.
02-08-05, 11:06 AM
#27
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by Iceman
I agree with you--what I theorized WOULD be a big departure for Honda in terms of pricing.
But then they always tend to undercut the market--the MDX is a great example. When it came out, it was far and away the best product in its class, at a price thousands less than the competition. Honda has also mastered the art of production management--they don't tend to end up with inventory sitting on their lots. They also don't create such a huge shortage that folks who want the product get totally fed up. They balance it so that demand just exceeds supply, leading to those sticker price (or slight mark-up) sales, where people are happy to have gotten the product and don't care.
So this is the first time they've come out with a new product that leaves most of us scratching our heads, thinking it's overpriced. Maybe, just maybe, they're going to use a different pricing model if the thing doesn't fly out of the showrooms at that high sticker price.
But then they always tend to undercut the market--the MDX is a great example. When it came out, it was far and away the best product in its class, at a price thousands less than the competition. Honda has also mastered the art of production management--they don't tend to end up with inventory sitting on their lots. They also don't create such a huge shortage that folks who want the product get totally fed up. They balance it so that demand just exceeds supply, leading to those sticker price (or slight mark-up) sales, where people are happy to have gotten the product and don't care.
So this is the first time they've come out with a new product that leaves most of us scratching our heads, thinking it's overpriced. Maybe, just maybe, they're going to use a different pricing model if the thing doesn't fly out of the showrooms at that high sticker price.
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Good job, Mike....you have summed it up pretty well.
I'd like to add just two comments. First, as far as Honda selling just cars till the mid-90's, Honda DID sell a car-based tall-body Civic AWD wagon in the mid-80's that was actually a cross between a small car and a micro-van. Nissan, at the time, also sold a similiar tall-body crossover AWD Sentra along the same lines....as were the Mitsubishi, Plymouth, and Eagle triplets.
Don't know if this fits your definition of a "car" or not, but just thought I'd mention them.
Second, I remember the Acura SLX well. It was indeed a rebadged, better-trimmed Isuzu trooper. Honda decided to do their first SUV's this way instead of spending the money to develop their own because they had a large and extensive buisness partnership with Isuzu going back some years. When Isuzu dropped the I-Mark sedan here in the U.S. it continued the I-Mark in Japan but relied on Honda for rebadged Civics to market in Japan as the new I-Mark....we never saw that car here in the U.S. In return, Isuzu agreed to allow Honda to borrow its Rodeo, which became the Honda Passport, and the Trooper, which became the Acura SLX.
The Passport sold OK but never had anywhere near the Rodeo's popularity, partly because of the Rodeo's lower price and better warranty. The SLX, I agree, was a failure, but I think mostly from the panning that Consumer Reports gave it from the roll-over tests and the Not Acceptable rating.....a rating, of course, shared by the somewhat more popular Trooper, which also suffered declining sales from that.
I'd like to add just two comments. First, as far as Honda selling just cars till the mid-90's, Honda DID sell a car-based tall-body Civic AWD wagon in the mid-80's that was actually a cross between a small car and a micro-van. Nissan, at the time, also sold a similiar tall-body crossover AWD Sentra along the same lines....as were the Mitsubishi, Plymouth, and Eagle triplets.
Don't know if this fits your definition of a "car" or not, but just thought I'd mention them.
Second, I remember the Acura SLX well. It was indeed a rebadged, better-trimmed Isuzu trooper. Honda decided to do their first SUV's this way instead of spending the money to develop their own because they had a large and extensive buisness partnership with Isuzu going back some years. When Isuzu dropped the I-Mark sedan here in the U.S. it continued the I-Mark in Japan but relied on Honda for rebadged Civics to market in Japan as the new I-Mark....we never saw that car here in the U.S. In return, Isuzu agreed to allow Honda to borrow its Rodeo, which became the Honda Passport, and the Trooper, which became the Acura SLX.
The Passport sold OK but never had anywhere near the Rodeo's popularity, partly because of the Rodeo's lower price and better warranty. The SLX, I agree, was a failure, but I think mostly from the panning that Consumer Reports gave it from the roll-over tests and the Not Acceptable rating.....a rating, of course, shared by the somewhat more popular Trooper, which also suffered declining sales from that.
Thanks, I did not know some of those facts.
Well at our superbowl party, when the ads were playing (which as well all know, people look at the ads just as much as the game) the Ridgline scored a 1 outta 10. Even the Honda guys there were like "WTF is that". And it seems they WILL push the fact its a "Honda" as that is what the last phrase in the ad states "Above all, its a Honda". Or something like that. I can't blame them and its a good strategy, to draw loyalists and people who expect reliability and quality from Honda.
Looking at the brand new Tacoma and the new Frontier, this Ridgeline is
. No trucks, no V-8s etc etc, the Honda way of things.
02-08-05, 04:18 PM
#28
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
Posts: 2,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not a truck guy, and I think the Ridgeline is only slightly less offensive looking than the Chevy Avalanche and Cadillac Escalade EXT, but I actually thought the tagline "Above all, it's a Honda" was rather clever.
First, it does appeal to Honda loyalists, a very passionate group. Second, the ads always ended with the truck high on a mountaintop, "above all" it surveyed. And this play on words continues with the unspoken message that this new offering is somehow superior to all competitors. To put it in print, replace the comma with a semicolon. "Above all; It's a Honda".
First, it does appeal to Honda loyalists, a very passionate group. Second, the ads always ended with the truck high on a mountaintop, "above all" it surveyed. And this play on words continues with the unspoken message that this new offering is somehow superior to all competitors. To put it in print, replace the comma with a semicolon. "Above all; It's a Honda".
02-09-05, 11:04 AM
#29
Lexus Test Driver
I think the rebate strategy that Iceman mentioned is where Honda will be going. You have to know the market in order to sell there.
Anyway, here's from yesterday 's Auto Industry news:
BorgWarner Drivetrain Group Powers the Honda Ridgeline
BorgWarner will provide its electronically controlled all-wheel drive InterActive Torque Management II (ITM II) system to the 2006 Honda Ridgeline.
Ridgeline is the mid-size front-wheel drive-based pickup with which Honda Motor Co. officially enters the truck market. The company estimates that it will sell 50,000 Ridgelines this year.
The BorgWarner ITM system electronically senses when a vehicle's front wheels slip and instantaneously transfers power to the rear wheels. The system individually controls the rear wheels to offer side-to-side or single-wheel torque management. BorgWarner engineers based the new system on their electronic innovations in rear-wheel drive systems for larger sport-utility vehicles first introduced in the mid-1990s.
February 8, 2005
Anyway, here's from yesterday 's Auto Industry news:
BorgWarner Drivetrain Group Powers the Honda Ridgeline
BorgWarner will provide its electronically controlled all-wheel drive InterActive Torque Management II (ITM II) system to the 2006 Honda Ridgeline.
Ridgeline is the mid-size front-wheel drive-based pickup with which Honda Motor Co. officially enters the truck market. The company estimates that it will sell 50,000 Ridgelines this year.
The BorgWarner ITM system electronically senses when a vehicle's front wheels slip and instantaneously transfers power to the rear wheels. The system individually controls the rear wheels to offer side-to-side or single-wheel torque management. BorgWarner engineers based the new system on their electronic innovations in rear-wheel drive systems for larger sport-utility vehicles first introduced in the mid-1990s.
February 8, 2005
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
I8ABMR
Car Chat
6
08-06-10 04:24 PM
