chicagoblknazn

I think the car is overpriced as well. I was looking at one this past weekend and it didn't jump at me. It's a beautiful car but I was not really impressed with the price and all.

The CL is a whole different ballgame. I'd take that beast over a GS anytime. But i'd keep the GS though.......i'll still need something to get me around town when while the CL is in the shop....which would be most of the time

lkirchner

I have a 2003 CL that has yet to be in the shop. Just wish I could have said the same thing for my dearly departed SC 430.

Come on fellows/girls. There are problems with all cars and I don't think you can generalize. As I said my SC was a POS and my LS 430 has not been 100% bullet proof but I have not posted on the MB boards about my experiences and tthankful that I had a Mercedes to drive when my Lexi were in the shop.

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

I'm happy to hear you've had decent luck with your benzes. I've had only one and it was horrible. Since it was a daily driver, maybe they don't get really bad until they accumulate high milage. After 70K miles, it was a nightmare. And it never stopped. I've posted this website before for people who think we're exaggerating...all these people can't be wrong www.lemonmb.com

XeroK00L

That's a pretty "coarse" language, dude. Please be a little more civilized around here.

Personally I think the CLS looks great inside and out when I saw it in person in the last MB test drive event. The material used in general was pretty high-grade. It looks less impressive to me in most pictures though.

flipside909

Can you say ignorant?

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

I'll speak for myself and try to answer your question. I bring up benz because I want to like them. The designs are mostly beautiful and bold. The ride feels like no other car. It's hard to explain. No other feels like a benz. Some might feel better but a benz is unmistakeable. Even the smell. One of a kind. It feels like luxury. You feel safe in it. You feel....I hate to say it...I won't. Just feels good. I'll never forget the day we took it home. All giddy inside. Outside too.
When the car started going to the shop every other month for EXPENSIVE repairs....it's like a traumatic event. I was sooo disappointed. I expected so much from that premium name with it's long history. The first real car was made by Carl Benz. I long for the day when MB returns to it's rightful place. It's no where near there now....NO WHERE NEAR!

Also, we talk about benz just like we talk about many cars. Most us us are real enthusiasts. Talk about the GNP and it's interesting. Talk about cars and our eyes light up. I really like my Lexus cars. I want to really like Benz. I just can't right now. Nothing wrong with that.

lkirchner

You might be correct but I traded my SC with 1,745 miles on it; far from high mileage and it could truly be one of the worst ownership experiences that I have ever had; coming in a close second to my 1967 XKE. I have owned MB's continuosly since 1968 and do have to admit that the quality has gone down hill but my limited experience with Lexus (2 cars purchased within 3 months) has not convinced me that this is truly a superior Marque. When I reflect back on the first MB that I owned, it was primitive in comparison to today's version; no antilock, no nav, no CD player, dealer installed A/C, no alloy wheels, MB tex interior, no brake by wire, no ESP and heavens forbid no CUPHOLDERS, etc. They were simple cars. I still own 3 highly collectible MB's that were well ahead of their time but outdated by today's standards. However every product has its peaks and valleys.

When Lexus attacked the market with their brilliant strategy to compete with Benz and BMW, to a lesser extent ,they truly threw the book out the door. I do not mean this in a negative manner; they really knocked the socks off of the perceived luxury leaders . Look back at the pricing of the top of the line Lexus back then and look at the price of an LS 430 Ultra today. It is somewhat severe in a matter of a mere 14 to 15 years. It's obvious that the price war was on. Then there was the service issue, free loaners, pick up the car and deliver it at home, etc. Today, dirty loaners, if they have them or Enterprise rent a wrecks out of your pocket book. Statements such as "they all do this", "true the paint is fragile", etc, were something that I would expect from a Dodge dealer. This service initiative is to a large degree vanishing today and being replaced with Customer Satisfation Managers who call and really do not give a rat's A** about what you say but are compensated on contacting you. That aside let's talk in another 35 to 36 years about the Lexus quality (Safe statement for me, since I probably will not be here then).


I have no idea what you own but from my "Ultimate Pursuit of Perfection" experience this performance has truly gone down hill--- more appropriately in an elevator shaft. My experience has been worse than the poorest that I have ever received at a Benz dealer and trust me at times , at MB, it has been less than perfect. Perhaps this is my own isolated Lexus experience but I do not believe that this is the case from other people who have experinced the same.

We all buy cars for a different reason; some pure transportation, some the quiet ride, some for the "feel" and some for the love of the Marque. As "they say don't knock 'till you tried it". My experience with the SC 430 was similar to Jaguars that I have owned--- tremendous car to park in the garage and admire but truly a magnificant disappointment to drive and own. Perhaps I should post on one of the Lemon Sites as well. However I will not do that but to each their own. I know and truly respect those who are enamored with their SC'c and probably have had tremendous ownership experiences with them. Unfortunately, I purchased a $65,000 car that was not adequate and I was not one of those who had that wonderful experience. So your one experience with Mercedes is equal to that of mine with Lexus; that does not make for a valid discussion, does it?

TRDFantasy

I heard the CLS actually uses some Chrysler parts ... don't know if it's true though.

I have sat in the CLS myself ... and it feels just too .... tight. The interior room I think is very small, especially for it's size. The "coupe" design of the CLS sacrifices alot in terms interior space. I have also sat in the GS, and to me, it just felt roomier. I checked the dimensions of both the GS and the CLS ... and I am correct. In terms of headroom, and legroom, both front and rear, the GS is roomier. The CLS is tied for shoulder room with the GS. One thing the CLS gets a for is having more trunk space than the GS. And what a surprise, that the CLS is longer and wider than the GS. Also, this should come as no surprise that the CLS is a porker .... weighing about 250 pounds more than a GS430. Now, which design is better is subjective, but one thing I will say is that the CLS ... when I first saw it ... reminded me of a Lexus with those "stretched" lights. It's funny how so many hate the stretched lights on a Lexus, yet nobody has said a thing about the CLS lights . The front of the CLS just screams Japanese, not German, IMHO.

Also, let me just say, I definitely feel the CLS is overpriced ... but what do you expect from MB these days? These days, you're paying a lot of money for reputation and brand image of an MB, as well as "perceived initial quality".

lkirchner

Read my previous post. What is is your basis of comparison? Magazine reviews don't cut it; ownership experience is your best teacher.

TRDFantasy

Although you may have owned many MB cars ... you have not owned many Lexus cars, so you cannot make a "fair" comparison either. I really don't know what so about my post. I made mostly objective observations about the CLS, so I don't see what's wrong. And are you seriously going to tell me that the CLS DOES NOT have any Japanese styling cues from the front, or IS NOT overpriced? I'd be curious as to how you could back up statements such as these.

I rarely read magazine reviews ... I don't believe in them. I try and make statements based on my own self-education, and personal experience.

It is no secret that MB cars *generally* have electrical issues. It is also no secret that *generally* .... Lexus leads all other auto makers in terms of quality. And since MBs today are full of electronics, a lot of problems potentially result. The electrical systems that the German makers use are too complicated, and the wiring of the electrical systems can become one big mess. Toyota uses a foolproof system for their wiring, where the wires all make a "click" sound, and all connect via plastic connectors. This ensures a proper and secure connection is made with the wires.

There's tons of surveys, reports, and forum posts that prove Lexus generally has less qulaity problems than any other auto maker, including MB. I didn't mention heresay or word of mouth as that *could* potentially be misleading.