OlschoolGs

okay heres the story. my brother was going east bound, in the #1 lane. he went under a green, and was in the middle at yellow. a lady in a old buick turned left, and my brother braked, and she braked too, and my brother clipped her quarter panel and almost lost control. so his es300 is basically totaled, i barely drove it home. there was a witness, and said that my brother was driving furiously, and ran the red. but the witness arrived at the scened 8-10min after the accident. and when my brother asked the lady in the buick if she was okay she said ya, so the police said they wont come unless someones injured. when the witness went to talk to the lady, she all of the sudden said her neck and back hurt. they both were swearing at my brother. for a fact i know my brothers not at fault, but will what the the witness said my brother ran the red(which he didnt) will change the dispute? and plus she was blowing smoke out of her *** after having a witness saying her back and neck hurt, and swearing at my brother and acting immature. im just curious because i know my brothers not a liar(i wasnt at the scene of the accident), but just in case this witness goes through with her phony statement, i want to know whos fault it is even if my brother ran the red, which he didnt.
HERES A PIC OF WHAT THE ACCIDENT LOOKED LIKE

UDel

There was an accident in the middle of an intersection where one or two cars were heavily damaged and the police did not show up because there wasn't an injury? I believe police are required to be called if there is at least any major damage to one vehicle for insurance sake but maybe things are different where you live. If the lady had a green arrow which most likely there was for turning across three lanes of traffic then your brother ran the light and is at fault. There is no way a light is going to change that fast unless he ran the red light or she went when she wasn't supposed to. If she did not have a green arrow for turning then she has to wait for the lanes to be clear to make a turn and it is her fault if she just went out in oncoming traffic. If she was hit hard she could have been in shock or not feel any pain while she was inside the car. It is possible to start to feel pain when she got out or when the state of shock wore off. I find it odd if no police showed up then there was no ticket and the insurance company's will have to determine fault. Still doesn't look good for your brother if her lane had a green arrow unless you can prove she went when she wasn't supposed to and there is also a witness saying you brother was driving aggresively..

rominl

iTrader: (4)

i will post what i know, just take my words for it

1) police didn't come that's true. in cali cops are ***. and they don't care wtf is the accident, as long as no one is hurt they don't give a damn. another reason why i hate them
2) whether you know your brother lied or not is meaningless, it doesn't mean anything to the system
3) if there is no witness, your brother wins for sure
4) with the witness saying what he's saying, your brother will most likely lose the battle. witness is very critical. as long as he says your brother ran red in high speed, it's done deal.
5) whether they acted immature or swore at your brother it didn't matter, that's just life
6) a lot of lame people they pretend to be hurt and claim insurance frault money. this is another classic example. it's up to your brother's insurance to fight, if they choose to
7) your only chance now is to get a witness to prove that your bother was running through the yellow light at a reasonable speed. without that it's bad.

sorry if i sounded mean, but it's reality. didn't happen to me but close enough, i totally know how you feel, but nothing you can do about it besides being logical and face it

nthach

i smell insurance fraud.

flipside909

I do this for a living. Here's my assessment.

1) Police Reports are usless to insurance companies sometimes because we will base our information on the account of our insured and the other parties involved. Sometimes law enforcement will add their recommendations, but we will apply the proper Vehicle Codes that were violated in a case of argument. PR's will be taken down only if there was any injury involved or if the accident was a major one to where they need to tow/arrest or impound a vehicle. If there were no injuries and both parties have exchanged information, PR is not necessary, especially for the Insurance company. It's a guideline, but not the ultimate source for insurance company's liability decision.

2) Since this is a one sided account...but looking at your drawing, the lady crossed your brother's right of way. She should be put at fault. If your brother is describing everything you explained it, his insurance carrier shouldn't have a problem with setting fault on the lady turning left.

3) But this is where the cards may flip. If the lady was already in the intersection making her left turn legally at the green w/no protected arrows, and was about to complete it, if your brother was trying to speed up to beat the yellow or make it into the intersecion from a far distance and he hit her at that point of impact, it would be your brother's fault for the accident because 1) he was approaching the intersection and should have been able to use good judgement to avoid the collision or 2) he was going above the posted speed limit or sped up to catch the light.

It's tough to make a fair assessment on this accident w/o getting the other party's account of the whole accident especially when the facts are biased to one party only.

flipside909

If the lady were to claim against OlschoolGs' brother for injury and it was clear that she was at fault for the claim, the insurance company will deny her claim. We know the signs and signals to look for when fraud comes about. It's a serious federal offense if caught.

GS3Tek

iTrader: (8)

From what you described, I see 2 things against her:

1) witness ARRIVED 8-10 minutes LATER, NOT at the scene of accident.
2) she already said she wasn't injured, hence police did not come out. IF she was immediately injured, there wouldn't be any hesitation on her part!!!!!!!

I smell LIAR LIAR!
The main thing to discredit the witness is witness was not at crime scene at time of accident.
Good luck to your brother.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

what if he said he drove by and had to come back to the scene? i mean, if someone is trying to fraud you, they find their ways

mmarshall

I'll let Flip correct me if I'm wrong, but insurance fraud doesn't usually set up this kind of accident. Usually the people committing the fraud will use a car with very effective ABS brakes, speed up past you looking for a hole in the left lane and a situation where you won't be able to escape or manuver into another lane, then suddenly pull in front of you when you are not expecting it, hit the ABS full-force, come to a dead stop in just couple of seconds....without a trail of rubber to show what they did, thanks to the ABS...... and hope you will rear-end them. They have trained people in the car with them just waiting for the impact to "claim" everything from whiplash injuries to broken bones....plus the car damage. Unless fraud can be proved....difficult with several "witnesses" in the car committing the fraud.....in a rear-end impact the car behind is usually at fault.

Now back to this accident. You say your brother's ES was totalled. He must either have a very old one that won't take much to total it, or he must have been moving at a pretty good clip when he hit that Buick. If your brother had just started up on a green from a dead stop at the intersection, it is unlikely he would have been going fast enough when he hit her to do a lot of damage....or total his car. He only would have been doing about 10 or so. He must have gone through the intersection at a fairly good rate of speed.....which suggests that he had a yellow light and speeded up....a very common practice.
However, I am not sure your brother is at fault. If the lady in the Buick did not have a clear green light, or even better, a green left-turn arrow, then she MUST yield to oncoming traffic...including your brother. Even WITH a regular green light, of course, she must still yield.

What we don't know, of course, is exactly what the lights looked like at the moment of impact. That, of course, depends on witnesses. If that third "witness" was not there at the time of impact but showed up 10 minutes later, then THAT is where fraud might come in. It sounds to me like a crooked trial lawyer looking for buisness who was in the right place ten minutes too late. That is probably why he went up to the lady and got her to change her story. If your brother is telling the truth, and if that lady has any conscience and morals at all, both should testify under oath that he is not a true witness, should it eventually wind up in court.
Good luck....let us know how it turns out.

flipside909

Explained very well.

OlschoolGs

my brother and i were raised in a family of morals, and were told not to lie when it came to matters like this. so i believe every word of my brother. so according to him, he was going 35-38 and went into the intersection under a green, right when he passed the crosswalk it turned yellow, and the lady was turning by then, and my brother braked, and the lady braked also instead of speeding up. the reason my brothers car was totaled because he hit a friggin buick right at the headlight, and it smashed the whole fender. i work at a wrecking yard and i know totaled when i see it
things that need to be repaired on the car(1993 es300):
1. new radiator support
2. new headlight
3. new fender
4. new bumper/reinforcement
5. hood
6. right side aprine is buckled
6. the nose of the frame is bent
count the parts, and labor, it will come out to like $4500, which is the value of the car.
PS. were getting an attorney since the lady is claiming body injuries, and since there the so called "witness" that arrived 10minutes after. oh another thing, right when the witness found out the cops were coming to get a report, she left and didnt stick around. weird huh?

gekisai29

1.how do tou know the witnesswasn't actually at the scene if oyu were not? 2. i happen to be a tial lawyer & i dom'y have the time, patience or desire to handle phony cases. this is not the appropiate place to discuss this further. let the insurance carriers hash it out but please remember that insurance companies have lawyers too. nuff said

flipside909

Well said.

BTW, I need an atty rep ltr before I can converse any matters regarding about our insured your client. Haha jk!

RA40

iTrader: (6)

Flip and MM said it all for me as well.

mmarshall

You sound like a honest lawyer. The fact that you joined CL says something right there.
Unfortunately there are some lawyers who are NOT. And I agree...we won't go into any more details here...so I'll drop it.