BMW: Lexus is not in big league yet
03-09-05 | 03:55 PM
#1
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BMW: Lexus is not in big league yet
http://europe.autonews.com/article.cms?articleId=55582
BMW: Lexus is not in big league yet
Toyota premium brand begins push in Europe
By Douglas A. Bolduc
Automotive News Europe / March 07, 2005
Toyota's Lexus brand is not yet a global player as a luxury marque, says German rival BMW.
"Toyota has lots of cash, but we are still waiting to welcome them in the premier league," said Stefan Krause, BMW board member in charge of finance.
BMW rivals such as Lexus, Saab, Infiniti and Jaguar are successful in one or possibly two key markets, but not globally.
Krause said only two premium brands can call themselves global: BMW and Mercedes-Benz. He pointedly ignored Volkswagen's Audi brand.
Stuart McCullough, Lexus Europe director, said: "We have a lot of work to do in Europe. But I hope people are starting to see where we are headed from our products and stand at the show."
As part of its ambition to catch BMW, Lexus aims to boost its sales in Europe, helped by its new IS lower-premium sedan, which debuted here with Lexus' first diesel engine.
The IS will go on sale in Europe with a new 2.5-liter, V-6 gasoline engine by the end of the year. A diesel version with a 175hp, 2.2-liter four-cylinder unit will follow early next year.
No build-to-order
Lexus aims to sell 65,000 cars in Europe by 2010. McCullough thinks the brand can reach that goal because of improvements to its powertrain options.
Besides offering diesel variants, Lexus plans to offer gasoline-electric powertrains in most of its models starting with the RX 400h, the hybrid version of its SUV, which goes on sale in Europe in June.
BMW's Krause said he will consider Lexus a true global rival when it has:
Designs that appeal worldwide
A consistent brand image in markets around the globe
A factory in Europe that can provide tailor-made build-to-order cars, which European premium customers demand.
Said McCullough: "I don't think build-to-order is the mark of a premium brand. We think there is room for us on the global stage.
BMW: Lexus is not in big league yet
Toyota premium brand begins push in Europe
By Douglas A. Bolduc
Automotive News Europe / March 07, 2005
Toyota's Lexus brand is not yet a global player as a luxury marque, says German rival BMW.
"Toyota has lots of cash, but we are still waiting to welcome them in the premier league," said Stefan Krause, BMW board member in charge of finance.
BMW rivals such as Lexus, Saab, Infiniti and Jaguar are successful in one or possibly two key markets, but not globally.
Krause said only two premium brands can call themselves global: BMW and Mercedes-Benz. He pointedly ignored Volkswagen's Audi brand.
Stuart McCullough, Lexus Europe director, said: "We have a lot of work to do in Europe. But I hope people are starting to see where we are headed from our products and stand at the show."
As part of its ambition to catch BMW, Lexus aims to boost its sales in Europe, helped by its new IS lower-premium sedan, which debuted here with Lexus' first diesel engine.
The IS will go on sale in Europe with a new 2.5-liter, V-6 gasoline engine by the end of the year. A diesel version with a 175hp, 2.2-liter four-cylinder unit will follow early next year.
No build-to-order
Lexus aims to sell 65,000 cars in Europe by 2010. McCullough thinks the brand can reach that goal because of improvements to its powertrain options.
Besides offering diesel variants, Lexus plans to offer gasoline-electric powertrains in most of its models starting with the RX 400h, the hybrid version of its SUV, which goes on sale in Europe in June.
BMW's Krause said he will consider Lexus a true global rival when it has:
Designs that appeal worldwide
A consistent brand image in markets around the globe
A factory in Europe that can provide tailor-made build-to-order cars, which European premium customers demand.
Said McCullough: "I don't think build-to-order is the mark of a premium brand. We think there is room for us on the global stage.
03-09-05 | 04:06 PM
#2
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So my thoughts.
1. No one knew who the fock BMW was in the 60s and 70s.
2 This is the same ridiculous arrogance that caught them in the 90s when Lexus hit the scene.
3. Its not just Lexus on the rise, almost every luxury company is much improved.
4. First the Audi guy then this BMW clown. Lexus is a threat clearly to them, or they would not have mentioned it.
5. Designs that appeal worldwide? Like Bagle creations? You can have it.
6. BMW makes most of their profit with sales IN AMERICA, where Lexus is beating them with sales. BMW is seen as common in Europe, not the Lords Chariot like some believe here.
Now don't get me wrong, he is right.
Lexus has no M models, AWD just came out, you cannot custom order a Lexus with 10 different woods and leathers, no V-12s, etc. No SLR, No Z8s, no image boosters and 100k models.
But clearly, Lexus is #1 in America now. And he just shot at Lexus in Europe. And Lexus seems to have finally woken up there. Imagine what happended to BMW and Benz in America, happens to Europe in 20 years.
1. No one knew who the fock BMW was in the 60s and 70s.
2 This is the same ridiculous arrogance that caught them in the 90s when Lexus hit the scene.
3. Its not just Lexus on the rise, almost every luxury company is much improved.
4. First the Audi guy then this BMW clown. Lexus is a threat clearly to them, or they would not have mentioned it.
5. Designs that appeal worldwide? Like Bagle creations? You can have it.
6. BMW makes most of their profit with sales IN AMERICA, where Lexus is beating them with sales. BMW is seen as common in Europe, not the Lords Chariot like some believe here.
Now don't get me wrong, he is right.
Lexus has no M models, AWD just came out, you cannot custom order a Lexus with 10 different woods and leathers, no V-12s, etc. No SLR, No Z8s, no image boosters and 100k models. But clearly, Lexus is #1 in America now. And he just shot at Lexus in Europe. And Lexus seems to have finally woken up there. Imagine what happended to BMW and Benz in America, happens to Europe in 20 years.
03-09-05 | 04:09 PM
#3
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From: East Bumble F, NJ
It is attitude like this that has caused the quality and design of BMW and MB to fall faster than superman jumping off the empire state building while wearing a kryptonite necklace!!
They wont have any respect for the comepetition until it is too late and they suddenly realize they have lost their global market share!!
They wont have any respect for the comepetition until it is too late and they suddenly realize they have lost their global market share!!
03-09-05 | 04:14 PM
#4
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From: Canada
The BMW guy is right, I can't see Lexus having the same kind of sales success in Europe as in America, catching them & exceeding them in sales there, unless there is the widespread use of Lexus as taxicabs in Europe 
as with MB & BMW cars, I don't think that day will come.
as with MB & BMW cars, I don't think that day will come.
Last edited by Gojirra99; 03-09-05 at 04:18 PM.
03-09-05 | 04:34 PM
#7
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
BMW's Krause said he will consider Lexus a true global rival when it has:
Designs that appeal worldwide
Last edited by LexFather; 03-11-05 at 02:35 PM.
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03-09-05 | 04:59 PM
#8
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From: Washington
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
http://europe.autonews.com/article.cms?articleId=55582
A factory in Europe that can provide tailor-made build-to-order cars, which European premium customers demand.
Said McCullough: "I don't think build-to-order is the mark of a premium brand. We think there is room for us on the global stage.
A factory in Europe that can provide tailor-made build-to-order cars, which European premium customers demand.
Said McCullough: "I don't think build-to-order is the mark of a premium brand. We think there is room for us on the global stage.
And why did he leave out Audi in his discussion??? They're as german as the other 2.
James
03-09-05 | 06:18 PM
#10
Lead Lap
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From: California
Only time will tell, but i somewhat agree with krause. Lexus, as well as other luxury brands have a long way to go. Though maybe not as long for toyota/lexus 
Also remember that most bmws sold are cars. For lexus, the majority of sales consist of suvs (from the RX, GX, etc.) In Europe, they seem to like cars more..
Also remember that most bmws sold are cars. For lexus, the majority of sales consist of suvs (from the RX, GX, etc.) In Europe, they seem to like cars more..
03-09-05 | 06:58 PM
#11
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,331
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From: New York
BMW shouldn't be talking crap since they are producing some of the most hideous luxury cars inside/out.........BUT they do have a point. Lexus is not on the same level as MB and BMW.
IMO Lexus will conquer Europe in the next decade and will eventually be on a higher level than MB and BMW.
IMO Lexus will conquer Europe in the next decade and will eventually be on a higher level than MB and BMW.
totally
03-09-05 | 08:13 PM
#13
The thing this clown forgets is that Lexus may go after EMERGING MARKETS more aggressively than Europe. Sure there's lots of money spent in Europe, but it pales in comparison with the potential of China and even India. And why would Lexus want a factory in Europe? So they could make cars more expensive with worse quality? Of course Europe protects its car brands with GIANT TARRIFFS so if Lexus gets "too big for Europe" they will no doubt slam even higher tarriffs on them.
As the 'electronics wars' continues, this will be the biggest challenge for BMW and MB. Can they actually make all that embedded software reliable? The Japanese have had DECADES of building reliable user friendly embedded consumer software, for Walkmans, VCRs, DVD players, game systems, and so on.
As the 'electronics wars' continues, this will be the biggest challenge for BMW and MB. Can they actually make all that embedded software reliable? The Japanese have had DECADES of building reliable user friendly embedded consumer software, for Walkmans, VCRs, DVD players, game systems, and so on.
03-09-05 | 08:25 PM
#15
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From: Canada
Actually, BMW is building cars in China already as a joint venture with a local manufacturer. All the BMW's built there(3 & 5 series) are sold locally.Toyota also build cars in China as well, but not Lexus models.