bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

OK, so they want it all! If it keeps pushing the car companies, great.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Most cars? I don't think so. Plus, better handling and steering doesn't automatically mean a rough ride. They can CONTRIBUTE to ride comfort - for example, passengers don't like falling to the left or right as the car body leans like a boat on cheesy old fashioned suspensions.

More precise steering means less steering corrections while driving, and less driver fatigue.

We're not talking Ferrari Testarossa (a brute to drive and uncomfortable) vs. 80's Lincoln Town Car (inefficient land barge with more float and lean than a kayak).

Large wheels, low profile tires, and especially those AWFUL run flat tires though all contribute to worse ride quality.

SUVs have become very comfortable. All Lexus vehicles focus on ride comfort. Mainstream vehicles like Camrys have very good ride comfort. Of course Buicks have great ride comfort - I went in one not to long ago and was very impressed how quiet and comfortable the experience was.

LOL. No, I think the 'rat pack fans' that liked them all died.

True, but there's another factor on horsepower. Manufacturers have added hundreds of pounds of safety equipment to vehicles plus the people IN the vehicles have gotten heavier, so cars actually need more horsepower. A 200HP mid-size car these days certainly doesn't feel quick.

Of course no-one NEEDS the power of an E55 or M5 for example but power is nothing new - people have always wanted it since cars began.

Right, enthusiasts are people too. They have practical needs. Carrying a couple of kids and the dog in an SUV is WAY easier than anything else.

spwolf

same thing happens in Europe, you are not alone in your thoughts. I have often commented in the past year to automotive writers how cars these days are stiff and really hardly comfortable, and it is them that make it worse.

Believe it or not, it took me a month to get used to my 2005.5 Euro Prius harsh setup, which felt a lot stiffer than my Corolla TS. I found our new MPV - Corolla Verso (lik Mazda 5) to be pretty damn harsh car for an family MPV. Then I read an review of MPV's where Corolla Verso was called too soft :-).

Automotive press is way too influental when it comes to mainstream cars. Todays family car tires are what was considered low profile 3-4 years ago. It makes no sense....

doug_999

mmarshal, can't disagree more with your comments. Bit has pretty much summed up my feelings, however, I will also point out that the "enthusiasts" do not like the Camry but instead prefer the Accord. But the Camry outsells the accord.

In short, I think they have plenty of influence, but not nearly as much as you think (and they certainly were not responsible for whitewalls going away LOL!).

mmarshall

It's not so much my comments, Doug, or of agreeing or disagreeing with them. It's what they themselves, the auto press, think...and write. Unlike us who chat cars all day long but don't have much real influence with auto manufacturers, when these people express their opinions, auto executives are more inclined to listen. Recent trends in auto design prove it...it's not really a matter of your opinion or mine.

The Accord has been on Car and Driver's 10 best list now for so many years it is virtually an institution. Yes, the Camry outsells it, but both cars sell in such huge numbers that the difference, percentage-wise, is negligable. And while the auto mags generally prefer the Accord's chassis they like the Camry's refinement.

mmarshall

Don't get the impression that I think everything should be like a Town Car either. While I strongly dislike I-Drive, I do enjoy driving BMW's simply for their superb steering feel...probably the world's best among cars with power steering. That is more of a matter of how they set up their power-steering gear, though, then ultra-stiff underpinnings.

mmarshall

OK....I'll meet you partway here. Perhaps I could have restated it a little differently, but the point is the same...the so-called enthusuast crowd has always disliked whitewalls. I have mixed feelings about them myself. Some look nice, but the full-profile whitewalls of the 40's and 50's and on some 70's vintage pimp-mobiles were ridiculous.

doug_999

Ok, Ok, I see where you are going. Very true that they have influence - a lot to be exact.

I just hope that Lexus starts to listen to them!

Incendiary

http://media.vw.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=9812

http://media.audiusa.com/article_dis...rticle_id=9697

http://nissannews.com/corporate/news...04101737.shtml

spwolf

actually, i dont think they should listen to them too much...

doug_999

C&D has the highest # of subscribers of any auto mag (last time I checked). Seems people agree with what they write (I know I do) - so it is often in their (the automotive companies) best interests to listen to these guys.

Let's be real -if driving a car can be more fun, why not?

Gojirra99

I think Lexus will make cars to suit the taste of the majority of the real world car buyers based on their own market research. They have done a good job on that & that's why they have been so successful so far.

Incendiary

Porsche:
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2...04/204904.html