Acura to debut new MDX at NYIAS(updated pg.10)
04-14-06, 03:17 PM
#121
Originally Posted by GSteg
Are you my twin brother? 
Good point on the legend though. That car was the one that started the whole japanese luxury import. While I'm sure the LS460 will be a nice car, it's just a remodeled LS-series. Nothing that will pop out of the ordinary, as there will be Mercedes S-class and BMW 7-series around.
Then again, we can't forget that:
Steering response/feeling: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
High speed stability feel: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
Fun factor/Driving experience: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
Driver's car: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
But then again, Acura offers 4 cyl so no matter what, lexus wins by default
Good point on the legend though. That car was the one that started the whole japanese luxury import. While I'm sure the LS460 will be a nice car, it's just a remodeled LS-series. Nothing that will pop out of the ordinary, as there will be Mercedes S-class and BMW 7-series around.
Then again, we can't forget that:
Steering response/feeling: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
High speed stability feel: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
Fun factor/Driving experience: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
Driver's car: Acura/Infiniti > Lexus
But then again, Acura offers 4 cyl so no matter what, lexus wins by default
04-14-06, 03:32 PM
#123
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I don't really have a position on the new IS, TL, or the upcoming new G35 because I've not driven any of those vehicles and haven't spent enough time researching them to get a second-hand consensus; I was just stating what it is that I thought Mike may have meant.
I feel Lexus' appeal fading as their prices rise in a push they hope will move them up-market. Even if Lexus does succeed and positions itself, in consumer's minds, in league with MB and BMW, I don't think being a volume leader, as they are, will allow for a total prestige takover.
Lexus needs to ensure that in attempting several steps forward they don't end up taking a few back. In my opinion they're headed into a situation of decreasing returns to scale in pursuing the Euro-luxury standard.
M.
I feel Lexus' appeal fading as their prices rise in a push they hope will move them up-market. Even if Lexus does succeed and positions itself, in consumer's minds, in league with MB and BMW, I don't think being a volume leader, as they are, will allow for a total prestige takover.
Lexus needs to ensure that in attempting several steps forward they don't end up taking a few back. In my opinion they're headed into a situation of decreasing returns to scale in pursuing the Euro-luxury standard.
M.
04-14-06, 07:11 PM
#126
Wow, this one came back from the dead 
I still don't get it. Maybe its because when I buy a car, I shop for the cars I like and prefer rather than shop for the brand. Lately Lexus has been the badge on the cars I buy, but that doesn't really mean anything too me. I guess I'm just not that brand loyal. Too me, if the car is good and performs it is a worthy car. I've driven enough cars from I4 to I6 to V6 to V8 as well as Toyota Tercells to exotic super cars to realize that I can manage to drive any of them on the street and as long as it performs well in its class it doesn't matter what engine is under the hood. If the I4 turbo performs well in the RDX that is all that matters. If it doesn't, than Acura has a problem. Everyone laughed at the 270HP V6 engine that powered the NSX when it came out, then that car spanked the competition with only that 270 HP and 224 lbs-ft of torque. Did it matter that the Ferrari 348 had a larger V8 in the engine compartment?
I still don't get it. Maybe its because when I buy a car, I shop for the cars I like and prefer rather than shop for the brand. Lately Lexus has been the badge on the cars I buy, but that doesn't really mean anything too me. I guess I'm just not that brand loyal. Too me, if the car is good and performs it is a worthy car. I've driven enough cars from I4 to I6 to V6 to V8 as well as Toyota Tercells to exotic super cars to realize that I can manage to drive any of them on the street and as long as it performs well in its class it doesn't matter what engine is under the hood. If the I4 turbo performs well in the RDX that is all that matters. If it doesn't, than Acura has a problem. Everyone laughed at the 270HP V6 engine that powered the NSX when it came out, then that car spanked the competition with only that 270 HP and 224 lbs-ft of torque. Did it matter that the Ferrari 348 had a larger V8 in the engine compartment?
04-15-06, 01:21 AM
#127
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Get this through your thick skulls.
Acura= the gheyest luxury brand you can buy.
Its ghey. A bunch of rebaged Hondas and FWD cars and their only AWD car, the RL, it s complete failure.
Does it sell. Yes, there are millions of clueless HOnda fans that will buy anything.
Now, they are not luxury, so please end the discussion.
Your best arguement is a damn 15 year old LEGEND (which I LOVE to death). Think about that. THe best ACURA sedan is DEAD.
Acura= the gheyest luxury brand you can buy.
Its ghey. A bunch of rebaged Hondas and FWD cars and their only AWD car, the RL, it s complete failure.
Does it sell. Yes, there are millions of clueless HOnda fans that will buy anything.
Now, they are not luxury, so please end the discussion.
Your best arguement is a damn 15 year old LEGEND (which I LOVE to death). Think about that. THe best ACURA sedan is DEAD.
04-15-06, 01:25 AM
#128
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The more I think of it if Lexus, BMW and Benz are Macy, Bloomingdale and Norsdtrom....
Acura is Wal-Mart.
They are a GOOD brand. They make the Honda faithful HAPPY. Its not even FUNNY how LEXUS came AFTER Acura and its like they don't even exisit.
You read mags, they say "Lexus-Like" or Lexus ride etc etc
They describe Acura (rarely) and its like "good value" like your buying a damn tomato from a midget in his underpants.
So pleaase enough, don't defend it. Acura is nice, but not luxury. If you think its luxury, you think OLIVE GARDEN is real Italian food.
Acura is Wal-Mart.
They are a GOOD brand. They make the Honda faithful HAPPY. Its not even FUNNY how LEXUS came AFTER Acura and its like they don't even exisit.
You read mags, they say "Lexus-Like" or Lexus ride etc etc
They describe Acura (rarely) and its like "good value" like your buying a damn tomato from a midget in his underpants.
So pleaase enough, don't defend it. Acura is nice, but not luxury. If you think its luxury, you think OLIVE GARDEN is real Italian food.
04-15-06, 02:39 AM
#129
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
Get this through your thick skulls.
Acura= the gheyest luxury brand you can buy.
Acura= the gheyest luxury brand you can buy.
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
Now, they are not luxury, so please end the discussion.
So at the beginning of your post, Acura is a luxury brand, but at the end of the post, it's not luxury anymore? You really need to make yourself more consistant. Your argument points are becoming less valid the more you put your opinion into it.
Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
Its ghey. A bunch of rebaged Hondas and FWD cars and their only AWD car, the RL, it s complete failure.
Does it sell. Yes, there are millions of clueless HOnda fans that will buy anything.
Does it sell. Yes, there are millions of clueless HOnda fans that will buy anything.
You're right. Acura is "ghey" because they are simply rebadged FWD Hondas. That's just as "ghey" as Lexus rebadging the Camry to an ES-series, or the toyota highlander into an RX-series. Hell, the LX470 is identical to the landcruiser, except the badge.
Does it sell. Yes, there are millions of clueless Toyota fans that will buy anything
Just know that whatever argument you make, make sure it doesn't work against you because it shows how valid your point is. In addition, I'm all about car debates, so it's a slim chance that I ever stop talking about it.
04-15-06, 06:21 AM
#130
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Luxury Brands.
Until there is a complete split from Toyota/Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Honda/Acura, the only real luxury brands are Mercedes and BMW.
Regardless if 1SICKLEX thinks Acuras are FWD Hondas or Infiniti's are RWD Nissans, the problem with this guy is that he REALLY wants to believe LEXUS has made the big time and is a luxury marque nameplate. To the real world and the bling bling crowd, we all know everybody wants a Mercedes SL, CLS, S, E Class and BMW 5, 6, 7 series. That's the real deal....You don't see celeb's cruising in a LS or even a SC. Lexus has made great strides, but in the end, its a Toyota.
As mentioned, the new ES is a Camry, most of the Lexus SUV's are actually Toyota's with real wood, better leather, ML Stereo and of course the Lexus badge. The same goes for the Infiniti's and Acura's. Its reality.
Until there is a separate design house for each Japanese Luxury brand and they start stamping Lexus, Infiniti, Acura on EVERY part in the car, lets face it...its Toyota, Nissan and Honda.
And to keep on topic, the MDX looks pretty futuristic. I guess Acura is finally looking to the future and might actually start designing separately from Honda. Only time will tell.
Until there is a complete split from Toyota/Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Honda/Acura, the only real luxury brands are Mercedes and BMW.
Regardless if 1SICKLEX thinks Acuras are FWD Hondas or Infiniti's are RWD Nissans, the problem with this guy is that he REALLY wants to believe LEXUS has made the big time and is a luxury marque nameplate. To the real world and the bling bling crowd, we all know everybody wants a Mercedes SL, CLS, S, E Class and BMW 5, 6, 7 series. That's the real deal....You don't see celeb's cruising in a LS or even a SC. Lexus has made great strides, but in the end, its a Toyota.
As mentioned, the new ES is a Camry, most of the Lexus SUV's are actually Toyota's with real wood, better leather, ML Stereo and of course the Lexus badge. The same goes for the Infiniti's and Acura's. Its reality.
Until there is a separate design house for each Japanese Luxury brand and they start stamping Lexus, Infiniti, Acura on EVERY part in the car, lets face it...its Toyota, Nissan and Honda.
And to keep on topic, the MDX looks pretty futuristic. I guess Acura is finally looking to the future and might actually start designing separately from Honda. Only time will tell.
04-15-06, 06:33 AM
#131
Originally Posted by static808
Luxury Brands.
Until there is a complete split from Toyota/Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Honda/Acura, the only real luxury brands are Mercedes and BMW.
Regardless if 1SICKLEX thinks Acuras are FWD Hondas or Infiniti's are RWD Nissans, the problem with this guy is that he REALLY wants to believe LEXUS has made the big time and is a luxury marque nameplate. To the real world and the bling bling crowd, we all know everybody wants a Mercedes SL, CLS, S, E Class and BMW 5, 6, 7 series. That's the real deal....You don't see celeb's cruising in a LS or even a SC. Lexus has made great strides, but in the end, its a Toyota.
As mentioned, the new ES is a Camry, most of the Lexus SUV's are actually Toyota's with real wood, better leather, ML Stereo and of course the Lexus badge. The same goes for the Infiniti's and Acura's. Its reality.
Until there is a separate design house for each Japanese Luxury brand and they start stamping Lexus, Infiniti, Acura on EVERY part in the car, lets face it...its Toyota, Nissan and Honda.
And to keep on topic, the MDX looks pretty futuristic. I guess Acura is finally looking to the future and might actually start designing separately from Honda. Only time will tell.
Until there is a complete split from Toyota/Lexus, Nissan/Infiniti, Honda/Acura, the only real luxury brands are Mercedes and BMW.
Regardless if 1SICKLEX thinks Acuras are FWD Hondas or Infiniti's are RWD Nissans, the problem with this guy is that he REALLY wants to believe LEXUS has made the big time and is a luxury marque nameplate. To the real world and the bling bling crowd, we all know everybody wants a Mercedes SL, CLS, S, E Class and BMW 5, 6, 7 series. That's the real deal....You don't see celeb's cruising in a LS or even a SC. Lexus has made great strides, but in the end, its a Toyota.
As mentioned, the new ES is a Camry, most of the Lexus SUV's are actually Toyota's with real wood, better leather, ML Stereo and of course the Lexus badge. The same goes for the Infiniti's and Acura's. Its reality.
Until there is a separate design house for each Japanese Luxury brand and they start stamping Lexus, Infiniti, Acura on EVERY part in the car, lets face it...its Toyota, Nissan and Honda.
And to keep on topic, the MDX looks pretty futuristic. I guess Acura is finally looking to the future and might actually start designing separately from Honda. Only time will tell.
Too bad MB is cutting jobs, BMW is gonna cut jobs and people who worked for the Rover plant are in jeopardy when BMW seperates. Toyota is on a hiring and production plant building frenzy
Last edited by 4TehNguyen; 04-15-06 at 06:36 AM.
04-15-06, 03:59 PM
#132
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You are absolutely right ! The MB's and BMW's in Europe are 4cylinder POS with cloth interiors. I remember renting a 520i in Monte Carlo from Avis. For $189/day, i was able to drive a 5 series with a 2liter engine. Boy it was slow....
The Germans have the nameplate so they have that going for them.
MB and BMW will eventually water down their images. The 1series and A & B class are on their way. Soon people will have to pick between a Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla or Mercedes A Class.
In the end its the car you want..and Lexus, Infiniti and Acura make great cars...
The Germans have the nameplate so they have that going for them.
MB and BMW will eventually water down their images. The 1series and A & B class are on their way. Soon people will have to pick between a Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla or Mercedes A Class.
In the end its the car you want..and Lexus, Infiniti and Acura make great cars...
04-15-06, 04:32 PM
#133
to be honest, calling RX an rebadged Highlander is pretty lol.
Europe is really something else. Problem is europe is high gas prices, high car taxes, which is why people pay more for 4cly BMW in Europe than I6 one in the USA. For the same price of 330i in USA, you can NOT buy cheapest 4cly 320 with manual ac in Europe.
Europe is really something else. Problem is europe is high gas prices, high car taxes, which is why people pay more for 4cly BMW in Europe than I6 one in the USA. For the same price of 330i in USA, you can NOT buy cheapest 4cly 320 with manual ac in Europe.
04-15-06, 04:39 PM
#134
Originally Posted by spwolf
to be honest, calling RX an rebadged Highlander is pretty lol.
Europe is really something else. Problem is europe is high gas prices, high car taxes, which is why people pay more for 4cly BMW in Europe than I6 one in the USA. For the same price of 330i in USA, you can NOT buy cheapest 4cly 320 with manual ac in Europe.
Europe is really something else. Problem is europe is high gas prices, high car taxes, which is why people pay more for 4cly BMW in Europe than I6 one in the USA. For the same price of 330i in USA, you can NOT buy cheapest 4cly 320 with manual ac in Europe.
True, The RX330 is definately more upscale than the Highlander. Although, after owning one new since 2003, I can say it is the least Lexus like vehicle aside from the other Lexus SUVs and although it wins a lot of awards and sells well, my cousins 2005 MDX is very much an equal and better than my RX330 in many areas. There are only three areas where I like the RX330 better. That is the style when all fixed up since there are more body kits and such for this car, the power rear hatch, and the HID headlights.
04-15-06, 04:53 PM
#135
Originally Posted by CK6Speed
True, The RX330 is definately more upscale than the Highlander. Although, after owning one new since 2003, I can say it is the least Lexus like vehicle aside from the other Lexus SUVs and although it wins a lot of awards and sells well, my cousins 2005 MDX is very much an equal and better than my RX330 in many areas. There are only three areas where I like the RX330 better. That is the style when all fixed up since there are more body kits and such for this car, the power rear hatch, and the HID headlights.