SteVTEC

I'd say the exact opposite in that BMW would be 10x more likely to turbo before supercharging because exhaust driven turbocharging is far more efficient than mechanically driven superchargers are. And you can design a turbo setup such that there is virtually no lag. Just look at VW's 1.8T and the 2.0 FSI engines. On a premium product like a BMW, they'd certainly spend the extra money on a VTG turbo I bet too.

SteVTEC

thx

been in surf-n-lurk mode lately.

Penforhire

I am more curious about the next M3. One of the ways BMW makes the M3 stay ahead of the regular 3-series is they never put a limited-slip differential in non-M cars. "Joe American," who ooh's and aah's over straight line acceleration, could probably care less but hardcore drivers do.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

I believe the next M3 will differ itself from the regular 3 inline 6 as well as this supposed turbo because it is a V8. By stepping up to the V8, the M3 is sort of moving away from that silky smooth high reving I6, but the V8 opens up a whole new world of engine performance for many years to come. The other thing is it probably will offer an SMG option whereas the E90 right now has dropped the SMG option and only offers a 6-Speed automatic tiptronic along with the manual.

Penforhire

Yeah, I hear rumors of a double-clutch SMG like Audi's highly-regarded system. I like the SMG concept but I never got a chance to drive one before they decided the general public complained too much about it.

TheRupp

It's a good idea, but that transmission is *****y. I've gotten the opportunity to drive an M3 equipped with one and by the end of the drive I was begging for a clutch or a "D" position on the gear selector

GFerg

That would be awsome if they produce a Double Clutch SMG. I drove an A3 with the DSG awhile back and that tranny is the TRUTH. It an incredible tranny. I would love to see this in a Lexus model in the near future.

TheRupp

Didn't Toyota offer a DSG/SMG style transmission in the MR2?

GFerg

You know what, I forgot about that one. Yea they did. I dont know much about it, but I think I read that a few customers werent that pleased with it. No fully auto mode and maybe some other shortcomings.

TheRupp

It was probably the first SMG/DSG style transmission out, so I doubt it was very sophisticated. Especially since the MR2 only had ~140 hp

spwolf

it was something similar to SMG, not dual clutch system. In MR2 it was called SMT and now it is called MMT. Toyota started offering it in small cars in Europe - Aygo, Yaris, Corolla and Corolla Verso, in 2005 it has been added to many cars and many different engines - 1.0, 1.3, 1.4D4D and 1.8. It is said to be perfect fit for small diesel in Corolla due to lots of torque.

It now has automatic mode as well (it has manual, automatic and automatic sport modes). I just tried it today in new Yaris. It is fine. If you really cared about manual transmission then it is just an toy really, it is not an substitute for manual. You dont control anything. And if you really wanted automatic you simply can not beat the smoothness of real automatic.

You have to learn how to shift with it, release the gas slightly before shifting and you wont feel the shift at all. However, if you simply press the gas pedal all the way like an dumb bear, you will feel it shifting - it is as if someone is shifting in the trunk for you (you feel clutch being depressed, gear selected and clutch released, its weird).

Reason Toyota puts it into small cars is that it is more affordable (they charge 2.5x less than for AT) and there is simply no power penalty. Imagine 70hp 3cly with AT? For larger engines, real auto is simply an better choice. Maybe I am spoiled by CVT in my prius.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

I think BMW, Audi, Ferrari and such already had their SMG type trannies out before Toyota came out with theirs in the last generation MR-S, or as some call it MR2 Spyder. Unlike others thought it never had a full auto mode.

spwolf

Incredibly enough, Toyota was faster than VW by 2 years (2003 vs 2001). SMG was released about the same time.

I read somewhere that all 3 systems are very much related, and are patented works of some small company from Norway, that has VW, BMW and Toyota as its investors. I am not sure how true is that, but it is interesting how all 3 systems dont overlap each other.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

If that is true that is kind if surprising. All those manufacturers have their own SMG type transmissions in their F1 cars or other race cars so its not like they can't build it themselves. Either way, with each new generation it only gets better and more refined.

stckyfngz

SMGII has D mode (auto mode)

just push the stick to right (toggles between auto and manual)

although I rarely use it