CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

I brought this up in another topic I started about Lexus hybrids. My question is if hybrids (I'm talking about a hybrid with a non hybrid version as well) sell for a premium over its non hybrid now, and if it is true that hybrids have a lower depreciation, wouldn't that make the hybrid version even more expensive on the used car market after 5 years? A used car buyer would have a greater savings from buying the used non hybrid version. Not too mention how many people will be willing to pay a premium on a used hybrid in 5 years for old technology?

spwolf

actually, mpg for used cars is even more important consideration than for new ones. Thats what we are finding out here as well when comparing diesels and petrol engines. This is why even gen 1 prius is holding up the price great.

LexFather

Also remember ya'll the more you DRIVE, the more a hybrid saves you. It doesn't make sense to lease or buy if you only drive 10-15k a year, you'll save maybe $600 a year in gas.

Now double that mileage yearly and you start saving thousands in gas.

And lets not forget, these cars burn CLEAN and pollute for less.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

So basically you are saying only a small percentage of people will benefit? I believe the national average is somewhere between 12-15K a year. I realize some travel a lot more than that and put on nearly 30K+ a year, but that is a minority.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

That is just a different perspective or perhaps just a European thing? Everyone I personally talked to at work or among friends all say they would not buy a 5 year old hybrid. All of us have the same idea. In 5 years the hybrid technology will be much better and cost less. When we are ready we'll just buy a brand new one rather than old technology. Tax credets for tghe hybrid AFAIK are only for the new car buyer anyway.

Someone posted that the next gen Prius might get close to 100 miles per gallon right? Why would anyone want to buy a 2005 Prius that gets about 50 MPG when in 2010 a hybrid might very well get 150 miles per gallon (I'm just throwing out a number) and probably cost cheaper when the cost of inflation is factored in?

LexFather

Technically, yeah, people will not save thousands of dollars in gas if they drive 12-15k a year, only after a few years. Of course that is excluding the tax credit.

Now over time, say you keep your Prius for 7-8 years, and with gas going up, yeah, its going to save you some money.

A lot of it is the "image" the same reason we live M or AMG cars. People like the fact they own a hybrid, and we both know with image, people don't care about the $$$$ factor. I think Bitkahuna brought this part up in another thread.

LexFather

The other thing is MPG maybe outdated and it hurts the point of buying a Hybrid. There has been talk by Toyota to push the govt to change to I think cost per mile (I think)

spwolf

based on that, why would anyone buy 1st gen Prius? Yet they hold value like crazy...
You could buy 2010 Prius, but it would cost you 28k... while 2005 would cost you 12k-13k and still save you money compared to Camry...

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

So far I see that as a problem. Not so much in cars like the Prius and Civic where people who buy those cars might keep it longer than 5 years, but with the majority of hybrid cars out I still think ownes will not keep their cars much longer than 5 years especially if the hybrid badge becomes a status and image thing. That is why the direction of hybrids seem all wrong too me. Those that are buying hybrids like these expensive Lexus hybrids can afford the gas, can afford the payments, and don't really need the cost savings. Those poor guys that desparately need a break from gas costs can't afford to buy a hybrid. Are hybrids turning out to be the rich man's new toy?

Mr Johnson

This story can easily be played two ways. It's not that sales aren't rising for the month. Quite the contrary for Prius, Civic and Accord hybrids sales declined 23, 23, and 69% year over year for March.

But, and this is a big butt errrr... but, YTD hybrid sales are up 7.5%. I think people are coming to terms with the marketing and determining the actual value of hybrid technologies to them. In general we see more people seeing an advantage but only in certain applications.

My $0.01 + tax.

bruce van

So far hybrids are definitely priced a little hight for the average consumer. Like all new technology, you pay a premium for being the first guy on the block to have the lastest gadgetry.

I hope companies can mass produce a decent looking hybrid car and bring the cost down to under $20K. Give me 60+ actual MPG and make it a coupe. I'll be one of the first people in line. Until then, I'll continue to feed my gas guzzling V8 on $3.39/gallon (Premium today ).

spwolf

and your V8 cost under 20k and is getting 60+ MPG? Nice! :-).

spwolf

Except that Prius is the hottest car in the USA with waiting list in its 3rd year of sales and average 6 days on the lot. Background of this is of course ramping up of Camry Hybrid production, which is why there are not enough Prius's around.

Top 2 most wanted and waited cars in the USA are hybrids, but I am glad that interest it slacking

:-).

Bercasio

iTrader: (1)

Analyst speak to soon, what Toyota has created is just the tip of the ice berg. Analyst along with other skpetical consumers expect way too much in such a short period of time. In the next few years Toyota will prove their point. Right now those who are skeptical, have no patience, as it's not an easy task to achieve, but one thing is for sure Toyota/Lexus will get to the finish line first as they continue to set the bar higher in hybrid technology, which makes it more difficult for the competition, from there people/analyst will soon say....."Ahhh!!!,.. Now I get it!!!"....

Mr Johnson

Where do you get "most wanted" from? Waiting and wanting are two different things. People wait a year for their Ferrari but that doesn't make it the hottest car just because it doesn't sit on the lot. Time on lot is a reasonable metric until you realize that the automakers really try to control that number to maximize profits (many stink at controlling it but Toyota seems to be an exception). The point of hybrids is to sell tons of them not have them be a niche market so if sales decline they decline.

I'd like to know what the limiting factor is. Is Toyota trying to control inventory very closely? Are the batteries or other parts of the hybrid powertrain in fixed production (If so what)? Or are consumers truly moving more towards the types of vehicles they prefer hybrids in (The Camry, RX400 and GS450 will tell the tale).