Review: 2007 Lexus ES350
#16
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Originally Posted by mmarshall
Outside, however, the same superb trim and paint quality that Lexus has always had still remains.
Like I said before - it's my opinion that they're getting sloppy all over the place. And I think I've seen enough to think so.
M.
#17
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Originally Posted by videcormeum
I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. I got that impression as soon as I had the opportunity to sit in the 3GS. I was totally underwhelmed. The 2GS interior had terrific ft and finish, quality of materials, and layout. Adding wood and/or metal doesn't make an interior.
I'm not sure what exactly is missing w/ the 3GS - but there's a noticeable drop in luxury from the 2GS IMO.
M.
I'm not sure what exactly is missing w/ the 3GS - but there's a noticeable drop in luxury from the 2GS IMO.
M.
#18
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mmarshall - you mentioned the dash squeaks in the ES during your test drive. While you didn't experience it with a 3GS, many owners are complaining about them also.
I think Lexus is walking a balancing act or trying to keep costs under control while making the interior and chassis stiff enough to not have audible creaks and squeaks above the extremely quiet drivetrains.
I think Lexus is walking a balancing act or trying to keep costs under control while making the interior and chassis stiff enough to not have audible creaks and squeaks above the extremely quiet drivetrains.
#19
Lexus Champion
The loaner ES350 I had last weekend was rock solid. No rattles or creaks. However, it only had 10 miles on the odometer when I left the dealership.
I found the ES350 quite enjoyable to drive. Although I missed the power of my 430, the new ES is certainly no slouch. Gas mielage was quite good. In the 300 miles I drove the car, I averaged about 26 MPG.
Exterior wise, the new ES is a huge improvement over the previous gen IMHO. I think Lexus did a great job with the redesign. The family resemblance is definitely apparent with the new GS , IS and ES. L-Finesse at work I guess.
The steering wheel controls are a bit different than my GS. While my GS controls are hard plastic, the ES controls have a soft covering over them. Not better or worse, just different. The guage cluster in the ES is quite nice. It took me a while to get used to the 2-pod layout, but the guages are beautiful at night.
And as others have noted before, the gen 5 nav display is simply awesome. Comparing it to the gen 4 display is like comparing HDTV to regular stardard definition broadcasts. Quite honestly, if I had plans of keeping my GS long-term, I'd be pissed.
I found the ES350 quite enjoyable to drive. Although I missed the power of my 430, the new ES is certainly no slouch. Gas mielage was quite good. In the 300 miles I drove the car, I averaged about 26 MPG.
Exterior wise, the new ES is a huge improvement over the previous gen IMHO. I think Lexus did a great job with the redesign. The family resemblance is definitely apparent with the new GS , IS and ES. L-Finesse at work I guess.
The steering wheel controls are a bit different than my GS. While my GS controls are hard plastic, the ES controls have a soft covering over them. Not better or worse, just different. The guage cluster in the ES is quite nice. It took me a while to get used to the 2-pod layout, but the guages are beautiful at night.
And as others have noted before, the gen 5 nav display is simply awesome. Comparing it to the gen 4 display is like comparing HDTV to regular stardard definition broadcasts. Quite honestly, if I had plans of keeping my GS long-term, I'd be pissed.
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by bitkahuna
mmarshall - you mentioned the dash squeaks in the ES during your test drive. While you didn't experience it with a 3GS, many owners are complaining about them also.
I think Lexus is walking a balancing act or trying to keep costs under control while making the interior and chassis stiff enough to not have audible creaks and squeaks above the extremely quiet drivetrains.
I think Lexus is walking a balancing act or trying to keep costs under control while making the interior and chassis stiff enough to not have audible creaks and squeaks above the extremely quiet drivetrains.
I agree that there does seem to be some cheapening of the newer Lexus' interiors despite the flash and glitz. The interior of my 2001 Lexus IS300, for example, did not look very " Lexus-like " inside, but it was assembled like a Swiss watch....and the chrome ball shifter was like a rock. I don't see quite that same level of fit-and-finish inside on some of the newer cars.
Toyota / Lexus may be cutting some design and assembly costs in order to make the record profits they have experienced lately and in their bid to overtake GM as king of the auto industry.
Yet other evidence......such as the obscenely expensive and complex 8-speed transmission in the new LS460 ( another new Lexus I plan to review ) may suggest just the opposite.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-25-06 at 03:32 PM.
#21
What I am seeing at Toyota side is new cars being built better than before. In both most recent cases - new Yaris and new Rav4, fit and finish is substantially better, as well as materials used.
Some people are not used to soft plastics, and might preffer hard as the rock / solid feel to it, but I am definetly not one of them.
Some people are not used to soft plastics, and might preffer hard as the rock / solid feel to it, but I am definetly not one of them.
#22
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by spwolf
What I am seeing at Toyota side is new cars being built better than before. In both most recent cases - new Yaris and new Rav4, fit and finish is substantially better, as well as materials used.
Some people are not used to soft plastics, and might preffer hard as the rock / solid feel to it, but I am definetly not one of them.
Some people are not used to soft plastics, and might preffer hard as the rock / solid feel to it, but I am definetly not one of them.
Let's get back on topic, though...the new ES.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-25-06 at 04:48 PM.
#23
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by mmarshall
No...I said the IS and GS, not LS. My opinion is that the new ES should be differentiated a little more from those two than this one is. You, of course, are free to disagree.
on a different note, you did say LS and GS... may want to edit your original post.
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Interior too much like the LS and GS...needs more differentiation from those cars.
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by adidosc
great review! i always love reading a good write up.
on a different note, you did say LS and GS... may want to edit your original post.
on a different note, you did say LS and GS... may want to edit your original post.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-25-06 at 05:06 PM.
#25
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by INHOCJP
The loaner ES350 I had last weekend was rock solid. No rattles or creaks. However, it only had 10 miles on the odometer when I left the dealership.
I found the ES350 quite enjoyable to drive. Although I missed the power of my 430, the new ES is certainly no slouch. Gas mielage was quite good. In the 300 miles I drove the car, I averaged about 26 MPG.
Exterior wise, the new ES is a huge improvement over the previous gen IMHO. I think Lexus did a great job with the redesign. The family resemblance is definitely apparent with the new GS , IS and ES. L-Finesse at work I guess.
The steering wheel controls are a bit different than my GS. While my GS controls are hard plastic, the ES controls have a soft covering over them. Not better or worse, just different. The guage cluster in the ES is quite nice. It took me a while to get used to the 2-pod layout, but the guages are beautiful at night.
And as others have noted before, the gen 5 nav display is simply awesome. Comparing it to the gen 4 display is like comparing HDTV to regular stardard definition broadcasts. Quite honestly, if I had plans of keeping my GS long-term, I'd be pissed.
I found the ES350 quite enjoyable to drive. Although I missed the power of my 430, the new ES is certainly no slouch. Gas mielage was quite good. In the 300 miles I drove the car, I averaged about 26 MPG.
Exterior wise, the new ES is a huge improvement over the previous gen IMHO. I think Lexus did a great job with the redesign. The family resemblance is definitely apparent with the new GS , IS and ES. L-Finesse at work I guess.
The steering wheel controls are a bit different than my GS. While my GS controls are hard plastic, the ES controls have a soft covering over them. Not better or worse, just different. The guage cluster in the ES is quite nice. It took me a while to get used to the 2-pod layout, but the guages are beautiful at night.
And as others have noted before, the gen 5 nav display is simply awesome. Comparing it to the gen 4 display is like comparing HDTV to regular stardard definition broadcasts. Quite honestly, if I had plans of keeping my GS long-term, I'd be pissed.
However, I am not impressed at all with the attempt by Lexus to try and move this car up the sport-sedan ladder a couple of notches with the new lower-profile tires and slightly firmer underpinnings. The world is FULL of sport sedans....even with some sister Lexus vehicles like the IS and GS.....and IMO we don't NEED any more. There are very, VERY few cars left on the market that are really aimed toward comfort and a soft ride any more.....the previous ES was one of the very last remaining. Even Buick and Cadillac have stiffened up most of their latest models....and the Lincoln Town Car will soon be discontinued for the new MKS.
#26
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iTrader: (20)
Originally Posted by spwolf
Some people are not used to soft plastics, and might preffer hard as the rock / solid feel to it, but I am definetly not one of them.
#27
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Toyota / Lexus may be cutting some design and assembly costs in order to make the record profits they have experienced lately and in their bid to overtake GM as king of the auto industry.
Yet other evidence......such as the obscenely expensive and complex 8-speed transmission in the new LS460 ( another new Lexus I plan to review ) may suggest just the opposite.
#28
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by Och
3GS doesnt have these leather inserts on the doors like the 2GS does... which makes the doors look awfuly cheap.
Hard to see, especially on a dark interior, but it's there. Maybe it's fake leather, but there's an insert and it's definitely not made of plastic.
#29
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Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by INHOCJP
Actually there are leather inserts.
Hard to see, especially on a dark interior, but it's there. Maybe it's fake leather, but there's an insert and it's definitely not made of plastic.
Hard to see, especially on a dark interior, but it's there. Maybe it's fake leather, but there's an insert and it's definitely not made of plastic.
#30
Insightful review, I think it pinpoints the New ES well...I do think Lexus was very deliberate this time about making the car at a certain level vis a vis New GS LS IS...
A rumor comes to mind...
A rumor comes to mind...