June 2006 Vehicle Sales
07-07-06, 04:50 PM
#91
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
The GS does now have AWD but comes nowhere to the different versions of the E or 5, there is no way possible it will beat them in sales.
BTW, anyone know where I can find sales figures for Porsche for March 2005, Feb 2005, and Jan 2005?
07-07-06, 05:34 PM
#92
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Originally Posted by Incendiary
The IS doesn't have too many model variations compared to the C-class and yet it still beats them. Granted, the C is not considered a leader in its segment like the E-class is, but even still, I don't think that's an excuse sometimes.
BTW, anyone know where I can find sales figures for Porsche for March 2005, Feb 2005, and Jan 2005?
BTW, anyone know where I can find sales figures for Porsche for March 2005, Feb 2005, and Jan 2005?
07-07-06, 05:58 PM
#93
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
I am not sure why we are disagreeing here, I think this shows that the V-8 sales went down as the new 550 was coming. This is not a bad thing, this is business, it takes time to ramp up production for something as serious as a new engine.
GS 430 production is over and sales show that and IMO even when production was high last year, sales were not great for the 430.
GS 430 production is over and sales show that and IMO even when production was high last year, sales were not great for the 430.
Originally Posted by spwolf
not arguing anything else, but BMW has cheaper lease because BMW gives on average $3.2k per vehicle sold, mostly through incentivized leases. On the other hand, Lexus gives 900$ on average per car sold. Despite all of that, Lexus still sells more than BMW, seems to me it is not lexus who has an problem.
.....
lol doug, you are funny... you want to remove GS450h to compare sales, why? Like lets remove 325 sales and compare it to IS? One time you post how Lexus doesnt have enough models, not it has too many models? Excuses, excuses.
And you still didnt answer how "horribly" X3 and X5 are doing. Based on your thoughts of GS3 sales, I wonder why BMW did not pull these horrible sellers off the market already. Its simply embarresing.
.....
lol doug, you are funny... you want to remove GS450h to compare sales, why? Like lets remove 325 sales and compare it to IS? One time you post how Lexus doesnt have enough models, not it has too many models? Excuses, excuses.
And you still didnt answer how "horribly" X3 and X5 are doing. Based on your thoughts of GS3 sales, I wonder why BMW did not pull these horrible sellers off the market already. Its simply embarresing.
now...Somehow you thought I said Lexus has too many models? Where do you get this from? I'm trying to compare sales on an equivalent basis.
There are THREE GS models - a 6 cyl, a 8 cyl, and a hybrid. Remove the hybrid if you want to compare apples to apples with Infiniti sales.
Wanna compare 3-series sales? No problem - take the 325i (4,342) , 325xi (1,320), and 330 (1,800) for a total of 7,462 and compare it to the grouped IS number Lexus provides (4,461) . Is that not a fair comparison? If it is not, explain why please.
Finally, the X5 was introduced in 2001 in its current form. It is long overdue for an overhaul and its sales show it (check out the MDX if you want a comparison car). Sales are expected to be low on a car like this (twilight) - especially one that really never even got a new engine (just tweaks to the old one). The X3 is in its own segment - a segment that others such as Acura seem to think might have some life to it. I tell you, for the reviews it has gotten, I'm surprised it sells as well as it does. Remember, the new X5 will have the third row that I've been telling you people want. Should be interesting. Of course if they sell everyone they can make and it is still below the Lexus numbers, you will accuse them of trying to make the car hot. Can't win here.
07-07-06, 06:36 PM
#94
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X3 does horribly because it sucks. 
X5 is probably doing bad (if it is, I didn't check) because it's now really old.
X5 is probably doing bad (if it is, I didn't check) because it's now really old.
07-07-06, 06:56 PM
#95
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Originally Posted by spwolf
not arguing anything else, but BMW has cheaper lease because BMW gives on average $3.2k per vehicle sold, mostly through incentivized leases. On the other hand, Lexus gives 900$ on average per car sold. Despite all of that, Lexus still sells more than BMW, seems to me it is not lexus who has an problem.
When you buy or finance a Bimmer though, they're definitely significanlty more expensive than a comparable Lexus. They offer few incentives when you're buying.
Last edited by jrock65; 07-07-06 at 06:59 PM.
07-08-06, 01:02 AM
#96
Originally Posted by jrock65
You're right about the incentivized leases. BMW definitely has more. But it's also a fact that the 5 has higher residuals than the GS, which makes the leases even better.
When you buy or finance a Bimmer though, they're definitely significanlty more expensive than a comparable Lexus. They offer few incentives when you're buying.
When you buy or finance a Bimmer though, they're definitely significanlty more expensive than a comparable Lexus. They offer few incentives when you're buying.
Doug - reports about incentives were from March 2006 - why do you think you know better than industry sales analysts?
As to the X5 and 3rd row - RX does not have it either, and sells better than both X3 and X5 together x 2.
RX is also now one of the oldest Lexus vehicles.
:-).
What I have been telling you is different, you just dont listen. X5 will not do as well as RX in next 15 years, no matter how good it is. Because you dont get to change buyer habits and buyer expectations that soon.
If X5 comes out and sells double of what it is selling right now, it will be great success. Yet, RX will still sell double of that. Does that make X5 failure? No it doesnt.
07-08-06, 09:24 AM
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Originally Posted by doug_999
First off, help me with this sales drop of the 545 that you speak of. Last I looked the 545 did really well right up to the 550 intro. In fact, the 550 did not do so well right out of the gate because the M5 came out at the same time and actually sold better than the 550 in the beginning. But last month there were almost 800 sales of the 550 - that's a $70K car!! Yoswa. (its worth every penny in case you were curious).
The Infiniti M is beating the GS if you remove the 450h sales. The 2-3K sales of the 450h is all that is keeping the GS even/above the M35/45. Remove the sales of the 450h and you have a different story - do you disagree?
The Infiniti M is beating the GS if you remove the 450h sales. The 2-3K sales of the 450h is all that is keeping the GS even/above the M35/45. Remove the sales of the 450h and you have a different story - do you disagree?
Why remove GS450h sales? Why not be realistic? As has been stated, GS430 production has STOPPED, so it's only fair to count GS450h sales.
Why not remove 550i sales, or M5 sales when talking about BMW?
Do you really want me to post YTD numbers for the GS and M? Even if you exclude GS450h sales, AND take into account that GS430 production stopped, as well as that GS300 is ramping down in preparation for the GS350, the GS is about tied so far with the M in terms of YTD numbers, if not slightly ahead.
Sure, the M is no Lexus, and does not have the same brand recognition, but it's alot of value for the money, which is why it sells decently. Similarly, that's why the G35 sold so well. But with the new IS being class-leading, G35 sales have dropped, and when the GS gets its new engines, I expect similar drops with the M, because it will no longer be such a value buy, especially performance-wise, compared to a GS350, or GS460.
07-08-06, 09:26 AM
#98
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Originally Posted by PhilipMSPT
I see TRDFantasy's explanation on the GS being released to introduce the L-Finesse design process, but it was best for Lexus to wait to give the LS the new V8.
Lexus has always relied on giving the LS the "best of the best," and the newer more powerful engine should be given to the LS first, even though the GS is the "sportier" of the two.
I think Lexus made a mistake by making the GS less sporty than what most people want it to be. That's why it's not selling well. I don't think it's because they used the older V8. Perhaps they'll give the GS the same "VDIM Off" Button that they're going to give the '07 IS.
Lexus has always relied on giving the LS the "best of the best," and the newer more powerful engine should be given to the LS first, even though the GS is the "sportier" of the two.
I think Lexus made a mistake by making the GS less sporty than what most people want it to be. That's why it's not selling well. I don't think it's because they used the older V8. Perhaps they'll give the GS the same "VDIM Off" Button that they're going to give the '07 IS.
07-08-06, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by doug_999
Mike, the GS460 is due out NEXT YEAR. The numbers I posted showed it was strong up until the normal model change over. The GS sales are down way ahead of the model switch over.
There are THREE GS models - a 6 cyl, a 8 cyl, and a hybrid. Remove the hybrid if you want to compare apples to apples with Infiniti sales.
Wanna compare 3-series sales? No problem - take the 325i (4,342) , 325xi (1,320), and 330 (1,800) for a total of 7,462 and compare it to the grouped IS number Lexus provides (4,461) . Is that not a fair comparison? If it is not, explain why please.
Finally, the X5 was introduced in 2001 in its current form. It is long overdue for an overhaul and its sales show it (check out the MDX if you want a comparison car). Sales are expected to be low on a car like this (twilight) - especially one that really never even got a new engine (just tweaks to the old one). The X3 is in its own segment - a segment that others such as Acura seem to think might have some life to it. I tell you, for the reviews it has gotten, I'm surprised it sells as well as it does. Remember, the new X5 will have the third row that I've been telling you people want. Should be interesting. Of course if they sell everyone they can make and it is still below the Lexus numbers, you will accuse them of trying to make the car hot. Can't win here.
There are THREE GS models - a 6 cyl, a 8 cyl, and a hybrid. Remove the hybrid if you want to compare apples to apples with Infiniti sales.
Wanna compare 3-series sales? No problem - take the 325i (4,342) , 325xi (1,320), and 330 (1,800) for a total of 7,462 and compare it to the grouped IS number Lexus provides (4,461) . Is that not a fair comparison? If it is not, explain why please.
Finally, the X5 was introduced in 2001 in its current form. It is long overdue for an overhaul and its sales show it (check out the MDX if you want a comparison car). Sales are expected to be low on a car like this (twilight) - especially one that really never even got a new engine (just tweaks to the old one). The X3 is in its own segment - a segment that others such as Acura seem to think might have some life to it. I tell you, for the reviews it has gotten, I'm surprised it sells as well as it does. Remember, the new X5 will have the third row that I've been telling you people want. Should be interesting. Of course if they sell everyone they can make and it is still below the Lexus numbers, you will accuse them of trying to make the car hot. Can't win here.
Yes, there are three GS models, but how hard is it to understand, one of the models has STOPPED production. The V8 GS *right now* is NOT being produced. So it's only fair to count GS450h sales.
07-08-06, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by TRDFantasy
Why are you changing the subject? We are not comparing IS sales here. Besides, 2006 MY IS models are SOLD OUT. If you want an IS, and are not on a waiting list, you have to wait to get a 2007 IS. Whatever IS models are on dealer lots left, that's what you have to choose from, until 2007 IS models hit the lot. You can't even special order anything, you have to get on a wait list.
Yes, there are three GS models, but how hard is it to understand, one of the models has STOPPED production. The V8 GS *right now* is NOT being produced. So it's only fair to count GS450h sales.
Yes, there are three GS models, but how hard is it to understand, one of the models has STOPPED production. The V8 GS *right now* is NOT being produced. So it's only fair to count GS450h sales.
I simply responded to that. Not trying changing the subject.
IS Sold out? Plenty at the dealers around here. You might be referring to dealer orders.
BTW, in case you were wondering, German car sales tend to slack off starting in July/Aug as they do their model year switchover (and vacations). So the 545 decline was in line with normal declines and only the last month was really bad. I'm not sure where you got the fact that summer months are the best for car sales- I would disagree with this (unless of course you mean that's when the employee pricing tends to come out and all the inventory goes out the door).
Last edited by doug_999; 07-08-06 at 11:49 AM.
07-08-06, 12:15 PM
#101
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Originally Posted by 1SICKLEX
Where da heck u been mahn???
No one's posted these yet, so here I go:
Code:
3-series 10561 CTS 6267 TL 5541 IS 4461 G35 4391 C-class 4250 A4 3882 X-type 525
Code:
5-series 5199 E-class 4213 STS 2565 GS 2191 M 2012 A6 1748 RL 980 S-type 603
Code:
S-class 2407 7-series 1437 LS430 1014 XJ 522 A8/S8 329 Phaeton 25 Q45 18
* It's a sad, sad day when you get outsold by the Phaeton. (I'm a Nissan shareholder, too.)
* LS selling very well for being in the twilight of its life. Very well.
* CTS and TL doing very well, too. A4 a big disappointment, sales-wise.
* Good for the STS. Cadillac must be pleased.
07-08-06, 04:55 PM
#103
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Originally Posted by Incendiary
* Good for the STS. Cadillac must be pleased.
Didn't expect the IS and G35 numbers to be that close, especially with the G on it's way out. They must be giving them away.
07-08-06, 08:08 PM
#104
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Originally Posted by ktiger
The numbers are good but you can buy one for $100 over invoice.
Didn't expect the IS and G35 numbers to be that close, especially with the G on it's way out. They must be giving them away.
Didn't expect the IS and G35 numbers to be that close, especially with the G on it's way out. They must be giving them away.
07-08-06, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by TRDFantasy
Sure, the M is no Lexus, and does not have the same brand recognition, but it's alot of value for the money, which is why it sells decently.
The M sells well because it's a good car, and its buyers like it over other cars in its class. The car has been universally lauded in all the car mags. Even a non-enthusiast mag like Consumer Reports gave it the HIGHEST ranking among ALL luxury sedans.
Of course, the fact that it is a couple thousand cheaper than the GS doesn't hurt, but it is simply a good car regardless of price, and that's mainly the reason it sells.