mmarshall

Wish me luck, guys. I'll be out helping our Federal Employee Union Local President tomorrow afternoon, test-driving and shopping for a new car....probably a Hyundai Sonata. He feels it is time to replace his old Camry with another reasonably-priced FWD mid-sized sedan, and is quite impressed, at least on the web site and the brochure, with the Sonata's value for the price. If all goes well, we'll make a deal on one.
( No, he doesn't ride around in a chauffer-driven limo like some Union officials do ).
In fact, he has roughly the same aeronautical charting job in our organization that I do, and is an employee like us.

STIG

Good Luck Mmarshall.

But not so sure if you need luck to buy a FWD mid size sedan. jk

blacksc400

iTrader: (4)

GL man... but why Hyundai's?? The value goes down too fast...
How about the new camry or Accord, so even the Subaru legacy///??
Ohh well... hope he can get a good price on it...

mmarshall

He wanted FWD for reasonable foul-weather traction but without the complexities of AWD...that rules out either a Subaru or an AWD Santa Fe.

He hasn't completely ruled out an Accord or Camry, but, like some other people today, is impressed with Hyundai value. You can get a Sonata V6 for essentially the same......or less.....than a Camry or Accord 4.

He keeps his cars a long time.....long enough so that depreciation after a couple of years is generally not a big issue, and was impressed with the long Hyundai warranty.

Hyundais are starting to keep more of their value, BTW, as the public generally is now starting to accept the fact that they are not lemons any more and are now respectable products...even first-rate in some areas. Kias are still lagging behind Hyundais somewhat in depreciation...the public has not caught on to them quite as much yet.

LexFather

GL, what about a Camry Hyrbid? Or a Mazda 6?

marshmallo

He will need lots of luck.

Made in Alabama is kinda sketchy.

mmarshall

The Sonatas coming out of that AL plant, unlike the lousy Mercedes plant a few miles away, appear to be every bit as well-designed and well-made as any Camry or Accord I've seen, although their noise isolation on the road can't quite match the Camry's.
Still, they offer Camry-Accord quality at a significantly lower price....and twice the warranty. ( That nice long warranty may not last into 2008, however...Hyundai may pull it back somewhat ).

We signed the papers last night on an Internet price of just over 18K....on a V6 SE model. Tax ( 5% in MD ), tags, and DPF were extra, of course. Still, it was out the door for less than 20K ( $19,800 ). Not bad for a V6, eh?....with ABS, sport-shift automatic, traction control, stability system, full power package, full-side airbags, cruise control, and a real nice stereo.


Anyhow...we looked at and test-drove some 4 and V6 Sonatas yesterday at 2 branches of the same dealership....but they didn't have exactly the color and options he wanted ( or didn't want ) at either place. The one car that was available was held up awaiting parts for a factory campaign on some VIN's to replace the shocks. ( Yes, that happens even with Toyotas and Hondas ) . So...after a computer search, we settled for one at a dealership about 50-60 miles away...they will have to bring it down. I'll be off this afternoon to look it over for Ron, test-drive it, and OK it for delivery.
Ron ( my co-worker ) is just thrilled with the Sonata. He said he's never seen as much or a nicer car for what it actually costs.....although, inside, the room for the driver's seat is JUST enough for him, and no more. And the Internet prices on the SE V6's, on average, were only some $1000-$1500 more than the 4-cylinder models, making the V6's a real bargain.

The Dealership chain we were at is interesting.....I like its pricing system. They impressed me with the way they do buisness. They have a very reasonable, no-haggle Internet price on each car, slightly more for the Value Package ( which gives you some service free or at a discount ). The prices are posted clearly, everything else is fully explained on a poster in the showroom ( along with the sales tricks that many other places use to pad the figures ) , and they do honor their posted prices with no bull-******. And they didn't try the usual stuff after the deal ( alarms, LoJack, undercoating, paint sealant, etc...) They only asked for a refundable $300 deposit to bring the car down ( most places want at least $1000-2000 ). It's an even better system than Saturn's, IMO, because Saturn charges full list....their Internet and value prices are both WAY below list, and a $500 rebate AND 1.9% 48-month financing were both thrown in as well. They even gave us KBB for the trade, a Chevy Impala. ( I checked the KBB figures myself ). I was very pleased with the whole experience, and so was Ron....although the first salesman we dealt with at the first shop tried to act like an expert and wow us with an encyclopedia-full of " knowledge ", part of which was true and part was bull-s * * t. ( He didn't realize that I was looking at new cars before he was even born ). The guy we signed the papers with at the second shop, however, was very nice, polite, humble, and unassuming.....and he got the deal and commission, of course, although the delivered Internet price was so low I don't know just how much actually went into his pocket.

So...thanks for your support, guys .....it was a great experience.
PM me if you want the name of the dealership...I'll be glad to give it to you.

mmarshall

All done. New car examined, test-driven, wrote up, and delivered....although they had to replace a front alloy wheel that got a gouge in it, either on the transporter or driving it down from the other dealership.
An unbelievable value for a car that lists for 21K and went out the door for less than 20K....with 1.9% financing. Hyundai has, IMO, not only caught up to Toyota and Honda, but has surpassed them in some areas.
I also looked briefly at the new 2007 Santa Fe while I was there, but did not test-drive it...there, of course, were more important things to take care of.
I may do a review of one soon. The new Santa Fe is even more impressive, at first glance, than the old one.

I don't usually write this much about every car deal I sit through ( I am used to them by now, and you guys would get bored if I did ) , but this was an excellent experience...both the dealership and manufacturer deserve it.

LEXUS_KID

iTrader: (4)

Good Luck Mmarshall

mmarshall

Thanks. The deal is done. It's actually Ron's car, not mine....I just went along (at his request ) to help things out....and was very impressed with this car, its price, and the dealership. He was, too...said he never felt better and had less pain about buying a new car.

That doesn't mean that ALL Hyundai dealerships are good. I've seen a couple in the area I wasn't impressed with.

In fact, that's one nice thing about living here in the D.C. area. We have the second-largest new-vehicle market in the country....exceeded, of course, only by Southern California. So, living here, you can either test-drive or buy just about anything on the market within a close distance....there are multiple dealerships of virtually every vehicle make within a short distance. Unfortunately, until just the last couple of years, the importance of the annual D.C. Auto Show ( formerly a Class C show ) still had not caught up with the vast importance of this huge car-buying region, as it has in the L.A. / SoCal area. ( Even now, the D.C show is a borderline class A/B show instead of a solid Class A show like Detroit and L.A. ). Take the enormous Detroit North American International Show, for instance....easily the largest auto show in the country, and one of the largest in the world. The D.C. area here sells SIX TIMES the number of new cars annually that the Detroit area does, and the L.A.-SoCal region TEN TIMES as much. Yet, where is the largest show?.....Detroit. Go figure.

rai

Sounds like you may be talking about Fitzgerald automall (?) that's who I got my Subaru from, they have a nice selection including Toyota, but no luxury brands and no Honda yet.

Sounds like the Sonnata is a nice car, I didn't get around to test driving since after driving an Accord and Camry was not a fan of fwd (if given a choice to get awd Legacy for not a lot more).

I think this range between $18K and $22K for a mid-size sedan you get a lot of value..

FWD is great for most people who don't push the car or drive hard. My main concern is the way I drive with a lot of gas, most fwd cars/vans I have driven will spin their wheels. Not a huge problem, but less than elegant.

mmarshall

Five points, rai .....Fitzgerald/ Rockville it was. They have a very impressive, no-haggle, low-price, Internet pricing system ( as you found out yourself ). They had Subarus, Dodges, and Isuzus there as well, but Ron didn't want a Legacy or Outback. He didn't want the complexities of AWD, and doesn't appreciate the superb way Subaru does AWD like you and I do. He more or less fell in love with the Sonata on the Hyundai website even before he saw the car.

The salesperson we ended up signing with was very nice also...far better than the first guy we dealt with at the Fitzgerald Hyundai shop further north at Lake Forest Mall ( see my earlier post ). That first guy tried to woo us and overwhelm us with his vast " knowledge " of the car and its competition...until he found out I was a car guy, too.
Even after falling in love with the Sonata, Ron still had some qualms about it at first.....short on driver's seat room, stiff ride, and steering wheel blocking the speedometer.....until I showed him how to adjust the power seat properly, use the tilt feature, and adjusted the tire pressures with my gauge where they should have been ( they SAY they adjust the pressures when a new car comes off the truck, but often they don't....DON'T let the salesperson BS you on that ).
After I finally got the car adjusted for him, then he really fell in love with it.

However, as nice a car as the Sonata is for the price, its high build quality, and the great value it is, it is NOT the car for everybody...and I'll be the first to admit that. It is probably too sedate and conservative for some of the sport-sedan guys here at CL. Even with the automatic, the V6 gives it enough power to get out of its own way, but it is fairly softly-sprung ( with the correct tire pressures, of course ) and even with the fairly low-profile 50-series tires ( standard on all V6's ) it does not carve up corners with Miata-like authority...you do notice understeer. It steers, handles, and rides like a luxury mid-sized car, although the road noise isolation isn't quite as good as the Camry's. The luxurious cloth upholstery is also very soft, plush, and velour-like...not exactly sports-car supportive.

rai

I think this is half the battle. What I mean is many cars are so similar, with size, power, features, and (IMO) many drive similar. So that some times you can decide on a car b/c of it's looks or it's price or its reputation or re-sale value or its warranty or for what ever reason.

It's possible if you drive every car in the category you can be left scratching your head as to what makes that car stand out, why pick an Accord/Camry/Altima/Sonnata/Passat etc..

I tried out the FWD cars, but I realized that it even tho I didn't drive the Sonnata or Mazda 6 etc.. that they would still have the FWD characteristics of the Accord/Camry.

For me the Legacy stood out b/c of it's AWD, even tho the AWD does take away from it's gas mileage and acceleration.

mmarshall

I'm with you on Subaru. They simply do AWD better than anyone else in the under-$35,000 range....even Hyundai. And the Legacy and Outback have superb interiors, as well, for the money.

I won't go on any more about the Sonata...I have already discussed it enough above.

The Mazda 6, despite being a primary Camry/Accord competitor, is a noticeably different car from either the Camry or Accord. It doesn't quite have the Accord's build quality ( though it is close ), is set up, in most versions, for more sporting handling and road feel than either the Camry or Accord, even the sporting Camry SE, and generally falls short of the Camry on transmission smoothness, noise isolation, and overall refinement. However, Mazda has always prided itself on being the " BMW " of Japanese cars in steering and handling feel and chassis dynamics, in spite of the FWD setup on most of its sedans and hatchbacks. And, unlike the American-market Camrys and Accords, Mazda did do a limited-production, AWD, turbocharged, MazdaSpeed version....some 5000 units.....sort of like a grown-up version of the Subaru WRX/STi or Mitsubishi Evo for adults.

UberNoob

a good purchase

hopes he likes the car in the years to come

be sure to update us on long term reliability!