newr

Please take a look at engine options from MB before you make that statement.

UberNoob

ah you tried

yeah as said before, u cant expect to convert all the MB ppl to lexus

brand perception is very important for all manufacturers

bruce van

If all things being equal, power, quality, etc.....most people including myself would rather have a Mercedes Benz in my garage than a Lexus.

The Mercedes Benz brand is much, much stronger than Lexus. I think most people will agree with me there.

D-MAN63

Okay, and ? It has an option of more power, doesn't necessarily make it *BETTER*. Faster yes, but not necessarily mechanically better.

krazykanuk

I agree completely. At that price point, the extra cost to go from an LS460 to an S550 should not be a big deal. If it is, you're probably out of your range.

I personally just have a love for German cars that the 3 Lexus we currently have can't cure. If I was buying it, I would choose the S over the LS any day of the week. Having owned German cars out of warranty, its not something I want to gamble with, but if its under warranty then whatever. I'd rather have a car I loved and maybe have it have a chance of being less reliable than one that I don't love.

To me the LS is just too bland. It looks just like a supersized version of all the other Lexus cars. And maybe more importantly to me, it doesn't have the presence that a S or A8 has. Really, at this price point it is all personal preference because be honest, nobody NEEDS a 90k car. Even though so many people do it, its rather irrational and the same needs could be fulfilled by a car that costs half as much.

D-MAN63

This is a good discussion but I am still confused on something, some comments were made that they rather drive an MB if all is equal because whether its a "stronger" brand, or Lexus is not in the same level as MB. Okay, its your opinions which you have every right to express.. Some people say the LS looks like a camry and they would choose the S550, absolutely understandable reason.

What I am saying is when people say MB is "better" than Lexus, WHAT makes them BETTER? More engine options? MB been out for ages and over time they have created more engine OPTIONS, which lexus came out in 1989/90. So I am assuming the majority of the people think why mb is better is because of TRADITION? Longevity? A person said the S class has a good engine/powertrain combo WHICH IT DOES, but when you compare it to the LS460, the LS still comes out on top, not by a huge margin but still on top.

With me, I really don't care about tradition, brand recognition, logevity etc.. I look at two cars of the SAME class, and I compare to see which one is BETTER. Looks is subjective, I know that.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Well, LS460 does look like a large Camry and ES350. This whole L-finesse family look plain out sucks, I don't like a single new model.

But then S550 looks ghetto bling bling

And the banglefied 7 series is... lets not even go there.

If I was to spend that kind of money, I'd drive off in one of these!



But then I would never buy a german car because of their **** involvment. So I guess eventually I'm gonna have to settle for the ugly LS unless Acura or Infiniti steps up to the place with RL/Q45.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Oh yeah, one more little detail - A8 and LS460 have that, and 7 series and S550 don't - and that little detail alone is enough for me to not even remotely consider the 7 or S550.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Agreed - there's things many people are comfortable with and don't like to change or find the changes distracting. Let's face it, the LS460 and S class have two very different personalities. I've been out of town for the past couple of days and an LS460 passed me and then stopped at a light a few yards ahead of me. I swear that while I like the car, I couldn't help thinking "big Camry". I know some will say cheap shot but from the back the way the rear lights are and other aspects reminded me of the back of a new Camry.

Like it or not, there's NOTHING on the road like the new S-Class. And I think the newest commercial for it is OUTSTANDING. Showing heritage, people saying their fond memories of ones past and of their love, passion and respect for the latest ones... it's just excellent, and the S-Class looks excellent, especially in black - wow. Anyone else notice how the side profile shows how short the front overhang is? Niceee.

Lexus plugs the ML brand in different models but there's worlds and light years difference between the IS, GS, and LS 'ML' systems.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

LS is 2/3rds the price of an S class. No surprise it outsells it.

True. A brand that's been around over 100 yrs does count for something.

Avensis has the personality of a cereal box. It works, it's boring, although reliable and quite smooth. A C class, even a cheap one, is fun to drive. It's RWD. It's still a Mercedes.

Nor wants to.

Right now on the Lexus line-up in the U.S. I like the new LS but not their ridiculously constrained option configurations. The SUVs all seem a bit old to me at this point. The GS is boring (I'd take the M45 over it), and the IS is too cramped in the back (I'd take the G35 sedan over it). While the new ES is better than the old one, it does nothing for me. It's like a Kenmoore dishwasher. Quiet, smooth, does it's job, utterly boring.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Oh man, your better half's a genius.

I expect Lexus to refresh the LS to differentiate it further. I've noticed a detail on the LS I don't like and that's the 'curved S' gap between front/rear fenders (I think it's both) and front/rear fascia/bumpers. MB tends to do that better, usually with a nice embedded chrome piece. Wish I had pics handy, but maybe you know what I mean. The LS 'S curve' approach says "mass production" a bit too much for me. Having said that the LS does have a lot of other nice touches.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Agreed. I saw several A8's the past couple of days and I almost dislocate my neck to keep looking at them... simply stunning. Lexus still insists on putting tiny wheels and having what looks like a 6" front wheel gap on its flagship model. It just doesn't cut it. Having said that, the new LS is by far the best Lexus ever. I don't think I've ever seen a car with narrower panel gaps.

Lexus does quality, reliability, and luxury. It doesn't yet do much in the way of 'character' and passion.

I still say Lexus is everything a Buick or Cadillac should be.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Maybe it's because MB is using bigger numbers. 550 vs 460. Psychology comes into play here.

But on a more serious note, I think one HUGE problem Lexus has is inflexibility in offerings. You can get a 7 series or S class with a zillion different combinations of options. Sure you may have to order it, but you can get it. With Lexus, even ordering one gives you very little flexibility and dealers often turn their nose up at you if you don't want one of the 6 all the same except color on the lot.

Also, with BMW at least, you can take delivery in Europe. Maybe a gimmick (although it does save money), but a nice treat for some that do it, or know that it's available.

That makes you an 'objective' or 'sensible' car buyer, which is Lexus's target. Mercedes isn't looking for sensible buyers. They go after people who want what they want, for whatever stupid reason. You probably wouldn't buy a 700HP SL600 either. It's stupid. It makes no sense. But MB offers it, and some buyers really appreciate a brand that does it, even if that isn't the one they buy. Maybe they want the IRRATIONAL buyer whereas Lexus seeks the RATIONAL buyer.

Hard then, to convince someone who is irrational, to switch.

encore888

Successful CEOs driving Lexus cars, that's the point. Sure they can shop at Walmart but when it comes to luxury cars, they want the best. Boeing Commercial Airplanes CEO and now Ford CEO Alan Mulally said he purchased the LS 430 because it is "the finest car in the world."

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Wow, can't let go, huh? You do know the ***** are just about all dead? I don't know if you're white but should all blacks hate you because of that KKK and slavery thing? Anyway, O/T, sorry.