Prius Outdoes Hummer in Environmental Damage
03-22-07, 06:43 AM
#1
Prius Outdoes Hummer in Environmental Damage
March 7, 2007
Prius Outdoes Hummer in Environmental Damage
By Chris Demorro
Staff Writer
The Toyota Prius has become the flagship car for those in our society so environmentally conscious that they are willing to spend a premium to show the world how much they care. Unfortunately for them, their ultimate ‘green car’ is the source of some of the worst pollution in North America; it takes more combined energy per Prius to produce than a Hummer.
Before we delve into the seedy underworld of hybrids, you must first understand how a hybrid works. For this, we will use the most popular hybrid on the market, the Toyota Prius.
The Prius is powered by not one, but two engines: a standard 76 horsepower, 1.5-liter gas engine found in most cars today and a battery- powered engine that deals out 67 horsepower and a whooping 295ft/lbs of torque, below 2000 revolutions per minute. Essentially, the Toyota Synergy Drive system, as it is so called, propels the car from a dead stop to up to 30mph. This is where the largest percent of gas is consumed. As any physics major can tell you, it takes more energy to get an object moving than to keep it moving. The battery is recharged through the braking system, as well as when the gasoline engine takes over anywhere north of 30mph. It seems like a great energy efficient and environmentally sound car, right?
You would be right if you went by the old government EPA estimates, which netted the Prius an incredible 60 miles per gallon in the city and 51 miles per gallon on the highway. Unfortunately for Toyota, the government realized how unrealistic their EPA tests were, which consisted of highway speeds limited to 55mph and acceleration of only 3.3 mph per second. The new tests which affect all 2008 models give a much more realistic rating with highway speeds of 80mph and acceleration of 8mph per second. This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo, which costs less then half what the Prius costs.
However, if that was the only issue with the Prius, I wouldn’t be writing this article. It gets much worse.
Building a Toyota Prius causes more environmental damage than a Hummer that is on the road for three times longer than a Prius. As already noted, the Prius is partly driven by a battery which contains nickel. The nickel is mined and smelted at a plant in Sudbury, Ontario. This plant has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the ‘dead zone’ around the plant to test moon rovers. The area around the plant is devoid of any life for miles.
The plant is the source of all the nickel found in a Prius’ battery and Toyota purchases 1,000 tons annually. Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist’s nightmare.
“The acid rain around Sudbury was so bad it destroyed all the plants and the soil slid down off the hillside,” said Canadian Greenpeace energy-coordinator David Martin during an interview with Mail, a British-based newspaper.
All of this would be bad enough in and of itself; however, the journey to make a hybrid doesn’t end there. The nickel produced by this disastrous plant is shipped via massive container ship to the largest nickel refinery in Europe. From there, the nickel hops over to China to produce ‘nickel foam.’ From there, it goes to Japan. Finally, the completed batteries are shipped to the United States, finalizing the around-the-world trip required to produce a single Prius battery. Are these not sounding less and less like environmentally sound cars and more like a farce?
Wait, I haven’t even got to the best part yet.
When you pool together all the combined energy it takes to drive and build a Toyota Prius, the flagship car of energy fanatics, it takes almost 50 percent more energy than a Hummer - the Prius’s arch nemesis.
Through a study by CNW Marketing called “Dust to Dust,” the total combined energy is taken from all the electrical, fuel, transportation, materials (metal, plastic, etc) and hundreds of other factors over the expected lifetime of a vehicle. The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles - the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.
The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles. That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.
So, if you are really an environmentalist - ditch the Prius. Instead, buy one of the most economical cars available - a Toyota Scion xB. The Scion only costs a paltry $0.48 per mile to put on the road. If you are still obsessed over gas mileage - buy a Chevy Aveo and fix that lead foot.
One last fun fact for you: it takes five years to offset the premium price of a Prius. Meaning, you have to wait 60 months to save any money over a non-hybrid car because of lower gas expenses.
Source:http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/edito...asp?NewsID=188
Personally, I think this is a bunch of hogwash considering the amount of varibles that they probably left out... but whatever... it makes for interesting conversations.
Prius Outdoes Hummer in Environmental Damage
By Chris Demorro
Staff Writer
The Toyota Prius has become the flagship car for those in our society so environmentally conscious that they are willing to spend a premium to show the world how much they care. Unfortunately for them, their ultimate ‘green car’ is the source of some of the worst pollution in North America; it takes more combined energy per Prius to produce than a Hummer.
Before we delve into the seedy underworld of hybrids, you must first understand how a hybrid works. For this, we will use the most popular hybrid on the market, the Toyota Prius.
The Prius is powered by not one, but two engines: a standard 76 horsepower, 1.5-liter gas engine found in most cars today and a battery- powered engine that deals out 67 horsepower and a whooping 295ft/lbs of torque, below 2000 revolutions per minute. Essentially, the Toyota Synergy Drive system, as it is so called, propels the car from a dead stop to up to 30mph. This is where the largest percent of gas is consumed. As any physics major can tell you, it takes more energy to get an object moving than to keep it moving. The battery is recharged through the braking system, as well as when the gasoline engine takes over anywhere north of 30mph. It seems like a great energy efficient and environmentally sound car, right?
You would be right if you went by the old government EPA estimates, which netted the Prius an incredible 60 miles per gallon in the city and 51 miles per gallon on the highway. Unfortunately for Toyota, the government realized how unrealistic their EPA tests were, which consisted of highway speeds limited to 55mph and acceleration of only 3.3 mph per second. The new tests which affect all 2008 models give a much more realistic rating with highway speeds of 80mph and acceleration of 8mph per second. This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo, which costs less then half what the Prius costs.
However, if that was the only issue with the Prius, I wouldn’t be writing this article. It gets much worse.
Building a Toyota Prius causes more environmental damage than a Hummer that is on the road for three times longer than a Prius. As already noted, the Prius is partly driven by a battery which contains nickel. The nickel is mined and smelted at a plant in Sudbury, Ontario. This plant has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the ‘dead zone’ around the plant to test moon rovers. The area around the plant is devoid of any life for miles.
The plant is the source of all the nickel found in a Prius’ battery and Toyota purchases 1,000 tons annually. Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist’s nightmare.
“The acid rain around Sudbury was so bad it destroyed all the plants and the soil slid down off the hillside,” said Canadian Greenpeace energy-coordinator David Martin during an interview with Mail, a British-based newspaper.
All of this would be bad enough in and of itself; however, the journey to make a hybrid doesn’t end there. The nickel produced by this disastrous plant is shipped via massive container ship to the largest nickel refinery in Europe. From there, the nickel hops over to China to produce ‘nickel foam.’ From there, it goes to Japan. Finally, the completed batteries are shipped to the United States, finalizing the around-the-world trip required to produce a single Prius battery. Are these not sounding less and less like environmentally sound cars and more like a farce?
Wait, I haven’t even got to the best part yet.
When you pool together all the combined energy it takes to drive and build a Toyota Prius, the flagship car of energy fanatics, it takes almost 50 percent more energy than a Hummer - the Prius’s arch nemesis.
Through a study by CNW Marketing called “Dust to Dust,” the total combined energy is taken from all the electrical, fuel, transportation, materials (metal, plastic, etc) and hundreds of other factors over the expected lifetime of a vehicle. The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles - the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.
The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles. That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.
So, if you are really an environmentalist - ditch the Prius. Instead, buy one of the most economical cars available - a Toyota Scion xB. The Scion only costs a paltry $0.48 per mile to put on the road. If you are still obsessed over gas mileage - buy a Chevy Aveo and fix that lead foot.
One last fun fact for you: it takes five years to offset the premium price of a Prius. Meaning, you have to wait 60 months to save any money over a non-hybrid car because of lower gas expenses.
Source:http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/edito...asp?NewsID=188
Personally, I think this is a bunch of hogwash considering the amount of varibles that they probably left out... but whatever... it makes for interesting conversations.
03-22-07, 07:47 AM
#3
Lexus Fanatic
Some good points. I have never been a big fan of hybrids....diesels, for one, IMO, make more sense in several ways.
And the revision of the Prius to 45 MPG overall is correct. That is roughly what most prople here in the DC area average, in routine daily driving with their Priuses,.......about 45 MPG.
And the revision of the Prius to 45 MPG overall is correct. That is roughly what most prople here in the DC area average, in routine daily driving with their Priuses,.......about 45 MPG.
03-22-07, 08:18 AM
#4
The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles - the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.
The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles.
That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.
The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles.
That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.
it just means that it COSTS more to build them/mile. you cant put a price tag on the environment. environmental damage can't be measured in dollar. I dont know what unit it should be measured in but definitly not dollar. this is ridiculous.
03-22-07, 08:22 AM
#5
Lexus Champion
I'm not a huge fan of Hybrids, either. One thing not mentioned is
how are the used batteries disposed of? I don't know the
answer to this, but it can't be good for the environment.
I wonder how many greenie-wienies thought about the
above facts when they plunked down a premium for their rad rides.
how are the used batteries disposed of? I don't know the
answer to this, but it can't be good for the environment.
I wonder how many greenie-wienies thought about the
above facts when they plunked down a premium for their rad rides.
03-22-07, 04:01 PM
#7
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The subject of the Prius' batteries and the sensationalized reporting of the nickel factory in Sudbury, Ontario has already been discussed:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=269569
Both lithium ion and nickel metal hydride batteries (used in the Prius) are considered non-hazardous waste, unlike the older nickel cadmium batteries.
100,000 miles is the expected lifespan of a Prius?! I'd be surprised if the Hummer reached its claimed 300,000 mile lifespan.
Given that the Hybrid Synergy system is a new technology, yes it will be more expensive, but the costs will come down as hybrid technology gains wider acceptance. I wonder how extensively they traced back the materials used in the construction of other cars or the methodology they used to calculate energy costs.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=269569
Both lithium ion and nickel metal hydride batteries (used in the Prius) are considered non-hazardous waste, unlike the older nickel cadmium batteries.
100,000 miles is the expected lifespan of a Prius?! I'd be surprised if the Hummer reached its claimed 300,000 mile lifespan.
Given that the Hybrid Synergy system is a new technology, yes it will be more expensive, but the costs will come down as hybrid technology gains wider acceptance. I wonder how extensively they traced back the materials used in the construction of other cars or the methodology they used to calculate energy costs.
Last edited by cal_alum98; 03-22-07 at 04:19 PM.
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03-22-07, 04:02 PM
#8
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There was talk in another thread that Toyota was certainly going to switch to Li-Ion next generation, indicated by a recent acquisition of theirs.
In yet another thread an article was posted about the total environmental impact of a vehicle over it's lifetime in terms of energy to produce it, run it through an average lifetime and dispose it. Hybrids faired quite badly in this. I believe the top cars turned out to be the Malibu and Yaris if I recall correctly.
Hybrids are a useful technology to decrease oil dependence, but I wouldn't mistake them as being environmentally friendly. And they're actually only marginally better on gas than a Yaris at that. In the short term, diesels are probably the best, and in the long term, clean combustion such as hyrdogen.
In yet another thread an article was posted about the total environmental impact of a vehicle over it's lifetime in terms of energy to produce it, run it through an average lifetime and dispose it. Hybrids faired quite badly in this. I believe the top cars turned out to be the Malibu and Yaris if I recall correctly.
Hybrids are a useful technology to decrease oil dependence, but I wouldn't mistake them as being environmentally friendly. And they're actually only marginally better on gas than a Yaris at that. In the short term, diesels are probably the best, and in the long term, clean combustion such as hyrdogen.
03-22-07, 04:17 PM
#9
You would be right if you went by the old government EPA estimates, which netted the Prius an incredible 60 miles per gallon in the city and 51 miles per gallon on the highway. Unfortunately for Toyota, the government realized how unrealistic their EPA tests were, which consisted of highway speeds limited to 55mph and acceleration of only 3.3 mph per second. The new tests which affect all 2008 models give a much more realistic rating with highway speeds of 80mph and acceleration of 8mph per second. This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo, which costs less then half what the Prius costs.
03-22-07, 04:50 PM
#10
Lexus Fanatic
The acceleration test may have to be altered out of necessity. Some small, naturally-aspirated, low-displacement, 4-cylinder automatics, particularly with the weight and drag of AWD, cannot do 8 mph per second. 5-6 is more realistic.
03-22-07, 05:07 PM
#11
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used batteries are recycled
pollution from exhaust can NOT be recycled
point of hybrids is that you control the amount of exhaust pollution
even if the batteries produces pollution when being made, its manufacturing processes are centralized and it is much easier to control those pollutions than having millions of exhausts all over the world pumping out pollution uncontrollable
by bashing hybrid technology will not solve the problems of pollution
by concentrating efforts on making that battery making plant more clean is a more ideal course of action
does this report even take in account of drilling oil wells, transporting that oil and refining the crude oil... etc?
the report only mentions transportation and so on for making the car parts
and only a brief mention of fuel
pollution from exhaust can NOT be recycled
point of hybrids is that you control the amount of exhaust pollution
even if the batteries produces pollution when being made, its manufacturing processes are centralized and it is much easier to control those pollutions than having millions of exhausts all over the world pumping out pollution uncontrollable
by bashing hybrid technology will not solve the problems of pollution
by concentrating efforts on making that battery making plant more clean is a more ideal course of action
does this report even take in account of drilling oil wells, transporting that oil and refining the crude oil... etc?
the report only mentions transportation and so on for making the car parts
and only a brief mention of fuel
03-22-07, 07:01 PM
#12
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It would be interesting to know how much fuel the cargo ships burn going around the world to make and deliver the batteries, whats the point of saving gas in a Prius when a ship burns a 20 year supply for 1 car in 1 trip just for the batteries
03-22-07, 07:35 PM
#14
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Most stupid article I've seen for bashing Toyota!
They're making their claim by saying the car *indirectly* pollutes more than hummer by processing of materials at some other plant....
WTF?!?!?
The comparison is not apples to apples here....and is total BS.
Let's see how much crap goes into making a Hummer and THAN compare the two...
They're making their claim by saying the car *indirectly* pollutes more than hummer by processing of materials at some other plant....
WTF?!?!?The comparison is not apples to apples here....and is total BS.
Let's see how much crap goes into making a Hummer and THAN compare the two...
