2008 Tahoe and Yukon Hybrid SUVs to be rated at 21/22 using 2008 EPA ratings
10-01-07 | 01:35 PM
#76
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From: CT
10-01-07 | 01:42 PM
#77
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Yes but 600hL added not only the additional weight of AWD, but the hybrid drivetrain - as an alternative to going V12 (that adds weight compared to V8 too, 760Li added 360 lb. going from V8 to V12 compared to 750 Li), plus the LS600hL also added the Active Power Stabilizer Suspension System that the 460L does not have(at least 90 lb.IIRC) to improve handling , plus a few other minor extras, that can add more weight, so 700 lb. total is reasonable IMO.
10-01-07 | 01:49 PM
#79
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And that's exactly what's relevant here. If Lexus adds 700 lb to the LS to make it a hybrid, that's their problem.
When you look at the MPG and performance improvements (or lack thereof) that Lexus has come up with when starting out with their heaviest (to date) ICE vehicle to receive a hybrid makeover, I'll say again that the results are disappointing to me and should be disappointing to any objective observer.
repeating:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
curb weight: 17% worse
0-60: 2% worse
trunk space: 35% less
I do hope they do better with heavy vehicles in the future. It will be too late for my current round of vehicle purchases, as I plan to replace my LX and RX in calendar 2008 (with one 6-8 passenger luxury vehicle, and one large luxury sedan). But I'll keep hoping for the following round.
When you look at the MPG and performance improvements (or lack thereof) that Lexus has come up with when starting out with their heaviest (to date) ICE vehicle to receive a hybrid makeover, I'll say again that the results are disappointing to me and should be disappointing to any objective observer.
repeating:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
curb weight: 17% worse
0-60: 2% worse
trunk space: 35% less
I do hope they do better with heavy vehicles in the future. It will be too late for my current round of vehicle purchases, as I plan to replace my LX and RX in calendar 2008 (with one 6-8 passenger luxury vehicle, and one large luxury sedan). But I'll keep hoping for the following round.
What can we do? Yukon is a lot better than LS600h, and HH is a lot better than both.
Such is life.
10-01-07 | 03:16 PM
#80
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From: MD
And that's exactly what's relevant here. If Lexus adds 700 lb to the LS to make it a hybrid, that's their problem.
When you look at the MPG and performance improvements (or lack thereof) that Lexus has come up with when starting out with their heaviest (to date) ICE vehicle to receive a hybrid makeover, I'll say again that the results are disappointing to me and should be disappointing to any objective observer.
repeating:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
curb weight: 17% worse
0-60: 2% worse
trunk space: 35% less
I do hope they do better with heavy vehicles in the future. It will be too late for my current round of vehicle purchases, as I plan to replace my LX and RX in calendar 2008 (with one 6-8 passenger luxury vehicle, and one large luxury sedan). But I'll keep hoping for the following round.
When you look at the MPG and performance improvements (or lack thereof) that Lexus has come up with when starting out with their heaviest (to date) ICE vehicle to receive a hybrid makeover, I'll say again that the results are disappointing to me and should be disappointing to any objective observer.
repeating:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
curb weight: 17% worse
0-60: 2% worse
trunk space: 35% less
I do hope they do better with heavy vehicles in the future. It will be too late for my current round of vehicle purchases, as I plan to replace my LX and RX in calendar 2008 (with one 6-8 passenger luxury vehicle, and one large luxury sedan). But I'll keep hoping for the following round.
10-01-07 | 03:36 PM
#82
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From: CT
Maybe you guys also feel its just great that, more than a decade after the original Prius, Lexus doesn't have a full-size hybrid SUV available now or in the near future. I don't. I'm disappointed.
10-01-07 | 04:32 PM
#83
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I think the new GM SUV hybrids are great.
THe LS 600h L is not the answer to all things and has drawbacks. That being said;
It should NOT be included, it is literally the most technologically advanced car in the world. The Tahoe (twins) are literally Silverado's with a roof in the back.
Not to mention you can buy 2 maybe 3 Tahoes for the price of a LS 600.
THe LS 600h L is not the answer to all things and has drawbacks. That being said;
It should NOT be included, it is literally the most technologically advanced car in the world. The Tahoe (twins) are literally Silverado's with a roof in the back.
Not to mention you can buy 2 maybe 3 Tahoes for the price of a LS 600.
10-01-07 | 05:08 PM
#84
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From: MD
Oh, but wait. Does the LS460 offer AWD? No. And thats what makes the LS600h a different bird than the 460.
10-01-07 | 05:30 PM
#85
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From: CT
from post #53:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
Yukon Hybrid AWD vs Yukon (5.3 liter RWD):
MPG: 25% better
Last edited by syswei; 10-01-07 at 05:35 PM.
10-01-07 | 08:14 PM
#86
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 30,117
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From: Canada
Plus you are neglecting AWD again, all AWD cars are heavier & slower than their RWD versions, the appropiate comparison would be LS600hL against an AWD version of the 460L, NOT the RWD version in production now.And it isn't much of an "efficiency hybrid" because the mpg improvement is only 11%. To me, it is a "disappointing hybrid" as compared to other Toyota/Lexus efforts, and now GM's Yukon/Tahoe. Maybe some of you feel differently, that the LS600hL is just great. I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion.
10-01-07 | 09:10 PM
#87
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From: MD
The point is that if the LS460 were an AWD vehicle, the numbers would be in favor of the LS600h.
10-01-07 | 09:22 PM
#88
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From: A better place
I agree, you are being very narrow-minded when judging the LS600hL vs an LS460L and vs the Yukon syswei.
You may not like the LS600hL, and that's fine. But the fact is that the LS600hl handles better, has faster in-gear acceleration, 1/4 mile, and passing times than compared to the LS460L, AND it STILL manages to get better fuel economy than the RWD LS460L.
Is the Yukon AWD hybrid faster than a 5.3L RWD Yukon? Does it handle better? We don't know.
You may not like the LS600hL, and that's fine. But the fact is that the LS600hl handles better, has faster in-gear acceleration, 1/4 mile, and passing times than compared to the LS460L, AND it STILL manages to get better fuel economy than the RWD LS460L.
Is the Yukon AWD hybrid faster than a 5.3L RWD Yukon? Does it handle better? We don't know.
10-02-07 | 02:40 AM
#89
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Just as a 4WD hybrid Yukon is a different bird from a 2WD ICE Yukon. Which ones gets the greater mpg improvement, the LS or the Yukon, when going from ICE to hybrid and from 2WD to 4WD?
from post #53:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
Yukon Hybrid AWD vs Yukon (5.3 liter RWD):
MPG: 25% better
from post #53:
LS600hL vs LS460L:
MPG: 11% better
Yukon Hybrid AWD vs Yukon (5.3 liter RWD):
MPG: 25% better
HH gets better improvement than Yukon's.
HH HSD system is lighter than Yukon's.
HH is same type of car as Yukon.
HH has no packaging issues as Yukon.
:-)
10-02-07 | 04:44 AM
#90
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From: CT
Uncle! You guys win.
The LS600hL is a truly amazing demonstration of the capabilities of hybrid technology. Such a huge performance gain coupled with a huge mpg improvement.
Whereas what GM has done is not impressive at all.
I have seen the light! Now all I have to do is wait for a hybrid LX, no matter how many years it takes.
The LS600hL is a truly amazing demonstration of the capabilities of hybrid technology. Such a huge performance gain coupled with a huge mpg improvement.
Whereas what GM has done is not impressive at all.
I have seen the light! Now all I have to do is wait for a hybrid LX, no matter how many years it takes.