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C&D, Edmunds, MT Test: Lexus IS-F (RS4 vs. IS-F Comparo)

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Old 10-29-07, 03:55 AM
  #121  
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Old 10-29-07, 05:57 AM
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Originally Posted by JessePS
Nice review, pretty much positive.
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Old 10-29-07, 08:38 AM
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There was always something wrong with all the earlier attempts by Lexus to make a BMW 3 Series. First, the IS 300 came onto the market with rear-wheel drive but an automatic. Then it got a manual but came with an intrusive stability program you couldn’t turn off. When the stronger 306-hp, 3.5-liter IS 350 came out, it again had an automatic but no stick.

Now, the mighty IS F, so powerful it doesn’t even get a number in its name, comes with a monstrous V8 and rear-wheel drive, and while it does have an eight-speed automatic transmission, it is such a good automatic transmission that you don’t even care that there is no manual. And the stability program comes with an off button that now, finally, stays the F off.

But first, what is an IS F, anyway? You may remember the one-off, V8-powered IS 430 made four years ago by racer-turned-engineering-guru Rod Millen (“Muscle Car Mania Hits Lexus,” AW, Dec. 22, 2003). At that time, the biggest sports sedan in the Lexus lineup was the 3.0-liter straight-six IS 300. Dropping a big V8 into this relatively small car followed the age-old hot-rodder engine-swap formula that gave us the Pontiac GTO and a host of other very fun cars.

One year later, an engineer in Japan, Yukihiko Yaguchi, approached product planners with his idea for the IS F. Breaking with tradition, wherein product planning does all the thinking up of ideas, product planning gave Yaguchi the green light. But no budget.

So Yaguchi recruited 100 to 300 of what the Lexus press department called “speed-crazy rogue engineers” and went to work. By begging, borrowing and cajoling everything from wind-tunnel time to finite element analysis, he eventually built what you see here.

Let’s talk about that 5.0-liter V8. Yaguchi didn’t want a turbo-charger to get power, because it lacked linearity. He laughed out loud when we asked if a V10 would fit. Yes, it would, he said, but it’s way too expensive and heavy. The engine he started with was the 4.6-liter V8 from the LS and the GS. Working with Yamaha, Yaguchi’s team stroked it a quarter-inch to get the displacement up to 5.0 liters. Adding the stroke made it less undersquare, giving it inherently better low-end torque. Improve-ments to the heads by Yamaha gave it high-end horsepower. It now produces 416 hp and more than 371 lb-ft of torque, numbers that make the old IS engine look like a weed whacker.

It has many unique features not found on the LS and the GS, such as dual air intakes, coolers for engine oil and trans fluid and even a cylinder-head scavenge pump so all the engine oil won’t get stuck up in the heads during high-g cornering. There are two fuel injectors per cylinder—one more or less normal port injector and one high-pressure direct injector. Below 3200 rpm, intake air comes from a single opening at the grille; above 3200, a second intake opens inside the engine bay to increase flow. The titanium intake valves are electrically variable on the intake side, while a hydraulic system controls the steel exhaust valves. Valve lift, while high, stays the same. The changes allow for a redline of 6800 rpm.

Aft of the V8 is what Lexus says is the world’s first eight-speed sport direct-shift transmission. It, too, starts life as the unit from the LS. In this application, the torque converter locks in second through eighth gears in manual mode for more efficiency. The paddle-shift manual mode holds each gear to the 6800-rpm redline. Upshifts take a tenth of a second, the fastest for a production transmission, Lexus says. Downshifts come with a blip of the throttle for smoothness.

The new car weighs 3780 pounds, only 250 more than the standard IS, so there is more than enough power to weight. Balance is 54/46 front/rear.

To get the most from the powertrain, Yaguchi tightened up the suspension throughout. First, he lowered the whole ride by an inch and stiffened the front springs by 9 percent over the IS 350 and the rears by 50 percent. Shocks and bushings are much firmer, antiroll bars substantially thicker. The rear suspension control arms are unique to the IS F to get the most from the forged 19-inch aluminum wheels. Tires are 168-mph-Y-rated Michelin Pilot Sport PS2s or Bridgestone Potenzas, 225/40 front and 255/35 rear, on 19-inch wheels. Brembo disc brakes are 14.2 inches in front with six-piston calipers and 13.6 inches in back with two-piston calipers.

Here’s the part where Lexus finally got it: Vehicle Dynamics Integrated Management (VDIM), which keeps you from killing yourself and your car, or makes it a little harder, can be turned off. You can finally do donuts all day long. A mode switch has normal, sport and snow settings. The sport mode increases effort and weight of the electric power steering, raises shift points in the transmission, quickens the throttle response rate and allows more lateral movement before VDIM steps in.

The goal was not to make a BMW M3, Yaguchi said, though many people will see it as such.

“The M3 is fun for a really good driver, but if you’re not a really good driver, it’s not fun,” he said. “This is a car everyone can enjoy; with this car, your skill level doesn’t matter.”

Thank goodness. They were about to turn us loose on Mazda Raceway at Laguna Seca. At first, we rode with instructors from the Skip Barber School. Reminded that you actually accelerate into turns three and six and brake a little in nine and a lot going into 11, we set out on our own.

It performed exactly as advertised. It was safe, fun and, even with VDIM off, still stable. Power was prodigious and delivered in a linear fashion. At Laguna Seca, we were able to use everything from third to sixth gear, with a few attempts to get down into second when we entered turn four too slowly.

Coming over the terrifying crest under the bridge at start/ finish, the car remained stable, despite the loss of some of the gravity it had on the rest of the course. Braking was stable, too, especially going into one, where you don’t want anything funny to happen. The hard-core will miss the ultimate truth of an all-out sport suspension. This one is softer than the previous M3’s, for instance. But it is a tradeoff we could live with.

Upshifts were indeed impressive, though we didn’t time them to the tenth of a second. Banging the paddle shifters up along the main straight, we felt like Helio Castro freaking Neves. And the way the throttle blipped on downshifts, we felt like Schuey himself, though his and everyone’s trannies nowadays do everything for them.

Body roll in corners was not a problem—in fact, it was almost unnoticeable—and the tires never seemed to let go. We saw others powersliding coming out of turn 11, but we never got the rear end out of line, even while trying to figure out how much braking to add on the downhill left-hander of turn nine.

Later that day, we took an IS F over Laureles Grade and up G16 for quite a distance, over turns that tightened up suddenly and on a road surface that could use a few fresh layers of asphalt to be brought up to FIA standards. Although we dodged the worst of the bumps and holes, we couldn’t miss them all, and the IS F did not shudder or jar us when we whacked them.

It is a car you can drive comfortably at Laguna Seca or to work. As Yaguchi said, your skill level doesn’t matter.

So, what is the market level for the IS F?

“This is definitely not aimed at anyone buying our cars now,” said then-Lexus vice president Jim Farley.

The average ES buyer is 61 years old. The IS buyer is in the low 40s. We figure the IS F will pull that average down a lot.

Lexus cleverly chose to reveal its IS F just before BMW revealed its M3. Or was that pure coincidence? In either case, everyone’s stories about the Lexus IS F will come out before everyone’s other stories about the M3. This will allow people to view the IS F separately as a sports sedan unto itself. In such context, it is an unbridled success. Against the M3, we’ll have to wait and see.

Anyone in the market for a thrilling sports sedan very soon will have more choices than a cute girl at MIT. In addition to the 416-hp IS F, you can peruse the coming M3 sedan’s 414-hp 4.0-liter, the Audi RS4’s 420-hp 4.2 and the mighty 457-hp 6.2-liter in the Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG. All of them have four doors and V8s driving the rear wheels (and the front wheels, in the case of the RS4 quattro). Is this a great time to be alive (and with a $60,000-or-so budget) or what?

Actual prices, of course, will come out closer to the car’s launch, which is scheduled for early 2008. The biggest news may not be just this IS F but a whole bunch of future F’s.

“We are looking at this launch from a whole branding standpoint,” said Farley.

That could mean accessories for the IS 250 and 350. If we had to guess, well, we do know the IS platform is derived from the Lexus GS sedan . . .

http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../71026003/1065
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Old 10-29-07, 08:42 AM
  #124  
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Default Edmunds Comparo: IS-F vs. RS4

Can Lexus Take Down the Germans Again?




1st Place - Audi RS4
2nd Place - Lexus IS-F


With the introduction of the 2009 Lexus IS-F, it's supposed to be 1989 all over again.

That was the year that Toyota dared to take on the established German luxury carmakers with its brand-new luxury division, Lexus. And it was also the year that the Lexus LS 400 sedan's immediate success embarrassed those German luxury carmakers into dramatically improving their quality, their customer service and even their prices.

Lexus would like you to believe that the 416-horsepower IS-F will have a similar impact on the market for over-endowed hot-rod sedans that is dominated by (you guessed it) the Germans. The "F" suffix for this new variant of the IS is a nod to the early days of Lexus, when "F1" became the code designation for the LS 400 prototype.

But Wait Just a Minute There
Don't don your bomber jacket, crank up the Whitesnake and pretend it's 1989 just yet. There's the small matter of those three German sedans, each of which makes around the same 400-plus horsepower as the IS-F.

To put the $60,000 2009 Lexus IS-F to the test, we rounded up one of our favorite German über-sedans, the Audi RS4. We left out the BMW M3 partly because it is only currently offered as a two-door and also because it hasn't, you know, actually been formally introduced to the U.S. yet. And the same goes for the Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG.

For now, though, it is a battle between the bulked-up, slammed-down Lexus IS-F and the Audi RS4, the all-wheel-drive A4 with a 420-hp V8 that we recently described as "The Best Driving Audi Ever."

Freaky Styley
Unfortunately, before you can take a seat behind the wheel of the Lexus IS-F, you have to, you know, see it. We accept that the question of styling is largely a subjective matter. So there might be some Toyota fanboys who will admire the IS-F's nose — so like that of a Beluga whale. They might even like the dewlaplike growths behind the front wheels. But no one of sound mind could love the stacked quad exhaust tips. This is at least partly because they are not actually exhaust tips. In fact, they are not connected to the exhaust system in any way. They are simply jewelry for the rear fascia. It's an uncharacteristically cheesy execution by Lexus.

Yet when you see it slammed down almost an inch on 19-inch anthracite-finish BBS wheels, the spokes of which look like a pinwheel of razor-sharp chef's knives, the IS-F is sufficiently menacing. Glinting behind the wheels you'll find drilled and vented brake rotors with Brembo calipers. At 14.2 inches in diameter, the front rotors are slightly larger than a large Domino's pizza, while the rears are only about a half-inch smaller.

Where the IS-F has a certain look that we associate with the worst excesses of the aftermarket, the Audi is all understated musculature. It's relatively subtle, but we like it. Wide 19-inch wheels and tires are covered (barely) by dramatically flared fenders. And the special trunk lid has the sweetest ducktail spoiler formed into the metal. A lower ride height, satin-finish metal trim, a deeper front fascia and gorgeous wheels round out the RS4's visual signifiers.

The Inside Lines
Audi carries the same subtlety into the interior of the RS4. The seats are unique to the RS4, and they combine stellar support and comfort. This car also arrived with glossy strips of decorative carbon-fiber interior trim. (Brushed aluminum is also available but isn't as fast as carbon fiber.) Our test vehicle didn't come with the optional navigation system to confuse passengers or the memory-function seats to comfort them. It is what you might call a stripper if you can ever call a $68,875 car a stripper.

The poor bastards you cram in the backseat of the RS4 will become intimately acquainted with the meaning of "compact sedan" and also with each other, because the Audi rides on a 104.3-inch wheelbase that doesn't leave much legroom for those in the rear. At the same time, the rear-seat passengers for the Lexus IS-F are no more comfortable despite a wheelbase that's 3 inches longer. The Lexus seems more sporty because the rear seat accommodates only two passengers in quasi-buckets separated by an armrest, while the Audi is more practical, with three seatbelts in place on a conventional bench.

The IS-F's interior is a bit flashier than that of the austere German. Start it up and the blue needles for the tachometer and speedometer spin while a little "F" logo materializes between them. The almost-white woven-metal trim is a little showy for our taste, and the IS-F is seemingly always binging or beeping while in operation.

All Motor
Lexus could have just dropped its standard 4.6-liter V8 into the nose of the IS nose and made an easy 350 hp. Instead, the company started with the 5.0-liter V8 that is the gas-burning portion of the LS 600h powertrain. In the IS-F, the 5.0-liter makes 416 hp and 371 pound-feet of torque.

To get such power, Lexus threw everything it has at this engine. It's got titanium intake valves. It's got a water-cooled oil-cooler. It's got hollow camshafts. It's got direct injection and port injection. Hell, even the center shaft of the throttle butterfly is 3 millimeters narrower to permit incrementally better airflow when the butterfly is open.

You'll really notice the dual air intake. At low speeds, the engine breathes discreetly through the primary inlet. At engine speeds of 3,600 rpm or greater, a secondary valve opens and draws air from the right wheelwell. When that secondary air intake opens, it's as if the fine coffee you normally drink has been secretly replaced with nitromethane. The intake howl sounds fantastic and makes the IS-F feel quicker than it really is.

We wish only that Lexus could have given the engine note south of 3,600 rpm a little whiff of that high-rpm fury. Around town, only a faint rumble differentiates the IS-F's V8 from lesser Lexus motors, and you don't have any sense of the beast waiting on the right side of the tachometer.

Audi's 420-hp 4.2-liter V8 makes up for its displacement deficit with high revs, and it will constantly remind you why you write such a big check every month. It has the finest exhaust note on the market today, and the tone never wavers. There are no pronounced bursts of power in the Audi's curve; instead there's power everywhere.

Speed Shifting
If the IS-F's engine seems complicated, get a load of its one transmission offering. This eight-speed automatic is adapted from the tranny in the LS luxo barge.

Leave the shifter in fully automatic mode and you can never quite shake the impression that there are three too many gears in the box. It seems to always be lounging around in 7th on the highway and dithering among its many gears around town. Downshifts are slow to come. When it finally finds a nice low gear, the engine is spinning wildly, the engine note has turned angry and you've got more power than you asked for, plus it arrives later than you wanted it. Use the automatic mode only for traffic jams.

It's better to leave the transmission in manual mode and use the steering-column-mounted shift paddles to choose from the myriad gears. In all but 1st gear, this transmission uses a lock-up clutch to connect the engine and transmission, something like a conventional manual powertrain. When you combine the crisp feeling of engine response that results with tremendously quick upshifts and downshifts (with automatic throttle blips), the complex transmission becomes one of the most entertaining sequential-shift automatics.

The RS4 is offered only with a six-speed manual. Turns out, for a dedicated high-performance car, that old gearlever-and-clutch-pedal thing is still the way to go.

Numbers Don't (Often) Lie
Even with the roughly 70 pounds of extra weight that it carries, the 3,848-pound Audi is the quicker of these two cars.

Try this with your friend's RS4. At full stop, engage 1st gear, keep the clutch depressed and push the accelerator pedal until the tachometer registers 5,500 rpm. Then remove your foot from the clutch. All four wheels spin for a moment and then the RS4 digs its claws into the pavement and catapults forward to 60 mph in 4.3 seconds and on through the quarter-mile in 12.8 seconds at 108.5 mph. The all-wheel-drive Lamborghini Gallardo posts better numbers, but not by much.

The 3,780-pound IS-F gets to 60 mph in 4.8 seconds and does the quarter-mile in 13.2 seconds at 109 mph, trailing the RS4 to 60 mph by about a half-second and to the quarter-mile by almost as much. This is with the stability and traction control systems off (yes, Lexus actually allows such a thing, a policy initiated for its performance cars for 2007) and the transmission in Drive. Later we made our runs and manually shifted the IS-F's transmission, which feels fast but predictably isn't, especially since the launch is better in Drive.

Not that it matters. For all its displacement, technology and furious bark, the Lexus 5.0-liter doesn't make the IS-F much quicker than a BMW 335i, which makes 116 hp less.

Both cars stop with tremendous force and stability in a commendably short distance, with the Lexus coming to a halt from 60 mph in 112 feet and the Audi doing the job in 117 feet.

The Real Road and Track
The Lexus generates an impressive 0.93g of grip on the skid pad with its Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 tires, significantly more than the Audi's 0.89g on its Continental ContiSport Contact3 rubber. Despite this, the RS4 barrels through the slalom fractionally faster at 70.5 mph to the IS-F's 70.2 mph. Give some credit here to the Audi's super-quick steering ratio and some blame to the IS-F's tail, which according to one understated tester, "gets pretty lively."

For all their similarities, including the near-identical performance in the slalom, these two cars go about their business in opposite ways. And neither acts quite like you might expect it to.

According to tradition, the Audi should lack steering feel thanks to its all-wheel-drive system. It should understeer heavily as it gets led around by its heavy nose. And it should exhibit a flinty ride. Yet the Audi has the more communicative steering here. Its cornering attitude is surprisingly neutral. And its compromise between a comfortable ride and good handling ranks with the best that BMW has accomplished over the years.

The Lexus should be the one with the plusher ride, the less treacherous handling and the more intrusive safety net of electronic gizmos. Wrong again. Front spring and damper rates are up a whopping 90 percent compared to the standard IS, and the rear rates are 50 percent firmer. This is a stiff car — so stiff over freeway undulations that it forces small, involuntary exhalations from its passengers. One of us even knocked his noggin into the headliner, badly mussing his hair.

The World We Live In
The 2009 Lexus IS-F is the kind of car that really benefits from switching off the stability control, as it'll do some really wicked powerslides. And the IS-F handles really nicely and precisely. It's just too much for us, though. Too much to look at, too intricate to fully appreciate and too hard-core for the street.

The all-wheel-drive 2007 Audi RS4 just plain hauls ***. It doesn't rotate around an apex like a rear-driver. It's less the rapier than it is the broadsword. But it's devastatingly effective as a street machine, so it wins.

So it's not 1989, but it might just be the good old days anyway.
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Old 10-29-07, 09:29 AM
  #125  
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DAM! Lexus Hopefully the next review bwill be better.
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Old 10-29-07, 09:34 AM
  #126  
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pretty much all reviews the IS-F has gotten disagree with biased edmunds, and crush edmunds performance times
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Old 10-29-07, 09:58 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by 4TehNguyen
pretty much all reviews the IS-F has gotten disagree with biased edmunds, and crush edmunds performance times
I don't read or use Edmunds coincidently. I always felt it was written by morons for morons.

That review was not professional at all with some of the things they state either.
 
Old 10-29-07, 10:16 AM
  #128  
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Quote from Edmunds: "The 3,780-pound IS-F gets to 60 mph in 4.8 seconds and does the quarter-mile in 13.2 seconds at 109 mph, trailing the RS4 to 60 mph by about a half-second and to the quarter-mile by almost as much. This is with the stability and traction control systems off (yes, Lexus actually allows such a thing, a policy initiated for its performance cars for 2007) and the transmission in Drive. Later we made our runs and manually shifted the IS-F's transmission, which feels fast but predictably isn't, especially since the launch is better in Drive."

Proof that the Edmunds guys have no idea how to launch a car that isn't idiot-proof AWD. Car and Driver on the other hand, did it in Sport mode (less wheel spin there) and with manual shifting (they're willing to experiment to find the best shift points, not to mention the shifting is faster in manual mode).

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Old 10-29-07, 10:41 AM
  #129  
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This part of the write up is interesting..
Not that it matters. For all its displacement, technology and furious bark, the Lexus 5.0-liter doesn't make the IS-F much quicker than a BMW 335i, which makes 116 hp less.
I say get a 335 spend & spend the remaining money on a Toyota Scion TC and vaction at Disney World




Oh..... sorry my my..
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Old 10-29-07, 10:50 AM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by DASHOCKER
This part of the write up is interesting..

I say get a 335 spend & spend the remaining money on a Toyota Scion TC and vaction at Disney World

Oh..... sorry my my..
For supposedly an "old timer", you sure have that bavarian sauerkraut well up your ****. Taking the context of one review, who doesn't know how to drive nevertheless, and ignoring the others as the end all, be all is very noobish to say the least.

The 335i is a wonderous car no doubt (i still am contemplating one depending on what the aftermarket does), but to champion just one straightline time as the only qualifying stat for buyers is stupid. A much cheaper, comparable Evo can run circles around both, but who cares. Think past your apparent bias for once please....
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Old 10-29-07, 11:06 AM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by ST430
The 335i is a wonderous car no doubt (i still am contemplating one depending on what the aftermarket does), ...
LOL.. Your posts are farcical.. Talk about the cars buddy.. Why not opt for the IS-F? This car is far superior and on par with the super saloons more so than a 335. Sounds like someone will be sharing the proverbial "sauerkraut"
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Old 10-29-07, 11:25 AM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by DASHOCKER
LOL.. Your posts are farcical.. Talk about the cars buddy.. Why not opt for the IS-F? This car is far superior and on par with the super saloons more so than a 335. Sounds like someone will be sharing the proverbial "sauerkraut"
Sorry, I don't need to relish on my own bimmer epeen by slandering other cars i have no personal experiences with. If I should ever own a Bimmer, I would have more emperical data to back up any sensationalized biased claims than merely believing in heresay from one review source (while ignoring others too) especially in a generalized forum meant for relay of information, then biased views. As I said, I can easily compare an Evo to any Bimmer and performance / aftermarket wise, it would put it to shame, but their are much other considerations to a vehicle then just straightline / performance times.
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Old 10-29-07, 11:27 AM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by DASHOCKER
LOL.. Your posts are farcical.. Talk about the cars buddy.. Why not opt for the IS-F? This car is far superior and on par with the super saloons more so than a 335. Sounds like someone will be sharing the proverbial "sauerkraut"
Well to be fair your posts in general are bias towards BMW. I tend to not get into these bouts and stay neutral. Your post however (in regards to the reply) was sarcastic, so to ST430: he was kidding.
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Old 10-29-07, 11:35 AM
  #134  
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This is all in fun guys.. This is car chat
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Old 10-29-07, 11:39 AM
  #135  
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You know, some of you guys are comparing cars that are TOTALLY irrelevant in terms of class. If the world, in REALITY, was like that then I should have no problem taking on Germans, Japanese, American, or Anyone else for that matter on my 2 wheel bicycle given I put a Yamaha R1 engine on it...

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