Please--Turn on Your Headights in the Rain
12-03-07, 10:52 AM
#16
G35x - RWD/AWD goodness
While your car review opinions are strongly in line with mine, on other issues, I sometimes feel that you like to argue for the sake of arguing. If something isn't in line with your beliefs, you're totally unreceptive to it.
As far as I'm concerned, your lights should be on in heavy rain, overcast, foggy and other poor weather conditions. This is not for YOUR visibility, but for OTHER people to see your car better and vice versa.
If after all your years of driving, you haven't noticed this, then your observational skills are in question and I believe it is your driving that poses a safety threat to other people on the road.
As far as I'm concerned, your lights should be on in heavy rain, overcast, foggy and other poor weather conditions. This is not for YOUR visibility, but for OTHER people to see your car better and vice versa.
If after all your years of driving, you haven't noticed this, then your observational skills are in question and I believe it is your driving that poses a safety threat to other people on the road.
Lets get this thread back on to tex2670's topic of "Please--Turn on Your Headights in the Rain" or I'll have to close it.
12-03-07, 11:15 AM
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
This is the 3rd moderator stating the same thing. Comment on the thread title, not on people. Tis the season for warnings.
As for lights when it rains, I agree 150% that lights SHOULD BE ON. This is so funny b/c I was going to start a thread like this. IMO, the worst offenders are the people who need to have their lights on most, gray hues, blacks, dark colored cars. Then you add cars with broken tails and headlights and brake lights out of order and you have a mess.
12-03-07, 11:20 AM
#19
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Which is why I turn my lights to the city/parking lights when it's raining--full intensity is not usually necessary, but illuminating the tail lights usually is. I wish my fogs worked with the parking lights.
12-03-07, 11:35 AM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
I can see that my comments and relies to the initial thread topic are quite controversial. Rest assured, everyone, that I did not intend to start World War III with my comments. I understand the reasons some of you have in support for the wipers-and-lights together laws...and respect them.
But I was only pointing out that there are two sides to the issue, that's all. I wasn't arguing, as one poster suggested, just for the sake of arguing. I presented eight strong reasons why I disagree with and disapprove of such laws...and I stand behind those arguements. That is not just my idle opinion alone.....it is my experiences as well over decades and many thousands of miles of driving. And some of you complain that the laws are not enforced......and I was only pointing out some possible reasons why.
It is the same when I open a thread myself. I don't always expect everyone to agree with me, and that is usually the case.
But I was only pointing out that there are two sides to the issue, that's all. I wasn't arguing, as one poster suggested, just for the sake of arguing. I presented eight strong reasons why I disagree with and disapprove of such laws...and I stand behind those arguements. That is not just my idle opinion alone.....it is my experiences as well over decades and many thousands of miles of driving. And some of you complain that the laws are not enforced......and I was only pointing out some possible reasons why.
It is the same when I open a thread myself. I don't always expect everyone to agree with me, and that is usually the case.
12-03-07, 11:42 AM
#21
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
I can see that my comments and relies to the initial thread topic are quite controversial. Rest assured, everyone, that I did not intend to start World War III with my comments. I understand the reasons some of you have in support for the wipers-and-lights together laws...and respect them.
But I was only pointing out that there are two sides to the issue, that's all. I wasn't arguing, as one poster suggested, just for the sake of arguing. I presented eight strong reasons why I disagree with and disapprove of such laws...and I stand behind those arguements. That is not just my idle opinion alone.....it is my experiences as well over decades and many thousands of miles of driving. And some of you complain that the laws are not enforced......and I was only pointing out some possible reasons why.
It is the same when I open a thread myself. I don't always expect everyone to agree with me, and that is usually the case.
But I was only pointing out that there are two sides to the issue, that's all. I wasn't arguing, as one poster suggested, just for the sake of arguing. I presented eight strong reasons why I disagree with and disapprove of such laws...and I stand behind those arguements. That is not just my idle opinion alone.....it is my experiences as well over decades and many thousands of miles of driving. And some of you complain that the laws are not enforced......and I was only pointing out some possible reasons why.
It is the same when I open a thread myself. I don't always expect everyone to agree with me, and that is usually the case.
12-03-07, 12:46 PM
#22
I turn my headlights on whenever it is dark or gray.
I don't think the daytime running lamps are as effective as the HID's anyways
and since my car is gray, it won't just blend into the background like a
chameleon...
I don't think the daytime running lamps are as effective as the HID's anyways
and since my car is gray, it won't just blend into the background like a
chameleon...
12-03-07, 02:01 PM
#23
Well in my opinion I want people to see my car because I can't trust their driving skills. So I turn my lights on when it gets too dark, or even too bright (with glare in your face it's easier to find the bumper of another car if they have their headlights/taillights on, even if I'm wearing sunglasses and have the sunshade down I can still have trouble seeing people when there is bad glare) or inclement weather.
I say turn on your headlights/taillights whenever you think other people might have trouble seeing you, it may not necessarily be when you have the wipers on. I think the wipers thing is a moot point but most of the time when I need the wipers I need the headlights and taillights as well. I'd rather burn out a bulb (even if it is a $100 xenon bulb) rather than get smashed by someone who can't see me or even worse save my life.
I can see mmarshall's point when it comes to laws on this but I think if people don't have laws for this than people won't turn them on when they need to.
I hate DRL's as Mike stated because they don't turn on the tails. I have seen countless amount of people driving at night with DRL's on (as if it's enough to light the road anyway) but the tails are off so when I come up on them unexpectedly I have to avoid them because I don't see them earlier.
I think a good resolution is to have lights on at all times like instead of DRL's that the city/parking lights are on at all times. That way you have lights on both in front and back of you. And I'm sorry the expensive bulb thing is not enough reason for safety. I agree though if we got the people who aren't safe enough on the streets to begin with off the roads we wouldn't have this argument. I really wish they would be more strict on who can get licenses and that people get re-tested on the road to assure that people can actually still drive after decades of having got their license.
I say turn on your headlights/taillights whenever you think other people might have trouble seeing you, it may not necessarily be when you have the wipers on. I think the wipers thing is a moot point but most of the time when I need the wipers I need the headlights and taillights as well. I'd rather burn out a bulb (even if it is a $100 xenon bulb) rather than get smashed by someone who can't see me or even worse save my life.
I can see mmarshall's point when it comes to laws on this but I think if people don't have laws for this than people won't turn them on when they need to.
I hate DRL's as Mike stated because they don't turn on the tails. I have seen countless amount of people driving at night with DRL's on (as if it's enough to light the road anyway) but the tails are off so when I come up on them unexpectedly I have to avoid them because I don't see them earlier.
I think a good resolution is to have lights on at all times like instead of DRL's that the city/parking lights are on at all times. That way you have lights on both in front and back of you. And I'm sorry the expensive bulb thing is not enough reason for safety. I agree though if we got the people who aren't safe enough on the streets to begin with off the roads we wouldn't have this argument. I really wish they would be more strict on who can get licenses and that people get re-tested on the road to assure that people can actually still drive after decades of having got their license.
Last edited by Koma; 12-03-07 at 02:08 PM.
12-03-07, 03:04 PM
#24
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It is the law in PA. Supposed to have em on in construction zones too. Never heard of anyone being ticketed for fairling to do either.
12-03-07, 06:28 PM
#26
OK,,, time for me to chime in. First off, let me say that I am not attacking any of you by quoting you but I can offer a unique perspective that most of you will NEVER be able to see. The wipers on, lights on law is NOT ONLY in effect in most if not all of the Eastern Coast of the United States, but a great part of the Mid-Western states as well. I ABSOLUTELY AGREE that when the wipers are on, you lights NEED TO BE ON. . See the thing is, I drive a tractor trailer all across the country for a living. I have driven thru rain, snow, heavy fog, tropical storms, hurricanes, etc. in the course of getting my job done. As most of you know, trucks have INCREDIBLy HUGE blind spots, in which I can actually loose you car in my mirrors if not careful. Yes, I do have a commanding view of the road, over the rest of you, but what happens when it rains??
Firstly,, I don't care WHAT COLOR your car is, in the rain when you are kicking up spray from the road and tossing it behind you, your car WILL BLEND IN TO ALMOST NOTHINGNESS!!! In inclement weather, I actually LOOK for some type of light in order for me to get an idea os where you are in relation to me, and if I am able to safely change lanes as well. Remember,, the same road spray that you are kicking up,, I am also kicking it up, out, and behind me 20 times worse. While you meay be able to see me, let's face it there are some people who absolutely do not know how to drive around trucks and will challenge them no matter what. In bad weather it gets even worse. Example,, I am going down the road and it is raining badly. I am kicking spray out from all around my truck (and all of yall know that the spray from a truck can be absolutely blinding). I decide I want to change lanes to get around a slower moving vehicle in front of me. I look in my mirror, and remember for the most part all I can see is the cloud of my OWN spray so anyone concealed within is invisible to me without lights. I flip the signal and change lanes,, all of a sudden, in a break in the spray, there you are beside me with no lights of any kind and I barely saw you. I have to take evasive manuevers to avoid hitting you and also to keep my truck under control. Simple solution,, with lights on, I would have seen you before hand and would not have to make such an evasive move to avoid you and I would have just stayed put until you passed me, or flashed me to come out.
Example 2.. I am following you down the road. All of a sudden we run into a torrential downpour. You are kicking spray up behind your car and I can get a good judgement of where you are, but heaven help you as the rain is harder b/c no matter what color your car is,, I am only looking DOWNWARD on the rear top side of your car to try to find you in front of me. Remember, as you kick it backwards,, the arc gets larger behind you, and Yes you will disapear.
DRL's are one solution, if you are behind me,, I can at least get an idea of your placement,, but what happens when you are in front of me. You are, in my vision, gone because the DRL's dont activate the tail lights and warn me that traffic is slowing, moving etc so I have time to react.
You all have valid points,, no the govt should not tell you WHEN to use your lights,, it should be common sense. Let's face it, if EVERYONE used their common sense all of the time, the roads would be alot safer. This goes for all of you 4wheelers( CB lingo for civilians) AS WELL as US TRUCKERS too(trust me I know that truckers are not all innocent either). So the point to be made here is a request,,,,,
PLEASE TURN ON YOUR LIGHTS IN BAD WEATHER. THE LIFE YOU SAVE BY HAVING SOMEONE SEE YOU MAY BE YOUR OWN. BETTER YET,,MINE!!!!!
Firstly,, I don't care WHAT COLOR your car is, in the rain when you are kicking up spray from the road and tossing it behind you, your car WILL BLEND IN TO ALMOST NOTHINGNESS!!! In inclement weather, I actually LOOK for some type of light in order for me to get an idea os where you are in relation to me, and if I am able to safely change lanes as well. Remember,, the same road spray that you are kicking up,, I am also kicking it up, out, and behind me 20 times worse. While you meay be able to see me, let's face it there are some people who absolutely do not know how to drive around trucks and will challenge them no matter what. In bad weather it gets even worse. Example,, I am going down the road and it is raining badly. I am kicking spray out from all around my truck (and all of yall know that the spray from a truck can be absolutely blinding). I decide I want to change lanes to get around a slower moving vehicle in front of me. I look in my mirror, and remember for the most part all I can see is the cloud of my OWN spray so anyone concealed within is invisible to me without lights. I flip the signal and change lanes,, all of a sudden, in a break in the spray, there you are beside me with no lights of any kind and I barely saw you. I have to take evasive manuevers to avoid hitting you and also to keep my truck under control. Simple solution,, with lights on, I would have seen you before hand and would not have to make such an evasive move to avoid you and I would have just stayed put until you passed me, or flashed me to come out.
Example 2.. I am following you down the road. All of a sudden we run into a torrential downpour. You are kicking spray up behind your car and I can get a good judgement of where you are, but heaven help you as the rain is harder b/c no matter what color your car is,, I am only looking DOWNWARD on the rear top side of your car to try to find you in front of me. Remember, as you kick it backwards,, the arc gets larger behind you, and Yes you will disapear.
DRL's are one solution, if you are behind me,, I can at least get an idea of your placement,, but what happens when you are in front of me. You are, in my vision, gone because the DRL's dont activate the tail lights and warn me that traffic is slowing, moving etc so I have time to react.
You all have valid points,, no the govt should not tell you WHEN to use your lights,, it should be common sense. Let's face it, if EVERYONE used their common sense all of the time, the roads would be alot safer. This goes for all of you 4wheelers( CB lingo for civilians) AS WELL as US TRUCKERS too(trust me I know that truckers are not all innocent either). So the point to be made here is a request,,,,,
PLEASE TURN ON YOUR LIGHTS IN BAD WEATHER. THE LIFE YOU SAVE BY HAVING SOMEONE SEE YOU MAY BE YOUR OWN. BETTER YET,,MINE!!!!!
Last edited by trukn1; 12-03-07 at 06:34 PM.
12-03-07, 06:32 PM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
DRL's are one solution, if you are behind me,, I can at least get an idea of your placement,, but what happens when you are in front of me. You are, in my vision, gone because the DRL's dont activate the tail lights and warn me that traffic is slowing, moving etc so I have time to react.
12-03-07, 06:43 PM
#28
No, am saying that someone who at least has DRL's on, should really have on the regular headlights, stands a greater chance for me seeing them in bad weather, than someone who does not have any lights on at all. The DRL statement only applies in my comment if someone is BEHIND me. Even in the road spray, I can at least see the light, no matter how bright, and know that someone may be near me, and it may not be safe to change lanes yet until I can get a better judgement of their location. Tail lights in bad weather help me to see where a person is for the same reasons. If I cant see your lights in front of me, it is hard for me to judge where you are, especially since you yourself may be in the arc spray of the car in front of you. This is why I advocate lights being on in bad weather. Just helps others locate your vehicle and judge accordingly where you are so they can adjust their own driving, spacing, etc.
12-03-07, 07:04 PM
#29
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
12-03-07, 07:38 PM
#30
Nope. Sorry. I respect your opinion, 
but I don't agree with lights-with-wiper-on laws...and yes, we do have that law here in VA (or when visibility is less than 500 feet).
In both my state and yours, whether we agree or not, of course, is a moot point because it is a public law, but I don't see the point in having a law like this. First, I drove, literally, for decades, without any accidents or visibility problems, all over the Eastern U.S., in all kinds of weather and road surfaces, down to almost zero visibility, without laws like this....and my eyes aren't necessarily any better than those of most people. Second, why should Big Brother be telling us when to turn the lights on and when not to? The average person has enough intelligence to determine that for himself or herself (and, as an ex-airplane pilot, I certainly had the judgement to know how to determine visibility). Third, Drivers' Licenses, just like Pilot's Licenses, are issued for a reason. If you, as a driver, DON'T have enough sense to know when to turn your lights on and off, then IMO you shouldn't have a license at all. Neither, IMO, should you have a license if your eyes are that poor. Better vision testing at DMV centers would help with that problem.....the present eye tests are a joke, and are rarely actually given. Fourth, most of today's new vehicles already have DRL's (Daytime Running Lights) that go on and off with the ignition and parking brake...they pretty much have the same effect. Fifth, look at what DRL's actually do.........they run the headlights continuously (though at slightly less intensity).........placing a lot of unnecessary wear on what can be very expensive bulbs in some upscale cars. Go check out the price of a replacement Xenon, Arc-Lamp, or HID bulb lately....they can cost real money. Sixth, when the DRL's wear out the bulbs prematurely, then you have NO headlights at all..........they are not there at all when you DO need them. Seventh, if you're THAT concerned about visibility, don't buy a gray or silver car...those colors blend in with the gray asphalt on the road surface and make the car harder to see at a distance. Instead, get a white car, or, if possible, a bright color like orange, red, or yellow for visibility.......though too many cars are only offered in dull colors; that is a point I often bring up in my auto reviews. Eighth, if you keep your windshield clean, free of film, change your wiper blades when you should (in most areas, every year-and-a-half or so due to rubber deterioration, ozone, and oxidation), you will have good visibility just with the wipers alone....you won't need extra lights.
So........as you say, we're stuck with that law, but you are complaining that it is not enforced. Perhaps now, you see WHY it is not enforced.
but I don't agree with lights-with-wiper-on laws...and yes, we do have that law here in VA (or when visibility is less than 500 feet). In both my state and yours, whether we agree or not, of course, is a moot point because it is a public law, but I don't see the point in having a law like this. First, I drove, literally, for decades, without any accidents or visibility problems, all over the Eastern U.S., in all kinds of weather and road surfaces, down to almost zero visibility, without laws like this....and my eyes aren't necessarily any better than those of most people. Second, why should Big Brother be telling us when to turn the lights on and when not to? The average person has enough intelligence to determine that for himself or herself (and, as an ex-airplane pilot, I certainly had the judgement to know how to determine visibility). Third, Drivers' Licenses, just like Pilot's Licenses, are issued for a reason. If you, as a driver, DON'T have enough sense to know when to turn your lights on and off, then IMO you shouldn't have a license at all. Neither, IMO, should you have a license if your eyes are that poor. Better vision testing at DMV centers would help with that problem.....the present eye tests are a joke, and are rarely actually given. Fourth, most of today's new vehicles already have DRL's (Daytime Running Lights) that go on and off with the ignition and parking brake...they pretty much have the same effect. Fifth, look at what DRL's actually do.........they run the headlights continuously (though at slightly less intensity).........placing a lot of unnecessary wear on what can be very expensive bulbs in some upscale cars. Go check out the price of a replacement Xenon, Arc-Lamp, or HID bulb lately....they can cost real money. Sixth, when the DRL's wear out the bulbs prematurely, then you have NO headlights at all..........they are not there at all when you DO need them. Seventh, if you're THAT concerned about visibility, don't buy a gray or silver car...those colors blend in with the gray asphalt on the road surface and make the car harder to see at a distance. Instead, get a white car, or, if possible, a bright color like orange, red, or yellow for visibility.......though too many cars are only offered in dull colors; that is a point I often bring up in my auto reviews. Eighth, if you keep your windshield clean, free of film, change your wiper blades when you should (in most areas, every year-and-a-half or so due to rubber deterioration, ozone, and oxidation), you will have good visibility just with the wipers alone....you won't need extra lights.
So........as you say, we're stuck with that law, but you are complaining that it is not enforced. Perhaps now, you see WHY it is not enforced.
And while we're on the subject of lighting, how come my area has a sudden increase of rear foglight usage? It's like some morons just discovered another way of blinding us with a rear foglight. If it's not misty, foggy or raining/snowing heavily, leave that damn light off!