Wards announces "Ten Best Engines" list for 2007
12-13-07, 09:19 PM
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
1SICKLEX,
How exactly are engines "faster" than one another? Engine's don't run by themselves. Personally, I believe the new VQ37VHR is an excellent engine. Great power (note I didn't say "faster", because power delivery is only one part of the equation of speed & acceleration), sounds great & feels great, and has great technology with the addition of Variable Valve Event & Lift (VVEL). The engine has been up there in Wards Top 10 Engines for 13 consecutive years for a reason.
The only reason why the G37 is slightly slower than the IS350 is weight. If they both were to weigh the same, the G37 would easily out accelerate the IS350. Seeing how the lighter G35 Sedan with 306 HP matches the performance of the heavier G37 with 330hp, we can only imagine a G37 with the sedan's lighter weight would perform. As far as the 335i, its definately an under-rated "300hp/300tq". But then again, BMW does have a tradition of under-rating their specified power ratings.
I do agree though, that the VQ has had a bad tradition of gas guzzling for a V6. My 2006 G35 Coupe 6MT gets the same gas milage as my brothers 07 Mustang GT's, and my Dad's Lexus GS430
.
How exactly are engines "faster" than one another? Engine's don't run by themselves. Personally, I believe the new VQ37VHR is an excellent engine. Great power (note I didn't say "faster", because power delivery is only one part of the equation of speed & acceleration), sounds great & feels great, and has great technology with the addition of Variable Valve Event & Lift (VVEL). The engine has been up there in Wards Top 10 Engines for 13 consecutive years for a reason.
The only reason why the G37 is slightly slower than the IS350 is weight. If they both were to weigh the same, the G37 would easily out accelerate the IS350. Seeing how the lighter G35 Sedan with 306 HP matches the performance of the heavier G37 with 330hp, we can only imagine a G37 with the sedan's lighter weight would perform. As far as the 335i, its definately an under-rated "300hp/300tq". But then again, BMW does have a tradition of under-rating their specified power ratings.
I do agree though, that the VQ has had a bad tradition of gas guzzling for a V6. My 2006 G35 Coupe 6MT gets the same gas milage as my brothers 07 Mustang GT's, and my Dad's Lexus GS430
.
I'll back off, b/c I'm now thinking they chose the 3.7 as this is the next evolution of the VQ and will surely be used in more applications. I am 100% in support of a VQ (3.5 or 3.7) engine being on that list, that engine has been sensational for over a decade.
12-14-07, 06:24 AM
#47
Lexus Test Driver
I guess I don't see the 3.7 really being any better than the 3.5 looking at performance figures to date. As for weight, for the third time, I've shown the Lexus 3.5 has faster figures than the 3.7 in a heavier car. So I'm not going to totally take the "weight" excuse.
I'll back off, b/c I'm now thinking they chose the 3.7 as this is the next evolution of the VQ and will surely be used in more applications. I am 100% in support of a VQ (3.5 or 3.7) engine being on that list, that engine has been sensational for over a decade.
I'll back off, b/c I'm now thinking they chose the 3.7 as this is the next evolution of the VQ and will surely be used in more applications. I am 100% in support of a VQ (3.5 or 3.7) engine being on that list, that engine has been sensational for over a decade.
BTW, weight makes a huge difference in performance. The fastest VQ 3.5HR gets 13.2 at 105.7mph in the 1/4th stock. Of course the 350Z ran the time. Its simply faster than either IS350/G35/G37 etc... due to being a couple hundred pounds lighter than the IS (couple thousand lighter than the G37)
Now I firmly believe that if Toyota increased the GR 3.5 to 3.7, it would be a faster engine due to a better powerband.
12-14-07, 01:00 PM
#49
Lead Lap
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 479
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The IS350 has the same engine. It does 0-60 on average about anywhere from 5.1-5.3 secs. The GS weighs more due to being bigger and the AWD system. Do the math. Its not that hard to comprehend the fact that when the same engine is used in a heavier car, it would tend to be slower. So using one review and state it as fact to say its better than another engine from one review is
Last edited by Hypnotik; 12-14-07 at 01:07 PM.
12-14-07, 01:31 PM
#50
Guest
Posts: n/a
Maybe because the 3.7 is still a VQ and the VQ has been on the list since it started. So it is a FACT that the VQ in any form has been regarded as one of the best v6s for the past **** years. And yes i disregard the RT 0-60 time for the GS because it is only one review so deal with it
The IS350 has the same engine. It does 0-60 on average about anywhere from 5.1-5.3 secs. The GS weighs more due to being bigger and the AWD system. Do the math. Its not that hard to comprehend the fact that when the same engine is used in a heavier car, it would tend to be slower. So using one review and state it as fact to say its better than another engine from one review is
The IS350 has the same engine. It does 0-60 on average about anywhere from 5.1-5.3 secs. The GS weighs more due to being bigger and the AWD system. Do the math. Its not that hard to comprehend the fact that when the same engine is used in a heavier car, it would tend to be slower. So using one review and state it as fact to say its better than another engine from one review is
You show your clear BIAS by saying:
-The GS was only tested in one review so I can't believe it.
-Wards one review says the VQ is ten best and I believe them.
So please explain how you can believe ONE review but not the other?
You are then using HYPOTHESIS about "weight" when I am using DATA. You are saying "IT SHOULD BE SLOWER" when the data shows "ITS JUST AS FAST".
So you are refuting the review from R&T but loving the one by Wards.
With the DATA we have, the conclusion is the 3.5 in the LEXUS is a stronger ENGINE as;
1. It has quicker times than the competition in the lighter IS.
2. It has quicker times than the competition (or on par) in the HEAVIER GS.
12-14-07, 04:38 PM
#51
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: ca
Posts: 1,979
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As much as I like the potential of the 335i engine, doesn't it overheat? I think unreliable engines should automatically be disqualified on that list.
I thought for sure the GM Ecotech 2.0 Turbo would be on the list, but it has reliability issues too.
I currently have a 3.5 VQ and I think it makes it on the list just for sound! Best sounding stock engine ever.
I thought for sure the GM Ecotech 2.0 Turbo would be on the list, but it has reliability issues too.
I currently have a 3.5 VQ and I think it makes it on the list just for sound! Best sounding stock engine ever.
12-14-07, 05:10 PM
#52
Guest
Posts: n/a
As much as I like the potential of the 335i engine, doesn't it overheat? I think unreliable engines should automatically be disqualified on that list.
I thought for sure the GM Ecotech 2.0 Turbo would be on the list, but it has reliability issues too.
I currently have a 3.5 VQ and I think it makes it on the list just for sound! Best sounding stock engine ever.
I thought for sure the GM Ecotech 2.0 Turbo would be on the list, but it has reliability issues too.
I currently have a 3.5 VQ and I think it makes it on the list just for sound! Best sounding stock engine ever.
12-14-07, 05:47 PM
#53
Pole Position
Every body need to understand that these awards are not about acceleration or the performance of an automobile. It's all about technological achievement in design, efficiency, and economy of an engine. Can we PLEASE forget about the cars these things are used in and focus on the merits of the engine only?
Congratulations on your 303HP GS win over a 258HP TL. You must be very proud.
12-14-07, 06:03 PM
#54
Guest
Posts: n/a
Every body need to understand that these awards are not about acceleration or the performance of an automobile. It's all about technological achievement in design, efficiency, and economy of an engine. Can we PLEASE forget about the cars these things are used in and focus on the merits of the engine only?
Congratulations on your 303HP GS win over a 258HP TL. You must be very proud.
Congratulations on your 303HP GS win over a 258HP TL. You must be very proud.
Sounds like one has more tech than the other.
12-14-07, 06:32 PM
#56
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: California
Posts: 1,832
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is what I think about the list: I think a good engine should stay good for long time, not only when it is new. VQ engine has proven its extremely good reliability since it came out, so does the BMW's NA 3.0L I6. However, the twin turbo 335i's engine hasn't proven any thing yet since it has just came out for less than a year. It is great when new, but how about after 100,000 miles? Not sure. But I do agree 335i's engine is a very very peppy and yet quiet and smooth engine, because I have driven one. I realize that many V6 engines on the list, and it is very understandable because these engines almost achieve what a V8 engines does but eats much less fuel, and they are as smooth as those V8s. Now that is some kind of achievements. V8 is SUPPOSED to be powerful and smooth and quiet, so no matter how good it is, they can't be impressive due to its inborn demerit of being fuel thirsty.
12-14-07, 07:21 PM
#57
Pole Position
First, 287HP from a 3.5L WITHOUT direct injection! The Non D.I. Lexus 3.5 only manages 268.
Second, the TL has reached it's upper HP limit for its FWD chassis, hardly the engines fault.
I just don't understand why some of these engines are being slammed just because the cars they're installed in don't perform as well as some think they should. It's not about the cars.
I was being sarcastic because of the silly comment by Shawnmack.
"The Honda 3.5 can't compare to the Lexus 3.5."
In what way? HP? That's it? What about NVH? what about emissions? what about fuel efficiency?
My second car is a 2002 Honda Accord with a 3.0 and I will tell you right now that that engine is smoother and quieter that my IS350.
I've always loved Honda's so I'm a little biased.
Everything's cool. 
12-14-07, 10:05 PM
#58
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IL
Posts: 2,854
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
