newr

I laughed so hard that I peed in my pants.

UDel

The NSX and S2000 have not really had reliability issues and they have very high redlines as well as other Honda/Acura engines.

I think BMW is switching to turbo because of all the problems the E46 engine had because of its high reving nature and it was so expensive to replace or fix if you could. They just can't get the high horsepower numbers NA without there generally being reliability problems but then again they are having problems with the current twin turbo inline six overheating and failing, there was even one that overheated and died and had to be towed away recently in a comparison with a G37coupe in a automag. Now I guess the fix is the tranny cooler that you had to pay extra for but who knows what will happen to these engines down the road even with the cooler if it is overheating so bad now that it died in the beginning of a test.

I would be very cautious with this new turbo v8 as it seems BMW cares mostly about performance and numbers and little about the reliability and durability of their engines and cars, it is ashame because I really like alot of BMW cars especially the E46 M3. I would not be surprised if this new v8 has overheating as well as other problems that will leave its owners stranded on the side of the road or dead on the track wondering if they made the right decision or just happy they own a high performance BMW and this is "normal" and anxiously awaiting their new $20,000.00 engine that will need to be put in their car to replace the dead one.

I think weight/fuel economy is playing another role in the switching to turbo engines as with the heavier cars are getting you need more torque which is pretty low in high reving NA engines, also turbo engines generally get better mileage then super high reving high horsepower NA engines.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Well, outside of the M engines, the rest of BMW engines have been pretty average if not mediocre. Recently they introduced the turbo charged 335, which is already notorious for overheating. On the other hand you have 18 year old NSX which pretty much matches M3's output, and 15 year old Supra TT which exceeds 335's output - and both of these cars are very reliable. So, high spung engines that are engineered properly do not have reliability issues, but if you cut corners and "overclock" regular engines like BMW does, you will have problems.

TwiBlueG35

I wouldn't consider a advanced innovation or evolution on an engine until I see it producing 450hp and 400lb-ft of torque with naturally aspirated 2.0L displacement and wasting fuel at 30+ mpg.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Good luck. Will never happen with an internal combustion engine, they are pretty much at their efficiency limit.

Koma

iTrader: (3)

Well with direct injection they boosted economy and power.
Toyota has yet to use their new Valvematic technology. I'm sure there are technological advances to be made still but the efficiency is never gonna get close to the figures TwiBlueG35 stated.

proximal

The NSX does not pretty much match the M3's output, and a 1993 Supra would cost $60k+ in today's dollars.

Overheating of the BMW Turbo I6 has been addressed by fitting oil coolers to cars that were not originally fitted with them from the factory.

The reason BMW went to turbocharging for their I6 is that an NA I6 that would make competitive (300+ hp) power would be too large or too expensive. For the V8, it's probably matters of cost and efficiency.

I've had experience with a few BMWs (including my M3, which has 157k miles) and the engines have all been wonderful. On the whole, they aren't what I would call unreliable, either.

SLegacy99

Exactly. And don't forget, transmissions are getting better and better thus improving fuel economy.

Koma

iTrader: (3)

I meant to say that they'll never get to that point. Fuel efficiency is getting close to a plateau. There's room to improve but with internal combustion engines I don't think it'll get too much better.

LexFather

I have to agree that again, everyone gives a big to all these wonderful (but really unnecessary) more and more powerful engines, instead of true advancements with fuel economy.

Would would have been amazing is stay around the same power levels or a modest bump/decrease and a nice 25% increase in fuel economy.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

BMW doesn't care much about the aftermarket group. The majority of BMW owners wont even get close to getting an air intake anyways, let alone a turbo upgrade.

LexFather

Exactly. MOst are automatics, most are leased. "Image" is everything....

krazykanuk

Awesome. Going off the success of the response and performance of the 335i engine.

doug_999

The engine is going in the new X6 (which everyone here seems to hate) and will undoubtedly find its way into the 755 and the 555. The question is, will it occur in the current e60 5-series or not until the next gen 5-series.

Turbos are the only way to go to get the power without the emissions issues - plus they tend to weigh less than a much larger displacement engine.

I love the crap here about how unreliable BMW products are - Och and UDel you have outdone yourselves (real world reliability does not apply here on CL apparently)


Yes, just like the Lexus products right Mike? Don't tell me people don't buy Lexus products for the "image"........

KKelly

Simply not true. The E46 had the bearing issue but even that applied to only a small percentage of the cars (not that any percentage is a good thing). However, it does not justify the statement. Which M5 is not remotely reliable? They have been making those since 1987. The //M 3.5-3.8 liter inline 6 BMW engines were very robust and durable with outputs as high as 340hp in the 1992 3.8 liter. Add 15 years of technology to that mix and one would expect the Japanese to be capable of making a relatively durable engine.

This is all speculation. Nobody knows why BMW is choosing their engine configurations and they certainly have not abandoned high-revving NA engines given what is in the new M3. I still believe it is to limit the need for engineering and certifiying multiple engine configurations. They still have to make money you know.

ISicklex wrote:

Well, at least you can actually order a manual. ;-)