bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

And in many cases committing massive intellectual property theft.

whoster

amongst other things...

LexFather

That was not the only reason.
1. Better cars.
2. Cheaper price.
3. Better service
4. Better quality
5. Good looks
6. Good driving dynamics
etc etc etc

The status quo luxury brands reliability was always poor, they had people fooled into thinking if you bought a luxury car, it was going to break down tons and you had to live with that. No one was worse than Jaguar or Volvo with this.

LexFather

Sorry but that is wrong. Back in 1989
Acura-3 models (or 2 maybe) all FWD
Lincoln
Caddy
BMW
Benz
Audi
Jaguar.

I put in that order b/c Acura was the top selling import, Lincoln was the top selling Luxury brand then! BMW, Benz, Jaguar, Audi, Acura did NOT sell over 100k cars a year, lineups were limited.

Today add

Volvo
Infiniti
Lexus

And the fact the above brands all sell over 100k cars a year. Also add the fact they rarely have a BAD product, whereas in 1989, some products were pretty bad.

Lexus quality is down? Last I looked, it still is tops or tied with Buick for quality. Problems per car are still stellar. So you continue to be pissed that Lexus doesn't build a car with 0 problems and you conveniently leave out the fact they have acknowledged issues and have engineering teams fixing them.

Today, the REALITY is the dollar is down so any cars imported here will cost more than ever.

The REALITY is, the luxury car segment has NEVER EVER been more competitive. 10 years ago no one was thinking about Infiniti, Caddy, Audi, etc. Today, BMW/Benz/Lexus are in TROUBLE as they are no longer the NATURAL pick. Examples are the Acura TL, Infiniti G/M, Caddy CTS, etc.

Hyundai, I do with them success but it is NO CAKEWALK in an IMAGE WORLD.

LexFather

Now this is a great point. We just read there are 32k new Sonatas just sitting outside the plant waiting to be sold. Hyundai still sells on value/warrenty, not that it is a BETTER vehicle.

Now they are GREAT at Copying Toyota, which means, they will copy Lexus. Lexus has given them the PEFECT BLUEPRINT on what to do. Acura and Infiniti have given them the blueprint on what NOT to do (until very recently for Infiniti).

Lexus didn't have that luxury, outside of Acura, who wasn't (still isn't) a true luxury marque.

What we are going to witness is a new Hyundai Luxury brand that MIGHT take out the other guys.
Acura
Saab
Volvo
Infiniti
Audi
Lincoln

In America. I think those that buy BMW/Benz/Lexus/Jag/Audi pretty much have their minds made up they want that particular car or one of those brands.

TRDFantasy

Nice personal jab there .

If this is true, then I think it's a GREAT idea. I have said this from the very beginning: the Genesis should have never been made a Hyundai. Hyundai should have unveiled the Genesis under a new luxury brand.

If Hyundai plans to take this brand worldwide, they could actually beat Acura and have a global luxury brand before Honda.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

Hmm... maybe the luxury BRAND will be called Genesis and they'll come up with a new name/designation for the model here in the U.S. when it finally hits.

And Hyundai is smart for going after China first.

GS69

Wards Obtains Hyundai Doc Detailing Plan to Split off Luxury Cars in Dealerships

Before the Hyundai Genesis arrived in showrooms, there was talk of the car launching under the aegis of it own brand, much like the debut of the Lexus LS400 back in 1990. That didn't happen, and premium Hyundais like the Genesis and the forthcoming 2010 Equus share floor space with Accents and Tucsons.

Still, the thought of a roped-off premium car department has a pull. "Sectioning off the brand, that's the Holy Grail," said Hyundai Motors USA CEO John Krafcik to Ward's Auto. What Krafcik and his HMUSA masters may have up their collective sleeve is a way to get some of the desired differentiation without the massive costs a new brand launch would entail.

Dave Zuchowski, Hyundai's North American sales vice president, has drawn parallels to Toyota's co-locating efforts with its Scion sub-brand in a letter to dealers, laying out the plans for incorporating the Equus into showrooms. "This strategy will create physical and psychological separation in the Hyundai Showroom," says Zuchowski, while dealers remain less convinced that this means anything more for them than increased costs. On the retail end, stores will be required to purchase several kits for showroom, service, and parts support of the Equus. While not as expensive as a full-blown new store would be, dealers still might have trouble mustering enthusiasm for hundreds of thousands of dollars of corporate-ordered directives that franchisees must comply with.

Dealer unhappiness aside, Zuchowski lays out Hyundai's strategy clearly. "We intend to use the launch of the new Equus to develop and further establish Hyundai as a legitimate force in the premium-luxury segments;" intimating there might be more to it than just the Genesis models and the luxo-liner Equus - a "Genesised-up" Santa Fe might do battle against the Lexus RX, for instance. While it will cost dealers money, Zuchowski notes that ultimately, it's the cheapest way to go while "still providing an enhanced dealership environment...that will devliver a substantial incremental profit oportunity with very reasonable dealer investment." In other words, pay the man now, and cash in later, if all goes well.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

While the Genesis has been a good car it has fallen below sales expectations as has been discussed in the monthly sales threads. Good luck selling dealers on a car that is even more expensive when they have plenty of Genesis collecting dust on the lot.

It seems sort of unclear how they are trying to position the brand but I guess their plan will look clearer in time. It looks like they are slowly inching towards a more apparent division between cars like the Sonata and those like the Genesis or Equus, but a section of the showroom a la Toyota/Scion is not sufficient for selling $40-$60K luxury cars.

Interesting...

trukn1

Would be interesting if they ARE able to pull it off. Even starting off the luxo-division with only 2 models (Genesis and EQuus) may be be foundation of something big for them. I know it sounds kinda silly with starting a whole new line with only 2 models, but it can work. Look at the success that Lexus has enjoyed over its;lifetime. When they launched in 89, the only 2 models they had were the LS400 and ES250.

spwolf

problem is that Genesis, which now includes affordable Genesis Coupe, is not selling well at all. Equus by definition of its class, wont sell in large numbers... so you will have sub-brand that sells 25k cars per year.

joe80

maybe genesis will sell more with a new luxury badge? selling 1500 genesis is doable IMO especially with a better dealership experience with no hyundai badge. they are selling 1000 genesis with a hyundai badge.

but the bread and butter will be RX fighter. santa fe is already a fantastic ride, so just give it a genesis treatment and add 10k to it's price tag. now you have RX alternative for 4k cheaper.

hyundai should do it.

LexBob2

That's not much volume. At least with this plan the dealers wouldn't have too much initially invested in the experiment.

LexFather

I believe so. If they do a luxury brand and the cars continue to improve (2nd gen Genesis, etc) Hyundai will dominate the 2/3 tier segment. I don't see people jumping from their BMW, Benz, Lexus to them but everyone else should be really scared.

If they launch with the same focus as Lexus.....scary thought.... (and the won continues to stay favorable).

lex

but people know it's still a Hyundai. yuck!

Just because they have improved, doesn't mean they weren't extremely crappy some time ago. And I personally think there still might be a trace of it left.