C&D: Nissan GT-R Test - 11.5@124
03-24-08, 03:45 PM
#46
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I don't really see where it defies the law of physics.
The car is fast because of its superb AWD drivetrain. It sticks to the road like glue. It virtually has no traction issues corners and straight-away (low speed launches).
If it defied the laws of physics, it would be faster than the 997 Turbo & Z06 in a high speed acceleration test. It is obvious, after seeing the head-to-head comparison of MT, that it is not over-rated in power, and is not as fast in the straight aways at higher speeds.
The GT-R shines at the corners, where it sticks to the concrete with ease. Hence, allowing it to fly around corners where a car like the Z06 would have traction issues.
FYI: here's the chart I was talking about. It's the ONLY relavent chart to date, as it is the only head-to-head comparison of the GT-R with the Z06 and 997 GT3 to date (all 3 cars at the same time, same conditions): http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/d...6911_chart.pdf
.
The car is fast because of its superb AWD drivetrain. It sticks to the road like glue. It virtually has no traction issues corners and straight-away (low speed launches).
If it defied the laws of physics, it would be faster than the 997 Turbo & Z06 in a high speed acceleration test. It is obvious, after seeing the head-to-head comparison of MT, that it is not over-rated in power, and is not as fast in the straight aways at higher speeds.
The GT-R shines at the corners, where it sticks to the concrete with ease. Hence, allowing it to fly around corners where a car like the Z06 would have traction issues.
FYI: here's the chart I was talking about. It's the ONLY relavent chart to date, as it is the only head-to-head comparison of the GT-R with the Z06 and 997 GT3 to date (all 3 cars at the same time, same conditions): http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/d...6911_chart.pdf
.
I am not one to go by ONE review and any person with logic will not go by ONE review. You take ALL the reviews, mix them in a pot and come to a much better and balanced conclusion.R&T/MT love it but those mags are on the lower end of the scale. EVO/CAR/Top Gear cannot believe it. These are pro-German/Italian mags. Period. THey are astonished with it. Baby Bugatti has come up in reviews.
Lets be frank here. A 3800lbs NISSAN is not supposed to do this. I say Nissan b/c that is what it is to 99.9% of the world. Us gearheads know what the GT-R is about and capable of.
The average guy reading these reviews is
like "how the hell is a Nissan doing this". 3800lbs, tons of tech, big 20"wheels, tt V-6, front engine and it goes and sticks like a beast.
For 70 grand.
IMO, it defies the law of physics, including the COST
one. I am taking nothing away from the Z06, everyone knows I am a die hard Porsche guy. Anyone talking down ANY of those cars needs a head examination. THey are ALL superb and just incredible in each and every way. IMO, personal preference is why people buy those cars. There are FEW people who read any of these mags and chose one over the other over a .2 second here and a .4 second there.What Nissan has accomplished here IMO is just breathtaking.
03-24-08, 05:09 PM
#49
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If you are referring to their 0-60 and 1/4 mile times then you should be aware that they are one of the few mags that actually corrects their times based on atmospheric conditions as well as altitude.
03-24-08, 06:17 PM
#50
Sure it's possible to pick at the GT-R and say its interior is not a Lexus' or it
is not as involving to drive as a 997 GT3, but, I have NEVER seen car mags
rave about a sub 100K car like this.
is not as involving to drive as a 997 GT3, but, I have NEVER seen car mags
rave about a sub 100K car like this.
03-24-08, 06:51 PM
#51
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I suspect this particular GTR is a little bit hotter than the production line piece they're selling to their customers. It certainly wouldn't be without precedent.
03-24-08, 07:29 PM
#52
Lexus Fanatic
I guess everyone has forgot the red hardtop MkIV Supra C&D tested in Spring of '93. It went 13.1 at 109 mph. No owner ever got a stock MkIV to those numbers. It also did the skidpad at 0.98g. There were rumors for years about that car having a "special" ECM. No magazine test after that car ever came close to repeating that performance either.
I suspect this particular GTR is a little bit hotter than the production line piece they're selling to their customers. It certainly wouldn't be without precedent.
I suspect this particular GTR is a little bit hotter than the production line piece they're selling to their customers. It certainly wouldn't be without precedent.
http://www.geocities.com/ma71supratu...93rtsupra.html
C&D got only 0.95g in the skidpad.
http://www.geocities.com/ma71supratu...93cdsupra.html
03-24-08, 07:48 PM
#53
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Here's what Toyota claimed came from C&D. More than one magazine managed a 0.98. No one ever did a 13.1 after C&D.
It will be really interesting to see what real world owners get out of the GT-R. I'm sure there will be a few of them at the track the first week they're released.
It will be really interesting to see what real world owners get out of the GT-R. I'm sure there will be a few of them at the track the first week they're released.
03-24-08, 08:14 PM
#54
Lexus Champion
Maybe on performance alone, but who wants to drive around in a in Nissan compared to a 911 turbo/GT3 or a M5/M6? I would pay the difference just on styling alone even if these cars performance were well below the GTR. Like I said earlier, I test drove it the other day and the overall feeling was poor, the interior was second rate, the seats were not that confortable and it just felt like a cheap car.(however the price tag says otherwise)
03-24-08, 08:38 PM
#55
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Maybe on performance alone, but who wants to drive around in a in Nissan compared to a 911 turbo/GT3 or a M5/M6? I would pay the difference just on styling alone even if these cars performance were well below the GTR. Like I said earlier, I test drove it the other day and the overall feeling was poor, the interior was second rate, the seats were not that confortable and it just felt like a cheap car.(however the price tag says otherwise)
Well. That's up to the individual. Of course you wouldn't want to own the GT-R but obviously many others do as over half the first year run for the US is already sold out.
I haven't heard any of the automotive press describe the car as feeling cheap. To the contrary, it has been called "vault-like", "solid" and even the C&D article which heads this thread says the dash stitching would be worthy of a Ferrari.
But I won't dispute your impressions. You actually spent some face time with the car and I haven't.
I do find it interesting the amount of dismissal and even denial, among Eurocar fans in particular, regarding the GT-R. I mean, what the car is doing is undeniable. It does suddenly ***** the deification of the super-expensive establishment.
Last edited by speedflex; 03-24-08 at 08:44 PM.
03-24-08, 08:59 PM
#57
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I've stated this earlier, and I still say that the price-performance value of the GT-R is undeniable, even compared to the Z06.
03-24-08, 09:10 PM
#58
Lexus Champion
Well. That's up to the individual. Of course you wouldn't want to own the GT-R but obviously many others do as over half the first year run for the US is already sold out.
I haven't heard any of the automotive press describe the car as feeling cheap. To the contrary, it has been called "vault-like", "solid" and even the C&D article which heads this thread says the dash stitching would be worthy of a Ferrari.
But I won't dispute your impressions. You actually spent some face time with the car and I haven't.
I do find it interesting the amount of dismissal and even denial, among Eurocar fans in particular, regarding the GT-R. I mean, what the car is doing is undeniable. It does suddenly ***** the deification of the super-expensive establishment.
I haven't heard any of the automotive press describe the car as feeling cheap. To the contrary, it has been called "vault-like", "solid" and even the C&D article which heads this thread says the dash stitching would be worthy of a Ferrari.
But I won't dispute your impressions. You actually spent some face time with the car and I haven't.
I do find it interesting the amount of dismissal and even denial, among Eurocar fans in particular, regarding the GT-R. I mean, what the car is doing is undeniable. It does suddenly ***** the deification of the super-expensive establishment.
I have a friend here who bought the GT-R and sold it 1 month later, he owns all sorts of performance cars, but he was of the same oppinion as me. I would rather wait for the LF-A, b/c if it keeps with the standard that lexus have now then it will **** all over the GT-R on all fronts.
03-24-08, 09:13 PM
#59
Lexus Test Driver
I can't believe there are still so many haters everywhere for the GTR it's not like the GTR banged your mommas or anything. Maybe the spec V one might though.. Nissan gave us supercar performance with super advanced technology in a practical package that you can drive in all kinds of weather all for 70k. The fact that it's marked up a lot isn't really Nissan's fault it's just that so many people are waiting to get one that's driving up the costs. Imagine what could have been done if Nissan made a car that has base price 100k. People who complain that it's not as stylish as a porsche or (insert any other luxury sports car that has inferior performance) just gotta realize maybe it wasn't meant to be pretty and maybe it wasn't meant to be cushy either.. maybe the GTR is just a fire breathing ugly *** school bully that's just meant to do one thing.. kick *** and take names. That's what it is and that's what it does. Like it or be crushed by it.
Last edited by ba-b4; 03-24-08 at 09:16 PM.
03-24-08, 09:31 PM
#60
Since when is the LF-A going to be mid engine? Just curious, I hadn't heard any reports on that. As far as I knew it was a front engine RWD. Either way, the LF-A is definitely going to be in a different class. Not sure if it will ultimately be much faster, but it surely will be nearly double the price though. I find it hard to believe Lexus will let the LF-A go for under $130K.
I'm not saying the Z06 is a better value; its obviously not (well it is until the markup dies off). Though its pretty easy to mod a Z06 to be really fast too. I have seen better 1/4 mile times on the Z06 stock; but with really good drivers.
124mph traps line up with a 11.5 on an AWD car, so I'm not debating that. This car makes A LOT more power than stock. And the Supra example is a good one; was obviously a doctored car, though plenty of stock cars have gone 107-108mph before, most of the 6speeds dynoed 300whp stock.
Last edited by Bean; 03-24-08 at 09:39 PM.