Sens4Miles

Sure, do you know what "overpricing" is?

I don't care if this car is bigger than a house and can seat 40, it is STILL overpriced compared to the competition. In this age, where cars are getting smaller and smaller and engines are becoming more and more fuel efficient, there is less and less demand for a full sized gas guzzler with a V8. No one who needs extra space is going to choose this car over a more affordable fuel efficient proven well-established Avalon and no one who needs the power of a V8 (mostly luxury minded buyers) are going to choose this over a GS or M45. If you're spending this kinda money on a luxury priced vehicle, you are NOT choosing a Hyundai. I don't care how great it is.

Hyundai has not proven themselves yet to expect people to dish out $40,000 for anything under their brand. This is not the way you start a following. You start it by severely undercutting the competition and offering essentially the same kind of vehicle (or better) for thousands less. That is why Lexus succeeded with the LS400.

This car is not a "value".

carguy101

FYI, Hyundai planned to bring the Genesis 3.3 for $30k. However, it was scrapped at the last minute and the base version will be the 3.8. If you don't believe me, go to fueleconomy.gov. They even had the government test the 3.3 for epa mpg.

carguy101

In terms of size, engine choices, power, and features, the Genesis "competes" with the GS, M, 5, E, STS and A6. Compared to those cars, there is no denying that the Genesis is a value.

In terms of badge and dealership experience, the Genesis competes with the Avalon, Maxima, 300C, etc. Compared to those cars, it's not really a value.

So "value" is a relative term and depends on what your criteria are.

carguy101

No way that a similarly optioned ES350 and Genesis will be the same price. An ES with Nav has an MSRP of $42,000 and probably a street price of $39,000. A similarly equipped Genesis with Nav will probably have an MSRP of $38,000 and a street price of $32,000.

Agree.

tofu_house

iTrader: (2)

Uhm... do YOU know what "overpricing" is? Cus that first line doesn't make much sense to me.

How are our cars becoming smaller and smaller in this age? I thought being luxury meant having a spacious interior with refinement and cool gadgets. The Genesis was not designed to compete with the SmartCar.

I would choose this car over the Avalon in a heartbeat.

Value for value, if I was tight on the money but I still wanted power, I'd go with the Genesis over the underpowered GS and M45. The Genesis is significantly cheaper than a GS and M45 and it's got more power. I'll let the 20k I save go to the pumps. You can go spend 20k for a badge.

Bottom line bud, you're still stuck in the mindset of Hyundais from back in the 80's and 90's when they were no better than rollerblades.

carguy101

Well, Edmunds begs to differ with Popular Mechanics:

High Roller

Inside the cabin, the Genesis V8 is outfitted like a true luxury sedan. Spacious, richly appointed and fully decked out with a comprehensive list of convenience features, this Hyundai looks and feels very much like a top-line Lexus. The seats are as comfortable as they appear, although they lack the kind of firm, highly bolstered Germanic treatment a sport sedan enthusiast might enjoy. The instrument panel's white-on-black electroluminescent gauges look like they came straight out of a Lexus.

The soft curves of the sweeping dashboard architecture are complemented by an elegantly adorned center stack with numerous HVAC/audio buttons, many of which are thankfully made redundant with more ergonomically friendly controls on the steering wheel or by the multimedia controller on the center console just aft of the shift lever.

Sens4Miles

The interior in the GS & IS aren't particularly spacious, but they are certainly refined and are filled with cool gadgets. Our cars are becoming smaller and smaller, crossovers are becoming more and more prevalent, and if someone needs more interior space than an Avalon has to offer, I doubt they will search for an even bigger sedan, but rather opt for a crossover/SUV. I just don't think there's a high demand for such a gas-guzzling full size sedan under a non-luxury badge in 2008.

If you're "tight on money", the last thing you should be doing is buying a $40,000 gas-guzzling non-luxury sedan


No, I'm not. I see the improvements they have made, but they can't justify the price they're asking for with the Genesis right now. It's too soon.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Everything is relative. For argument's sake, the Camry XLE or SE are also a "value" compared to the GS, 5, and M. 0-60 in less than six seconds, Nav, Bluetooth, rear reclining seats, rear entertainment, dual zone climate control, 6AT with sequential shift...and it can be had for $30K. Same logic as the Genesis.

Hell, for what it's worth the Camry is a value compared to the Genesis. The car can do 0-60 in 5.7 seconds in 6 cylinder form and judging by the reviews, drives better with a more lively chassis.

Relative to the GS, 5, and E with all things considered, the Genesis IS a value on paper and you lose a lot of features, experience, prestige, and benefits when you buy the Hyundai.

Relative to the Taurus, Avalon, G8, Lucerne, and even Maxima the Genesis does have the benefit of RWD on it's side, but what does that matter when it's tuned for comfort and not as much sport? It's competitive, not so much a value. You can get an Avalon with Nav and JBL for $36K...probably the same or less than the Genesis.

So really...how much of a value is the car? I guess that remains to be determined by customers.

Again...the Genesis looks to be a good car on paper. Looking past that though and considering Hyundai's history selling vehicles over $25,000, the competition they are gunning for, and price, it's just not Hyundai's LS 400 like many were talking it up to be.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

The biggest problem that I see for the Genesis V8 is this:




Hyundai has fallen admittedly short on their claim of "sport sedan" and presumably, those buyers looking for the V8 model will be expecting a little more gusto and aggression than the V6 model. Pontiac's new bad boy delivers it in spades.

The G8 GT is less expensive, faster, sportier, better looking, and offers a slick cockpit with similar features.

For me, the decision would be simple.

IS350jet

Man! You are really suffering from a severe case of Hyundai Excel-itis. Wake up! Hyundai is NOT the same car company it was in 1986. The Genesis is overpriced? LOL!!!
I'll ask this question again, which you can't seem to answer.
ready?
Here goes.

What full size sedan offers more than what the Genesis does for less $$?
Also, describe for me what you think *value* means because, honestly, I don't think you have a clue.

LexFather

Good post, I agree for the most part.

I still see it as a "Value" b/c you are getting a BIG sedan, RWD and an optional V-8.

Here is who offers V-8s from the 30-40k range
Pontiac G8
Buicks Lucerne and the other one
300C/Charger
(Did I miss any?)

I believe that is all. So this is the only IMPORT that gives people the option of V-8 under 40 grand. Unlike the BUicks it is properly RWD. Then teh GEnesis interior trumps all those cars.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

It's not that one needs to offer more car for less $$, but rather that there are many other options with similar features and technology (and even horsepower) for the same or LESS money. As has been said several times over...Avalon, G8, Lucerne, Taurus, CTS, and ES 350 all offer similar features for similar or LESS money. With so many similar options, it's just hard to see the Genesis as a necessary "value".

If the V6 was $27K and the V8 $33K like everyone was saying it would be, then yeah the car would be a lot of automobile for your money but that's not the cards that were dealt...and even then you're still squarely in Avalon/G8/Lucerne territory with features.

IS350jet

I think the G8 is to a Genesis, what a Avalon is to a CTS-V. The G8 is a rip snorting, ground pounding, American muscle car, while the Genesis is a svelte, posh, top of the line luxury car. The two cannot be compared.

Sens4Miles

Excellent post, thanks

I agree 27k & 33k would have made this car extremely tempting and hard for anyone looking in that price range to pass up. But 33k and up is a different class all together and the Genesis, as a new car, with zero history, zero reputation, from a car company with a shaky past is just too much to ask.

The V8 will probably make for a great pre-owned car in a couple years though as the resale value is bound to be terrible as they are with all Hyundais. Oh yeah, and that's another reason not to spend $40k on a Hyundai over a Lexus, BMW, Benz, Infiniti, etc.

Sens4Miles

A friend of mine recently wrecked his car and rented a cheap 2001 Hyundai Elantra. The car had 75,000 miles on it and was practically falling apart. Transmission was shot so bad that it couldn't even reverse. Literally, the car would not reverse. My GS has 75,000 miles on it and runs as new as it did on day 1. Nobody is going to want to risk and invest in a Hyundai that costs $35,000 or more and have it start falling apart at 75,000 miles. Granted, this is just one example, my experience with a Hyundai from this decade (not the 1980s) and they were still pretty crappy. Has 7 years made a difference in the long term quality and reliability of Hyundais in general? perhaps. But give me one solid example of a Hyundai over 100,000 miles that looks and runs as good as a Lexus, Infiniti, Toyota, etc with the same mileage.

Sure, the new Hyundais look nice, but are they going to last?

More as far as what? more power? better features? what exactly do you mean by "more"? Be more specific and I'll be glad to give you some examples.