kit cat

iTrader: (6)

i would consider an IS250 only if its a manual.

soakgame

i'd get the 250..

and the goat as a commuter =)

mmarshall

If you saw my post, I didn't say the ES350's ride was firm, just firm-ER than the old ES330. Of course that is a subjective opinion...but IMO they should have left the old suspension and tires alone....the new firm-er ride is no longer in line with the car's luxury role.

And as for the Avalon, of course it doesn't handle like a Miata. It's not SUPPOSED to. Those who want sports-car handling should get one, not a family sedan. That's part of what is wrong with today's auto industry......too many family and luxury sedans are being turned into sports sedans as it is.

leedogg

I would also consider the acura RL with SH-AWD

LexBob2

I guess that we'll have to agree to disagree on this. IMO it's what's RIGHT with today's auto industry. Two decent cars (Avalon & ES) were made better in terms of ride, handling, gas mileage and performance. They both appeal today's buyer, for better or worse, as the current generation of each has sold better than the old models ever did. Neither are Miata's just more competent family sedans. All IMHO, of course.

Lexus 1

Well Stated

roushracin

Well guys, today I test drove the ES and it's a nice car but I'm only 30 years old and I felt like it was my parents car. I just couldn't see myself buying it. Then there's the IS. Man that car is great. They even had an IS-F on the showroom floor. That car is amazing! However, my wife did not like the size of the IS. And I tend to agree. It felt really cramped compared to my TSX. So, right now, I think I'm gonna hold off and hope Lexus makes the IS a little bigger in a few years. Thanks for all the input.

LexFather

Thanks for the update. I do have a suggestion, what about a used GS 300 AWD 2006 model, its in the same price range. You get;
-a car in size between the IS and ES
-more power/speed than the IS 250AWD
-better build quality

mmarshall

You're right that the IS is a classic sardine can inside....especially in the rear seat, which is basically for children only. It also has a very firm ride (the softer-riding 16", 55-series tire option is gone).

If you like the ES, why not consider one? Don't let your age (30) or "image" be an issue...that's bunch of nonsense. YOU and your wife are the ones who are going to be driving it and enjoying it.....so what does it matter what others think?

However, before you completely discount the pint-sized IS, consider its AWD version (oops, I just noticed that was the thread topic ), especially if you have to drive on wet or snowy roads, though the standard high-perf 45-series tires, of course, are not designed for slick conditions). Still, with the AWD, even though the dry-weather summer tires don't help much on wet roads, you still have ABS, traction control, and stability control. And, of course, you can replace the tires with all-seasons if you want...that's probably what I would do. In fact, if I don't get another Subaru, I, being single, and without need of a roomy back seat, am considering an IS250 AWD myself for my next purchase. Yes, the IS250 rides too firm for my tastes, but hey, no car is perfect.

mmarshall

I very much respect your view, , but I believe that sport sedans should be sport sedans, and luxury cars should be LUXURY cars. Those who want handling should get the former, and those who want comfort should get the latter. However, it is almost impossible to find TRULY soft-riding luxury cars any more. The Mercedes non-AMG S-class, Cadillac DTS (non-touring model), V6-equipped Buick Lucerne, Lincoln Town Car, and Lexus LS460 are about the only ones left....and even THEY, to some extent, are slightly firmer-riding than their predecessors. Just about everything else on the road, even a lot of cheaper cars, have been firmed up with today's obsession with large-diameter, low-profile tires, stiffer suspensions, and quick steering response.

Like it or not, those who want living-room comfort/ride in their NEW cars, like years ago, are pretty much being ignored. Even auto company reps admit this.

Och

iTrader: (3)

You can still beat the system though... I did by putting 16's on my GS. 225/60/16 = smooth..

mmarshall

Yes and no. That may smooth out the ride a little, but changing stock factory wheel and tire sizes can mess up the electronic programming for the speedometer, odometer, trip computer, engine RPM, etc.... because it can change the rate of wheel rotation relative to engine speed and actual MPH.

Shawnmack

Why didn't you go with the factory 16 inch wheels for the GS?

Och

iTrader: (3)

I liked the styling of the LS wheels better. The 16's from a 2GS look small, really tiny, but these LS wheels look pretty proportional.