ST430

while not necessarily "high end", the Mitsu Evo X would fit your bill for a high fun, AWD machine.

jaydunn

Get the 2009 A4 for about $40k and use the extra $20k for something else. And guys, it's time to give Audi "unreliability" a much needed rest. Even Consumer Reports has the A4 as "Recommended" model. As far as the MMI interface goes anyone who has ever used a computer can learn it in 20 minutes-if not-borrow a 12 year old boy to give you a quick tutorial.

doug_999

Curious why the M35x is not on the list? You can get one of those loaded up nicely in the 50s I believe.

Also the 535i is a Consumer Reports recommended car. The GS is not.

However, the 535xi is flagged as a Least Reliable car for 2008.

Spend some time on here and/or the bimmer boards and you will get the feeling that both of these cars are pretty reliable (in spite of what CR says).

Just when the list was finalized....

PS - I'd keep the Sonata for winters and get a RWD car for the summers Check out the prices on used 550s....

Cali2is

Lexus GS350 AWD... I think the A4 is way too small...

SecPole14

Basically...w0rd.

Just wait for the upcoming A4 Quattro with the 3.0L diesel V6.

You'll get performance, style, and MPG for well under $60K. Take the difference and go on a REALLY NICE vacation...

mmarshall

Maybe so, for some people. I've been using a computer for almost 20 years, though, not 20 minutes.....and I-Drive/MMI still drives me up the wall.

Even professional auto testers and journalists, for the most part, dislike the system....and most of them drive and test cars for a lot more miles than we do.

mmarshall

I was thinking the same thing. I'd buy a M35 before a M45 any day of the week. But we have to assume that he has his reasons for not listing it.

doug_999

And yet, most owners have no issue with it....in fact, some (ok most) even like it!

Strange...

RON430

Pretty much the difference between spending hours (or minutes) with it versus days. Still think it isn't necessary but none of the systems are that difficult to get to use. Doesn't mean they can't be improved. V 2.0's will start appearing with bimmer first.

mmarshall

Not really. It may just be a generational thing. I grew up, like most people of my era (baby boomers) in cars with analog gauges, easy-to-use buttons, *****, levers, stalks, etc..... As a pilot, I also flew aircraft that were mostly like that.

Many younger people today never knew how much simpler and easier driving was back then. They grew up with computers, and naturally, are more in tune with them. They don't have the problems with I-Drive, MMI, etc.... like me and those of my ilk do.

Same with auto journalists. The older ones, like me (Patrick Bedard, John Phillips, Denise McCluggage, Dennis Simanaitis, etc.....) like simpler dashes and controls...as does Consumer Reports. Newer, younger ones (and you must be in the latter group) seem to like the high-tech stuff. But we both can agree that high-tech electronic engine controls have done wonders under the hood.

But even those who are at home with computers can easily fall prey to the hazards of multi-tasking while driving, which, even today, causes many accidents.

We kind of got off-topic a little, but I hope it helps him make a more informed decision about which car he will want....the thread topic

doug_999

As we have discussed (and yep, we are off topic here), everything is getting more technical and yes, this means you need to open the manual - probably more than one is used to.

It is not rare to hear about the BMW turn signals and how they went and re-invented something that did not need to be re-invented. However, a quick look at the manual will tell you
a) how to use them (and they are so sweet once you learn)
or
b) how to turn them off and back into a normal turn signal

Alas, CR and the auto rags will dis them because they never take the time to learn something. Maybe they think they know everything?

LexBob2

"As we have discussed (and yep, we are off topic here), everything is getting more technical and yes, this means you need to open the manual - probably more than one is used to."

Good point. I've referred to the owners manual more with my last two cars than I ever did in the past. Something is always coming up that can be resolved by looking in the manual.

CK6Speed

iTrader: (1)

I've read the owners manual on every single car I've owned from page one to the end since my first brand new car in 1990. My first car was a used 79 Mustang that had no manual. Anyway, I personally enjoy reading the owners manual. Of course I happen to enjoy cars and feel I can figure everything out on my own anyway, but it still is fun to read the cars owners manual IMHO. Heck, my dad just gave my his old 94 Accord a few months ago. I worked at a Honda dealer before so I know Honda's yet I still read the old manual cover to cover. Well, I do skim though the obvious stuff like turning on your blinker, radio and things like that.

darkdream

you can get an Audi S5 for under 60k....

rdgdawg

Just not an Inifiniti fan, but like the idea with Sonata as winter car. However, going to wait on new A4 Quattro, save the extra $20K as mentioned above and take a couple NICE vacations with the Missus... if I wind up with A4.

The new TL pic is out.... car looks like it's got a goofy grin... absolutely sad, they've got some bad 'shrooms over at Acura...