LS vs S class
#137
Have to disagree. Analog clocks are not only easier to read at a glance, but, if done correctly, are also a whole lot classier than digital clocks. Notice the success of analog-clock trademarks in many upmarket vehicles. Infiniti, for example, considers them a necessary part of their interiors.
#138
But regardless, I don't have a problem with a digital clock in a car, I just think the Lexus flagship should have a nicer or better one.
How about having a clock that adjusts for daylight savings? Could make it listen to the atomic clock signals or use cell tower clocks...
How about using a color LCD that can be adjusted - select color, font, brightness?
How about making the display big enough it can EITHER be digital or analog? And maybe display the day and date, too?
Just ideas to go beyond the el cheapo clock.
#140
#141
i'm also a fan of the 560SEL, i used to own a bulletproofed one. My grandfather still has his and it's got about 340,000 miles on it. He calls it his batmobile. These had analog clocks lol.
Oh yeah, I hear you about the tape deck thing. Holy smack. That just bugs me to no end. We're in an era of MP3s, even CDs are kinda getting bleh. The tape deck is way too old.
#142
I do understand what you mean, though. Toyota was wise enough to create Lexus after all.
The logo on the car does not mean too much for those that know & understand about cars, you can't say, for example, that buying an A or B class is even remotely the same in affordability & prestige as buying a E or S-class even though they all carry the Mercedes Benz logo.
If Toyota makes the same A or B class cars & sell them at the same price, they would have been Toyota's, not Lexus. That's why I say in my above post that globally, it's not apples to apples comparison . The composition of the lineups of their models globally are too different to be legitimately compared directly.
If Toyota makes the same A or B class cars & sell them at the same price, they would have been Toyota's, not Lexus. That's why I say in my above post that globally, it's not apples to apples comparison . The composition of the lineups of their models globally are too different to be legitimately compared directly.
Sure, different tastes.
It's just that traditional European luxury sedans have had analog clocks for ages and it has burned itself into my head as appearing more classy and elegant. Digital clocks in luxury cars just lack a certain, what shall we call it, appeal? Classiness? In my opinion, of course.
#143
#144
Obviously a small yacht is out of the question (then you'd probably go for a GL or something along those lines), but a small boat that can comfortable fit four passengers for a small lazy afternoon on a lake is what I have seen being towed by a B class. Most likely we're talking about a torquey diesel engine here or one of those higher specification gasoline engines.
Don't be fooled by their appearance. They might be small on the outside, but they're surprisingly spacious on the inside. My girlfriends parents drive one and I've ridden in it. It feels more spacious than a Lexus IS or MB C class inside. No joke.
Lexus can enter this market without shame. It's bad enough that they have no real brand heritage compared to their rivals - and in certain markets that can be a very serious disadvantage.
I agree and back to my previous point, it seems Lexus DOES NOT want to change thier vision in Europe by offering cars Toyota competes in. So one one end it helps prestige, on the other end, a lot of sales are lost. ITs part of the reason a "cute-ute" hasn't been offered here. So it will hurt wiht sales by not having hatches etc. THey seem to be going to depend on hybrids and not diesels. Will it work? Not sure, hybrids are still niche products outside the Prius/Civic.
Why do people buy Toyotas? The main reason is most likely because they're affordable and well-made and reliable. If people were interested in design, sport or something fun, then Toyota would most likely be near the bottom of a list. So, we know that in Europe, Toyotas are affordable and reliable. Someone who needs a reliable car to get from A to B will be interested in one, regardless of how it looks or drives. As time passes, they might be interested in getting a premium car. And despite having been loyal Toyota clients, they feel that a Lexus is just not what they're looking for.
The Lexus name carries little allure in Europe. People with money prefer to spend it on a brand with a name created through heritage, history, motorsport, innovations in safety and technology and the likes. Mercedes is a first in this regard, followed by BMW. Lexus is basically competing with some well-established rivals in this markets who basically control the market and are not sleeping but watching Lexus closely.
So, these two brands are appealing and desirable. That means there are people willing to pay the asking price. You'll notice that Lexus has begun raising prices in the US (and Europe) too. In the US, I suppose it is acceptable since they have more prestige in that market than anywhere else. People are willing to pay.
The Lexus GS receives no changes for 2008 but the price rises by $300 - people will pay for it.
Europe has the "American bug" b/c SUV sales are growing, at the expense of saloons and estates I agree that Lexus does not appeal to the young like the Germans. I have given tons of credit to them for offering tons of options and coupes. BMW has the 1 AND 3 coupe in the 30-40k range! Lexus has none since the original SC 300
Instead, they brought us the SC430. Man, how I despise that car. No offense but this is easily the worst Lexus currently on sale in my opinion. The only real things it has going for it are a cheaper price and reliability. Comfort, handling and fun-factor wise it is clearly at the bottom in every review. And it looks like a blob next to the gorgeous Jaguar XK8, Mercedes SL and even the Cadillac XLR.
What I want from Lexus is a car that can take on the BMW Z4 and Audi TT and MB SLK. Something small, compact that handles and is fun to drive. There are many advantages to such a car. First, many female buyers will flock to Lexus dealers. Second, many young, middle aged and older buyers will flock to Lexus dealers as these types of cars appeal to people of all ages. I honestly think Lexus is missing out here. Then again, maybe their market research knows better than me.
LOL, thanks.
This is fun.
#145
Yes, the Germans are very diverse in Europe and Asia and even in markets like South Africa and the Middle East. I personally want Lexus to be more diverse with some of their products, especially the IS and GS which to me have a lot of potential in other markets.
I adore the W126. Such a beautiful and perfectly balanced design. When I see one on the street I can't help but move my head with it as it passes by because the design is still so stunningly handsome. I found these shots a long time ago on a W126 website and this makes me love the car even more.
We had a 300SD Turbodiesel in my family, which was sadly stolen. I do hope that whoever stole it is enjoying many happy miles with it. LOL
I never could stand the W140 and the S class after that, but the current S class is awesome as are its rivals.
#146
Have to disagree. Analog clocks are not only easier to read at a glance, but, if done correctly, are also a whole lot classier than digital clocks. Notice the success of analog-clock trademarks in many upmarket vehicles. Infiniti, for example, considers them a necessary part of their interiors.
I agree with others that Lexus wants their interiors to look futuristic and modern, but an analog clock adds a feeling of class and timelessness to the dashboard. Lexus interiors are well-made, but I honestly cannot name a single one of them which is classy in one way or the other. Perhaps the ES and GS come closest to having the most elegant Lexus interiors.
Again, my opinion.
#147
Some of the posts in this thread are just ridiculous. A close friend of mine had a 2007 S550, complete with all of the option packages. The person who mentioned that they are cheap cars that have poor reliability just to get you back to the dealer is a complete moron, sorry. This car is quite possibly one of the best put together cars in the world. Everything, everything is designed to the absolute highest standards. The rear seats exude elegance. They are fully powered, cooled, heated, have power sunshades, and a huge panorama roof. This is a classy car with not just classy features, but brilliantly designed ones. Between the nightvision and the endless amount of luxury options, this car goes beyond what the LS offers - It offers timeless Mercedes Benz class with Mercedes-Benz quality. I have never been a fan of the previous generation S-Class, but this car IS the class-benchmark for everything from the interior design to safety. You can look at all the pictures online you want and call the dashboard "minivan-like", but frankly, until you go drive one and sit in the drives seat, you really don't have a clue. It is a truely brilliant car. I have NOT driven the current generation Lexus LS, but the last generation I drove felt more like a boat than a world class Luxury sedan. The person who mentioned not carying about handling in this price range is so off base I don't even know where to start. In this price and class range, every facet of the car should be world class, and that includes the handling. Paying these prices doesn't mean forgetting about driving dynamics and focusing soley on a poorly implemented self-parking feature (which is found on $25K volkswagens FYI). The current generation LS has been targeted by every automotive publication for its floaty steering and boring nature, so even though it may be a superbly built car, it is not entirely the same package that the Germans offer. And no, the LS600 is not in the same leauge as the V12s.
This is a truely beautifully built car and anyone who even hints otherwise is either very ignorant or just has a big bias. Give respect where it is due. The Lexus LS is a wonderful car, I'll be the first in line to say, but don't undervalue the competition simply becuase you have a bias.
You know what happend to this Mercedes? A woman on her cell phone crossed through and intersection and collided into the car, at 40mph, as my friend was sitting at a stoplight. The four people inside the S550 walked away without injury. All of the airbags went off, the doors unlocked, the seats went upright, the hazards activated, teleaid called the police. They said: "Oh, you're in a German car - no wonder your fine". The woman went to the hospital with some broken ribs, she was in a Ford Expedition. He is now back to driving a 750iL. The car is very nice as well, not as luxurious as the Mercedes, but I still feel that it is a superior driving car. BMWs always are. Point is, these are superbly built and engineered cars, some of the safest in their class - The S-class always has been.
This is a truely beautifully built car and anyone who even hints otherwise is either very ignorant or just has a big bias. Give respect where it is due. The Lexus LS is a wonderful car, I'll be the first in line to say, but don't undervalue the competition simply becuase you have a bias.
You know what happend to this Mercedes? A woman on her cell phone crossed through and intersection and collided into the car, at 40mph, as my friend was sitting at a stoplight. The four people inside the S550 walked away without injury. All of the airbags went off, the doors unlocked, the seats went upright, the hazards activated, teleaid called the police. They said: "Oh, you're in a German car - no wonder your fine". The woman went to the hospital with some broken ribs, she was in a Ford Expedition. He is now back to driving a 750iL. The car is very nice as well, not as luxurious as the Mercedes, but I still feel that it is a superior driving car. BMWs always are. Point is, these are superbly built and engineered cars, some of the safest in their class - The S-class always has been.
#148
And the hybrid RX400h definitely has more get up and go on the highway than the non-hybrid. Plus your brake pads never wear out.
#149
That W126 interior pic you showed has seats worse than today's Yaris for one thing. Now don't get me wrong, the old Benz's are built like tanks but to me it feels about as luxurious as an industrial robot. And the steering wheels on those old ones were GIGANTIC and the steering was like the Titanic's.
Not sure of the point of comparing 1989 and 2008 models.
It's easy to over-simplify, but the new C uses 'hard' plastics (as does Lexus today on a lot of models, apparently partly due to cutting environmentally unfriendly emissions) and the LS400 interior (and my old GS400) felt very soft all over.
People criticize the current W204 C class interior for being "cheap", but the LS400 interior had the same layout, basically.
A large slab of black plastic in the center console and across the cockpit.
#150
I agree and said so earlier in the thread... very confused message.