OCTOBER 2008 Vehicles Sales
11-04-08, 12:56 PM
#76
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1.) Well it's a good thing this is just your opinion. However, most people here would agree that if those two cars did fail, it would have more to do with the economy rather than looks. Consumers have rated looks as one of the last factors in car buying decisions. If looks was such a decision maker, people wouldn't be driving BMW's. The TSX is also the best selling car in it's class according to your list. Sure this is the worst month of sales for the TSX ever, but wasn't it for almost everyone? Acura is not immune to the slump in the economy. You are pretty much saying that they are and the reason for the sales drop is because you think they are ugly. 
3.) Because the World>America. If your going to consider the RDX a new model from Acura, then you need to consider most of the Lexus lineup as new as well. The RDX is in its third model year. The TSX and TL can only be considered all-new.
Thanks for pointing out the add to me. I probably just don't have as much free time as you to watch tv or else I probably would have seen the add. However, the main reason why I didn't see the add? Because 0% financing was just release TODAY by Infiniti for the first time ever. Call them up: 800-627-4437. Whatever you were seeing before was either a local add or maybe your eyes are bad and you were seeing 0.9% financing as 0.0%.
3.) Because the World>America. If your going to consider the RDX a new model from Acura, then you need to consider most of the Lexus lineup as new as well. The RDX is in its third model year. The TSX and TL can only be considered all-new.
Thanks for pointing out the add to me. I probably just don't have as much free time as you to watch tv or else I probably would have seen the add. However, the main reason why I didn't see the add? Because 0% financing was just release TODAY by Infiniti for the first time ever. Call them up: 800-627-4437. Whatever you were seeing before was either a local add or maybe your eyes are bad and you were seeing 0.9% financing as 0.0%.
The TSX can be the best selling in class, its still not going to meet sales targets, which Acura moved up to 40k for this model. At its current rate, it might hit 30k, UNDER the 36k of the last model.
Again I don't watch TV much, but when I linked to a thread I started in August showing their 0% rate. I believe it was on CNN during daytime hours (when I was at lunch). You do not have to believe me.
My word here is a fact as I would not make it up and dozens of people here can vouch I would not do such a thing. Why would I make up 0% or low financing rates?
I even looked on Youtube hoping someone would upload it
11-04-08, 01:35 PM
#77
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Guys/Gals this is not a thread to defend your vehicle or brand to the tee and to make personal attacks, thus breaking the rules.
We are fortunate enough to have a monthly consolidated sales thread. We have done this for years now and its spread to other internet forums.
This is to discuss trends and observations in regards to sales, techniques, successes, failures, etc.
We are fortunate enough to have a monthly consolidated sales thread. We have done this for years now and its spread to other internet forums.
This is to discuss trends and observations in regards to sales, techniques, successes, failures, etc.
11-04-08, 01:52 PM
#78
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You totally miss the fact Acura sales were down last year, when many people were up (and I think the year before). BMW has the badge cred to sell UGLY vehicles (some call it different, I call it ugly). Acura does not have that luxury, they are a value proposition.
The TSX can be the best selling in class, its still not going to meet sales targets, which Acura moved up to 40k for this model. At its current rate, it might hit 30k, UNDER the 36k of the last model.
Again I don't watch TV much, but when I linked to a thread I started in August showing their 0% rate. I believe it was on CNN during daytime hours (when I was at lunch). You do not have to believe me.
My word here is a fact as I would not make it up and dozens of people here can vouch I would not do such a thing. Why would I make up 0% or low financing rates?
I don't even watch T.V that much and Acura had a 1.9% finance rate nationwide, on nationwide t.v. Not just some area dealer.
The TSX can be the best selling in class, its still not going to meet sales targets, which Acura moved up to 40k for this model. At its current rate, it might hit 30k, UNDER the 36k of the last model.
Again I don't watch TV much, but when I linked to a thread I started in August showing their 0% rate. I believe it was on CNN during daytime hours (when I was at lunch). You do not have to believe me.
My word here is a fact as I would not make it up and dozens of people here can vouch I would not do such a thing. Why would I make up 0% or low financing rates?
I don't even watch T.V that much and Acura had a 1.9% finance rate nationwide, on nationwide t.v. Not just some area dealer.
The TSX probably won't meet sales targets. Neither will most of the other cars on the market today, including those from Lexus. The car market is MUCH different now then it was 8 months ago when TSX sales goals were announced.
I'm not saying you are fibbing about anything. However, I have had to correct you on more than one occasion in the past. The most recent example is when Infiniti was NOT offering 0% financing and you were claiming they were so I wouldn't go as far to say that your word is fact. Probably just an honest mistake on your part, but still a mistake that I had to correct, nevertheless.
Acura had a nationwide deal of 1.9% recently. However, the key word here is HAD. You won't find any nationwide deals on their website except for a lease deal on the TSX which may not even be nationwide at all.
11-04-08, 02:10 PM
#79
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Nobody is talking about past sales. The main topic I am discussing is your opinion that the TSX, TL and X6 will fail because of they are, in your opinion, ugly and not mainly because of the economy. Again, you are saying that these cars are immune to the economy and it's sales are based on looks only (which I have already pointed out is last on consumers minds when it comes to a car-buying decision).
The TSX probably won't meet sales targets. Neither will most of the other cars on the market today, including those from Lexus. The car market is MUCH different now then it was 8 months ago when TSX sales goals were announced.
I'm not saying you are fibbing about anything. However, I have had to correct you on more than one occasion in the past. The most recent example is when Infiniti was NOT offering 0% financing and you were claiming they were so I wouldn't go as far to say that your word is fact. Probably just an honest mistake on your part, but still a mistake that I had to correct, nevertheless.
Acura had a nationwide deal of 1.9% recently. However, the key word here is HAD. You won't find any nationwide deals on their website except for a lease deal on the TSX which may not even be nationwide at all.
The TSX probably won't meet sales targets. Neither will most of the other cars on the market today, including those from Lexus. The car market is MUCH different now then it was 8 months ago when TSX sales goals were announced.
I'm not saying you are fibbing about anything. However, I have had to correct you on more than one occasion in the past. The most recent example is when Infiniti was NOT offering 0% financing and you were claiming they were so I wouldn't go as far to say that your word is fact. Probably just an honest mistake on your part, but still a mistake that I had to correct, nevertheless.
Acura had a nationwide deal of 1.9% recently. However, the key word here is HAD. You won't find any nationwide deals on their website except for a lease deal on the TSX which may not even be nationwide at all.
As for the TSX/TL/X6, before the economy totally tanked in September, TSX sales were simply not doing so hot (when I have time I will post its sales thus far this year). The looks have a lot to do with it, its a train wreck. The last TSX was bland but it wasn't ugly and had very tidy and nice proportions.
The 09 TL is even worse and I stand behind what I said when I first saw it. Its so ugly it will be a sales failure. This was before the economy tanked. I did not think it would reach 70k sales goals.
As for the X6, its funny but I also predicted it would flop but I also posted a thread saying I "understand" why these vehicles were brought to market (will link that thread later). I am assuming BMW stated 20k a year it meant here, not worldwide. 20k worldwide makes NO SENSE since BMW sells over 1,000,000 cars a year. 20k for one vehicle is 2% of total sales volume for BMW. I think the X6 really stretched what people will buy for a Bangled BMW. It is clear that BMW has the badge image and panache to pretty much design whatever they want and people will buy it (lease deal or not).
Acura does not have that luxury. Just think the RDX sold only 670+ units last month and BMW sold nearly 400 X6s. The X6 costs twice as much easily.
Hey if I am wrong and the these cars actually do meet sales targets I am sure my "brood" will be very happy I predicted wrong
11-04-08, 04:50 PM
#80
Speaks French in Russian
Its really not that deep. Its only vehicle sales. No need to get so personal. 
About the X6, this is where people are getting the 20K a year stuff from.
http://www.cars.com/go/crp/research....&revlogtype=22
http://www.egmcartech.com/2008/04/03...oming-in-2009/
About the X6, this is where people are getting the 20K a year stuff from.
BMW officials will not discuss their sales projection, but Automotive News reported it at about 20,000 the first year.
http://www.cars.com/go/crp/research....&revlogtype=22
BMW board member for corporate and brand development said that the company is expecting half of the annual production volume to come from the U.S.
Seeing has BMW plans to build 40,000 units of the X6 annually, U.S. is expected to eat up 20,000 of the production run. German and UK together will account for about 10 percent.
Seeing has BMW plans to build 40,000 units of the X6 annually, U.S. is expected to eat up 20,000 of the production run. German and UK together will account for about 10 percent.
11-04-08, 05:47 PM
#81
Lexus Champion
As mentioned earlier, BMW is on track to sell 4,400-4,500 X6's thru December at the current sales rate. If they continue to sell around 400 per month thru March '09 they'd have 5,500-5,700 sales for the 1st year.
It's a tough time for all new cars...
It's a tough time for all new cars...
11-04-08, 07:18 PM
#82
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Okay gotcha. I won't continue to hash the financing rates, I know what I saw on tv and on their website ( I believe the Infiniti forums were well aware of it as well).
As for the TSX/TL/X6, before the economy totally tanked in September, TSX sales were simply not doing so hot (when I have time I will post its sales thus far this year). The looks have a lot to do with it, its a train wreck. The last TSX was bland but it wasn't ugly and had very tidy and nice proportions.
The 09 TL is even worse and I stand behind what I said when I first saw it. Its so ugly it will be a sales failure. This was before the economy tanked. I did not think it would reach 70k sales goals.
Acura does not have that luxury. Just think the RDX sold only 670+ units last month and BMW sold nearly 400 X6s. The X6 costs twice as much easily.
Hey if I am wrong and the these cars actually do meet sales targets I am sure my "brood" will be very happy I predicted wrong
As for the TSX/TL/X6, before the economy totally tanked in September, TSX sales were simply not doing so hot (when I have time I will post its sales thus far this year). The looks have a lot to do with it, its a train wreck. The last TSX was bland but it wasn't ugly and had very tidy and nice proportions.
The 09 TL is even worse and I stand behind what I said when I first saw it. Its so ugly it will be a sales failure. This was before the economy tanked. I did not think it would reach 70k sales goals.
Acura does not have that luxury. Just think the RDX sold only 670+ units last month and BMW sold nearly 400 X6s. The X6 costs twice as much easily.
Hey if I am wrong and the these cars actually do meet sales targets I am sure my "brood" will be very happy I predicted wrong
As for the sales... The car industry started tanking for everyone pretty much at the start of the year. Honda was the only major manufacturer that held it off up until a couple months ago. You're basically still saying that Acura + the X6 is immune to the economy and will fail mainly because you think it is ugly. I just don't realistically see that being the case.
As for RDX sales... yeah, they are not meeting sales goals. It is in it's third model year with mediocre gas mileage in a bad economy. You can spin the RDX and X6 costing twice as much any way you want because anyone can do the same for Lexus: "The SC430 couldn't even break 100 sales and it is the only luxury convertible from Japan. It is cheaper than its nearest German competition by tens of thousands of dollars yet was outsold nearly 3:1. The consumers clearly have chosen the panache and luxury of the German brands over the significantly cheaper Lexus. It is an utter failure." - Is it a failure?
So getting to the point, a failure of these cars will have little if anything to do with looks. I'll say it again, looks are the last thing considered among most consumers who are in the market for a car. Acura or BMW is not immune to this nor is any other manufacturer.
11-04-08, 08:42 PM
#83
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Okay, then were both done with the financing discussion.
As for the sales... The car industry started tanking for everyone pretty much at the start of the year. Honda was the only major manufacturer that held it off up until a couple months ago. You're basically still saying that Acura + the X6 is immune to the economy and will fail mainly because you think it is ugly. I just don't realistically see that being the case.
As for RDX sales... yeah, they are not meeting sales goals. It is in it's third model year with mediocre gas mileage in a bad economy. You can spin the RDX and X6 costing twice as much any way you want because anyone can do the same for Lexus: "The SC430 couldn't even break 100 sales and it is the only luxury convertible from Japan. It is cheaper than its nearest German competition by tens of thousands of dollars yet was outsold nearly 3:1. The consumers clearly have chosen the panache and luxury of the German brands over the significantly cheaper Lexus. It is an utter failure." - Is it a failure?
So getting to the point, a failure of these cars will have little if anything to do with looks. I'll say it again, looks are the last thing considered among most consumers who are in the market for a car. Acura or BMW is not immune to this nor is any other manufacturer.
As for the sales... The car industry started tanking for everyone pretty much at the start of the year. Honda was the only major manufacturer that held it off up until a couple months ago. You're basically still saying that Acura + the X6 is immune to the economy and will fail mainly because you think it is ugly. I just don't realistically see that being the case.
As for RDX sales... yeah, they are not meeting sales goals. It is in it's third model year with mediocre gas mileage in a bad economy. You can spin the RDX and X6 costing twice as much any way you want because anyone can do the same for Lexus: "The SC430 couldn't even break 100 sales and it is the only luxury convertible from Japan. It is cheaper than its nearest German competition by tens of thousands of dollars yet was outsold nearly 3:1. The consumers clearly have chosen the panache and luxury of the German brands over the significantly cheaper Lexus. It is an utter failure." - Is it a failure?
So getting to the point, a failure of these cars will have little if anything to do with looks. I'll say it again, looks are the last thing considered among most consumers who are in the market for a car. Acura or BMW is not immune to this nor is any other manufacturer.
WHy pick on the SC? Its over 6 years old, its on an old platform, an old engine and is a summer car. It met its sales expectations of 12k and 10k after the first year for years.
In comparison the RL was introduced in 2005 and hasn't hit sales targets ANY year.
I think at this point, no need to continue this. You don't think style has much to do with buyer tastes, I do, especially if the brand/badge has less or no credibility with buyers.
11-04-08, 09:46 PM
#84
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Agree to Disagree. BMW showed people buy based on badge more than ever with their new controversial styling. Acura cannot begin to meet that.
WHy pick on the SC? Its over 6 years old, its on an old platform, an old engine and is a summer car. It met its sales expectations of 12k and 10k after the first year for years.
In comparison the RL was introduced in 2005 and hasn't hit sales targets ANY year.
I think at this point, no need to continue this. You don't think style has much to do with buyer tastes, I do, especially if the brand/badge has less or no credibility with buyers.
WHy pick on the SC? Its over 6 years old, its on an old platform, an old engine and is a summer car. It met its sales expectations of 12k and 10k after the first year for years.
In comparison the RL was introduced in 2005 and hasn't hit sales targets ANY year.
I think at this point, no need to continue this. You don't think style has much to do with buyer tastes, I do, especially if the brand/badge has less or no credibility with buyers.
I am also not the one that thinks style doesn't have much to do with the car buying decision. It's the surveys that have been conducted that show that the average consumer is not basing their buying decision on looks. Reliability, fuel economy, and safety are the main subjects of concern among consumers.
11-04-08, 10:37 PM
#85
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1.) This is the main reason for almost all the manufacturers. If the Acura TL, Acura TSX, and BMW X6 do not meet their sales goal, would you be willing to admit that the main reason is the economy?
2.) The IS just went through a MMC. The rest of the line-up excluding the SC and RX are not old enough to have reached a MMC yet so they are all still fairly new.
3.) 330k is not a record for luxury car brands. BMW sells well over a million, as does Audi and MB. As a business, your goal is to grow sales year-over-year. If your saying that Lexus was not going to pass 330k sales even in a good economy, then your just assuming they were content with 330k and didn't care to do even better. I think not.
It is not a nationwide deal. It is not anywhere on their website nor have I even seen any ads from Infiniti on tv for it. Please give me the link to the part of the Infiniti website that shows the 0%.
2.) The IS just went through a MMC. The rest of the line-up excluding the SC and RX are not old enough to have reached a MMC yet so they are all still fairly new.
3.) 330k is not a record for luxury car brands. BMW sells well over a million, as does Audi and MB. As a business, your goal is to grow sales year-over-year. If your saying that Lexus was not going to pass 330k sales even in a good economy, then your just assuming they were content with 330k and didn't care to do even better. I think not.
It is not a nationwide deal. It is not anywhere on their website nor have I even seen any ads from Infiniti on tv for it. Please give me the link to the part of the Infiniti website that shows the 0%.
I'm not picking on the SC. I am showing that anything can be spun to look worse than it is.
I am also not the one that thinks style doesn't have much to do with the car buying decision. It's the surveys that have been conducted that show that the average consumer is not basing their buying decision on looks. Reliability, fuel economy, and safety are the main subjects of concern among consumers.
I am also not the one that thinks style doesn't have much to do with the car buying decision. It's the surveys that have been conducted that show that the average consumer is not basing their buying decision on looks. Reliability, fuel economy, and safety are the main subjects of concern among consumers.
Style is very high on luxury car buyers lists.
11-05-08, 09:43 AM
#86
Lexus Champion
Detroit November 3, 2008;
Reuters reported the 20 top-selling vehicles in the U.S. through October of 2008 as reported by the automakers. Total sales of the top 20 vehicles fell 9 percent or -437,401 units to 4,443,849.
Following is a list of the top-20 selling vehicles, ranked by total units.
source : theautochannel
Reuters reported the 20 top-selling vehicles in the U.S. through October of 2008 as reported by the automakers. Total sales of the top 20 vehicles fell 9 percent or -437,401 units to 4,443,849.
Following is a list of the top-20 selling vehicles, ranked by total units.
Code:
RANK VEHICLE 2008 2007 '07 RANK % Chng 1 Ford F-Series P/U 436,022 588,952 1 -26.0 2 Chevy Silverado-C/K P/U 402,191 526,575 2 -23.6 3 Toyota Camry 386,118 398,868 3 -3.2 4 Honda Accord 333,011 332,815 6 +0.1 5 Toyota Corolla 307,071 317,796 4 -3.4 6 Honda Civic 304,297 278,764 8 +9.2 7 Nissan Altima 241,529 239,800 9 +0.7 8 Chevrolet Impala 231,841 270,504 7 -14.3 9 Dodge Ram P/U 213,684 301,689 5 -29.2 10 Ford Focus 175,958 145,977 15 +20.5 11 Honda CR-V 171,193 184,003 11 -7.0 12 Chevrolet Cobalt 168,940 169,400 14 -0.3 13 Chevrolet Malibu 151,429 108,930 26 +39.0 14 GMC Sierra P/U 145,067 174,621 12 -16.9 15 Toyota Prius 142,365 150,572 16 -5.5 16 Ford Escape 135,558 139,911 17 -3.1 17 Ford Fusion 128,381 123,729 20 +3.8 18 GM Pontiac G6 126,494 121,278 28 +4.3 19 Toyota Tundra 121,451 162,348 23 -25.2 20 Honda Odyssey 121,249 144,718 21 -16.2
damn it -- who buys all these trucks?@??!?!?!?!?!?!?
businesses, I know....but still geeez.
11-05-08, 10:23 AM
#87
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11-05-08, 01:23 PM
#88
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I am also not the one that thinks style doesn't have much to do with the car buying decision. It's the surveys that have been conducted that show that the average consumer is not basing their buying decision on looks. Reliability, fuel economy, and safety are the main subjects of concern among consumers.
11-05-08, 01:58 PM
#89
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11-05-08, 02:43 PM
#90
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During the last gen accords owners write up in R&T, styling was actually one of the 5 negatives (5 pros/5 negatives) and people snatched them up like no ones business. We all know that Honda badge hold tremendous weight in the non luxury class.