FKL

See that's the thing, the Honda's interior may be more "solid" meaning it could withstand a brutal beating better, but that doesn't mean the materials themsevles are high quality. The interior of my Accord is littered with cheap plastics, and not one of them are soft to the touch. There are exposed screwheads, cheap mouse feeling headliner, and doors have modest amounts of weather stripping. Again, it depends on how you quantify "quality" I suppose. Big thunky "solidness" doesn't equate to the best quality materials, in my opinion. If that were the case, my old Ford's interior would quantify as quality (which it most definitely was not). Those cheap plastics could withstand pretty much everything but at the end of the day, it was still ridiculously cheap feeling. The Accord is definitely better and really I don't have that huge of problem with it (I own one, so how could I), but again, Passat is better in this regard, in my opinion.

Here's what some had to say:

Detroit News:

"The materials and the design are top-drawer"

KBB:

"Inside the Passat Wagon's refined passenger cabin you'll find a combination of quality materials and dynamic design that's at once is both relaxing and invigorating. Interior trim options include wood, aluminum or composite, and standard leatherette seating gives even the base model an upscale feel."

Motor Trend:

"Even in its most stripped-down form, the Passat exudes upscale ambiance."

New Car Test Drive:

"The Volkswagen Passat is a sophisticated car with a high-quality cabin. It's roomy and comfortable. … The ride is smooth and comfortable and the chassis is well controlled at high speed."

"Quality materials and dynamic design combine in a passenger cabin that's at once both relaxing and energetic"

Forbes:

"The interior is well executed in quality materials and offers ample accommodations for five adults,"

I tend to agree. The only reason I'm spending so much time on this is because I really think you got it wrong, mmarshall. The Interior is excellent, maybe not quite as "exquisite" as the last car, but definitely more stylish and refined than the competing cars.

tex2670

It's like VW never learns anything.

tex2670

How does Consumer Reports describe the interiors? Because, what truly matters isn't how the interiror looks and feels when the car is brand new on a test drive, but how they are over time. Do VW's soft touch materials hold up over time?

mmarshall

No problem. I am very tolerant of contrasting opinions on the car front, especially when they are as courteous like yours. (we need more people like you in the DEBATE section). And.....yes, sometimes it turns out I AM wrong. In my car reviews, for instance, I sometimes miss things.

FKL

CR has always received the Passat very positively. It was their top rated family sedan from 1998 to 2004, and then again in 2006.

"Consumer Reports rated the newly redesigned, V6-powered Volkswagen Passat "Excellent" overall following tests of nine different family sedans for the March issue. The 2006 Passat is now rated second overall, behind the Acura TL in the family sedan category. "

"Among V6 models, the Passat ($30,000) delivers an impressive combination of comfort, sportiness, luxury, and safety. (2004)"

"The Volkswagen Passat V6 is based on the more expensive Audi A4 and A6, and that upper-crust lineage shows clearly in the Passat's attention to detail and its overall feel of solidity and refinement. The interior has the ambience of a more expensive car. The seating is comfortable, and the ride is quiet and gentle. What's more, precise handling and a responsive powertrain add a sporty note that makes the Passat fun to drive. An extensive list of safety features, along with solid performance in government and insurance-industry crash tests, offers an additional benefit. It does cost more than the other cars in this group. (2001)"

I think CNET (who I have major problems with in nearly every review they engage in) said it best in their review of the new for 2006 model:

"The car feels well built, as if VW is seeking to combat past quality problems by overbuilding hinges and hatches. The hood and doors all close with a satisfying solidity, while plastic interior hatches and drawers also feel like they're in it for the long haul."

LexBob2

For all it offers, the Passat is going to have to overcome the reliability stigma.

In the CR used car guide for the '06 model year, both the I4 and V6 get the dreaded black circle, which means Much Worse Than Average.

For '07 the 4 cyl rating is Worse Than Average.

In the new car guide, the Predicted Reliability for the Passat is Much Worse Than Average.

Big hurdles to get over, but I'm sure they are working on it.

IS350jet

First, great homework! Second, the above statement couldn't be further from the truth. The Accord has always been the benchmark to which all other cars in its class are compared. it reigns like the BMW 3 series, up on its pedestal, damn near impossible to knock down. It's been on MT's "10 Best Cars" list for 23 of the last 27 years. Like the BMW, though, its competition is getting fierce.

FKL

I'd argue that isn't the case. The Accord is the volume seller, and may be the benchmark for equipment/reliability levels for the price, but as far as driving dyanmics, packaging, build quality, material choices, technology, and many other factors, it is not the best in class, or the benchmark. Honda admitted back in 2003 that the car they benchmarked for their then new 7th generation Accord was - you guessed it - The Volkswagen Passat. It is clear where they integrated functionality from the Passat, to which I won't bother you all with, but some of the little details were enmulated, and in some cases, half-assed.

Motor Trend:

"This seems a particular shame in light of how well the Passat is regarded inside the business. Its shape has been shamelessly copied in competitors' styling studios, and its interior space and refinement have been studied by product planners around the world. Now, with this latest leap forward in production techniques, applied technology, and artful design, the Passat is due that regard by some of those 2,742,500 buyers of midsize sedans who last year bypassed VW showrooms. Let's hope VW is up to the challenge of making them happy customers, because the 2006 Passat is far too good to go unwanted."

Another detailed example many will go without noticing


or:

The Accord has a cheap plastic key, the Accord has no downward pointing light (even on the door) , the Accord has no LEDs integrated into the signal mirrors. Remember, I own an Accord, I drive it almost daily, and for all that it does well, it does not have the attention to detail of the Volkswagen Passat, new or old.

UberNoob

i think they are using passat as a test bench for new technologies before they introduce them to Audi

lol

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

When you say 'more solid-feeling' vs. 'very cheap' I think ultimately you're talking about WEIGHT, and not cost. I know 'heft' can connote value, but with with such a premium on fuel economy, weight EVERYWHERE is going to be scrutinized more and more. I guess I'm saying that I don't see "light" feeling controls equal to "cheap".

And with still increasing safety regulations, automakers are forced to add weight there, so there's even more pressure to reduce weight elsewhere.

mmarshall

I agree, bit. You make some points. But lightweight parts are also a sign of cheapness when you use less material to make (or produce) that part. If you can use 8 oz. of plastic instead of 16 to make a stalk, for example (that seems to be what VW and some German manufacturers are doing), that is a strong sign of cost-cutting.

FKL

Yes but those turn signal stalks do not even begin to start making up the amount of total plastic in an interior of a car. For the "cheap" stalks in the Jetta/Passat, they are backed into a fully electric, non mechanical computer system, one which is able to electronically activate the turn signal lighting for 3-5 blinks on a light swipe, which can be controlled through the MFA display. The Honda does NOT have this functionality. When a Volkswagen has it's airbags deploy, the car will immediately activate the turn signals and unlock the doors (and shut off fuel supply, but most do this). A Honda, with it's much less sophisticated electronic control systems, will not.

The level of electronics running over the CANBUS network in these cars is truely remarkable. The lighting, the key mechanism, the turn signals, the locking system, - the central computer is all aware of all the computer systems. The horn activating will send a signal to the radio to mute itself. The VAG-COM tool can effectively plug into these cars and trace down any fault to the very source. It can also configure endless functions, such as activating automatic window roll down, to programming the AFS directional Bi-Xenon lighting systems to perform or not perform a self-test everytime the car is started). If you've ever used vag-com, it's an indispensable tool. These new generation of cars are completely different, electronic-wise, from the previous generation, which had a highly complex mix of relays connected to a central control brain.

I guess what I'm saying is, I try and look beyond the obvious areas where you can impress. When you delve deeper into the car, you find where you pay for the upscale quality. The damping is better on all intreior flaps, every cargo compartment is lined in a soft rubber texture (honda has NO lining whatsoever, just plastic), the material inside the glove compartment, and the leather surrounding the gear shift mechanism. Hondas look great in pictures, but it's testy in real life when you closely examine the lack of attention to detail. (in my opinion)

mmarshall

Most Hondas, even the Fit, have carpeting in the trunks/cargo areas.

FKL

Oh, yeah I know that, I'm just talking about the way it's done. I mean, Honda rarely uses lining on the deck lid unless it's a top trim model, there's no handle inside to close the trunk (so you have to put your hand on the wet/dirty metal to shut it), and the hinges intrude into the cargo bay, into luggage, decreasing the carrying capacity. I just think they could do better, put some hooks, add some lining, rework the hinges.

What I was talking about before was the lining inside the interior storage cubbies, which has soft rubber on the bottom to prevent items from moving around. Both of my Honda Accords have nothing.

And I really am having a good time talking about this, I really would rather not have anybody thinking I'm trying to be rude about any of it. I enjoy contrasting opinions like this

IS350jet

^^ Your opinions regarding the Passat and Accord are valued here. Your research has taught me a lot of things I didn't know about the Passat. Now, do the same research on the Accord and you will be equally amazed. Actually, I'd swear by your writings that you are a Passat owner, NOT and Accord owner. Why so much passion toward the Passat?