The future of Infiniti. Is it finite?
01-01-09, 06:23 PM
#31
Lexus Fanatic
Recent Nissan/Infiniti and Honda/Acura V6s are indeed impressive in the HP department (some of them are tweaked to produce over 300 HP) but torque in normally aspirated V6s, in most cases, still lags a little behind that of the average V8.
However, this does not necessarily contradict my earlier statements (or what I have posted in other threads about the V6-vs.-V8 issue in Acura and Infiniti products), because there are a number of other factors involved as well, such as aerodynamics, transmission/final-drive gearing, tire-rolling resistance, drivetrain efficiency, and the ultimate power-to-weight ratio.
01-01-09, 07:32 PM
#32
Lexus Test Driver
Most Infiniti dealers in the GTA are stand alone. One just moved into the empty space left by the Volvo dealer on HWay7 in Markham. The one on Yonge/Steeles is co-located with all the RoyFoss dealers, but it is still a stand alone building with its own sales, service, parts and lot.
01-01-09, 07:35 PM
#33
I beg to differ.
Lets start with the FX. I do see a few on the road but for everyone one FX i see atleast 5-10RXs. And for every RX i see, i see atleast twice as many BMW X3s,X5s and a few X6s. And i see atleast as many as Cayenne as Fxs. And more Land Rovers then FX.
Then the G35/37/M45, for everyone of those i see , their are a TON more BMWs and Benzs. Like astleast 30-50 bimmers and benzs in relation to one of those infinitis. And atleast twice as many audis to infinitis. Then a good 15 times as many is,gs, and ls to said infinities. (ftw the is is a pretty good seller, i see more of them then gs's, es's or ls's)
In the big picture they are doing better then acura but with regards to the german cars and lexus, they are seriously lacking in sales.
Also some food for thought. In newport all we have is luxury car dealerships.
We have BMW, Ferrari, lambo, rolls royce, audi, bently, porsche, jaguar, land rover, benz and of course lexus.
Guess what we dont have. Cadillac, Infinity, Acura or Lincoln/Mercury. And those are the exact brands that are doing the worst in the luxury car category.
Honda and Nissan have to take a page out of toyota's playbook. Cripple your standard car brand to make your luxury brand, luxurious. Putting cars like the s2000 and nissan 350z which are relatively good sellers under your normal brand, undermines your luxury brand. (to be fair the land cruiser does that as well)
Lets start with the FX. I do see a few on the road but for everyone one FX i see atleast 5-10RXs. And for every RX i see, i see atleast twice as many BMW X3s,X5s and a few X6s. And i see atleast as many as Cayenne as Fxs. And more Land Rovers then FX.
Then the G35/37/M45, for everyone of those i see , their are a TON more BMWs and Benzs. Like astleast 30-50 bimmers and benzs in relation to one of those infinitis. And atleast twice as many audis to infinitis. Then a good 15 times as many is,gs, and ls to said infinities. (ftw the is is a pretty good seller, i see more of them then gs's, es's or ls's)
In the big picture they are doing better then acura but with regards to the german cars and lexus, they are seriously lacking in sales.
Also some food for thought. In newport all we have is luxury car dealerships.
We have BMW, Ferrari, lambo, rolls royce, audi, bently, porsche, jaguar, land rover, benz and of course lexus.
Guess what we dont have. Cadillac, Infinity, Acura or Lincoln/Mercury. And those are the exact brands that are doing the worst in the luxury car category.
Honda and Nissan have to take a page out of toyota's playbook. Cripple your standard car brand to make your luxury brand, luxurious. Putting cars like the s2000 and nissan 350z which are relatively good sellers under your normal brand, undermines your luxury brand. (to be fair the land cruiser does that as well)
01-02-09, 01:23 AM
#35
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Gotta remember, though, that when you are talking about acceleration, torque is a more important figure than HP. Torque, especially at lower RPMs, determines how fast you will get to 0-60; HP deterimes what your ultimate top speed will be.....a matter of little use on American roads, and most useful only on the german Autobahn.
Recent Nissan/Infiniti and Honda/Acura V6s are indeed impressive in the HP department (some of them are tweaked to produce over 300 HP) but torque in normally aspirated V6s, in most cases, still lags a little behind that of the average V8.
However, this does not necessarily contradict my earlier statements (or what I have posted in other threads about the V6-vs.-V8 issue in Acura and Infiniti products), because there are a number of other factors involved as well, such as aerodynamics, transmission/final-drive gearing, tire-rolling resistance, drivetrain efficiency, and the ultimate power-to-weight ratio.
Recent Nissan/Infiniti and Honda/Acura V6s are indeed impressive in the HP department (some of them are tweaked to produce over 300 HP) but torque in normally aspirated V6s, in most cases, still lags a little behind that of the average V8.
However, this does not necessarily contradict my earlier statements (or what I have posted in other threads about the V6-vs.-V8 issue in Acura and Infiniti products), because there are a number of other factors involved as well, such as aerodynamics, transmission/final-drive gearing, tire-rolling resistance, drivetrain efficiency, and the ultimate power-to-weight ratio.
The low end torque out of the BMW twin turbo 6 for example is outrageous. The car pegs you to the seat with even the slightest blip of the throttle. I am with you with the assesement that there is little reason to splurge on the M3, this engine is magnificent in it's own right. 300lb-ft at just 1,400rpm is astonishing. Honestly, I think low-end torque is useful for American roads as well, espcially in cut/thrust city driving, not to mention on the highway.
01-02-09, 06:10 AM
#36
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I beg to differ.
Lets start with the FX. I do see a few on the road but for everyone one FX i see atleast 5-10RXs. And for every RX i see, i see atleast twice as many BMW X3s,X5s and a few X6s. And i see atleast as many as Cayenne as Fxs. And more Land Rovers then FX.
Then the G35/37/M45, for everyone of those i see , their are a TON more BMWs and Benzs. Like astleast 30-50 bimmers and benzs in relation to one of those infinitis. And atleast twice as many audis to infinitis. Then a good 15 times as many is,gs, and ls to said infinities. (ftw the is is a pretty good seller, i see more of them then gs's, es's or ls's)
In the big picture they are doing better then acura but with regards to the german cars and lexus, they are seriously lacking in sales.
Also some food for thought. In newport all we have is luxury car dealerships.
We have BMW, Ferrari, lambo, rolls royce, audi, bently, porsche, jaguar, land rover, benz and of course lexus.
Guess what we dont have. Cadillac, Infinity, Acura or Lincoln/Mercury. And those are the exact brands that are doing the worst in the luxury car category.
Honda and Nissan have to take a page out of toyota's playbook. Cripple your standard car brand to make your luxury brand, luxurious. Putting cars like the s2000 and nissan 350z which are relatively good sellers under your normal brand, undermines your luxury brand. (to be fair the land cruiser does that as well)
Lets start with the FX. I do see a few on the road but for everyone one FX i see atleast 5-10RXs. And for every RX i see, i see atleast twice as many BMW X3s,X5s and a few X6s. And i see atleast as many as Cayenne as Fxs. And more Land Rovers then FX.
Then the G35/37/M45, for everyone of those i see , their are a TON more BMWs and Benzs. Like astleast 30-50 bimmers and benzs in relation to one of those infinitis. And atleast twice as many audis to infinitis. Then a good 15 times as many is,gs, and ls to said infinities. (ftw the is is a pretty good seller, i see more of them then gs's, es's or ls's)
In the big picture they are doing better then acura but with regards to the german cars and lexus, they are seriously lacking in sales.
Also some food for thought. In newport all we have is luxury car dealerships.
We have BMW, Ferrari, lambo, rolls royce, audi, bently, porsche, jaguar, land rover, benz and of course lexus.
Guess what we dont have. Cadillac, Infinity, Acura or Lincoln/Mercury. And those are the exact brands that are doing the worst in the luxury car category.
Honda and Nissan have to take a page out of toyota's playbook. Cripple your standard car brand to make your luxury brand, luxurious. Putting cars like the s2000 and nissan 350z which are relatively good sellers under your normal brand, undermines your luxury brand. (to be fair the land cruiser does that as well)
01-02-09, 06:38 AM
#37
Lexus Fanatic
Thanks. 
Agreed. For non-track use, I'd take the 335i over the M3 in an instant. It also offers an xi AWD version to compete with Audis, unlike the RWD-only M3.
Yes, I made that point clear in my post (I think you misead it...I wasn't suggesting otherwise). Low-end torque IS generally want Americans want, and often use. It is high-end HP, not torque, that is generally more compatable on the German Autobahn than American roads. That is because HP overcomes air resistance at high speeds, where there is little, if any acceleration, left.
The low end torque out of the BMW twin turbo 6 for example is outrageous. The car pegs you to the seat with even the slightest blip of the throttle. I am with you with the assesement that there is little reason to splurge on the M3, this engine is magnificent in it's own right. 300lb-ft at just 1,400rpm is astonishing.
Honestly, I think low-end torque is useful for American roads as well, espcially in cut/thrust city driving, not to mention on the highway.
Last edited by mmarshall; 01-02-09 at 06:41 AM.
01-02-09, 06:44 AM
#38
Thanks.
Agreed. For non-track use, I'd take the 335i over the M3 in an instant. It also offers an xi AWD version, unlike the M3.
Yes, that was a point I made clear (I think you misead it)......low-end torque IS generally want Americans want, and often use. It is high-end HP, not torque, that is generally more comparable on the German Autobahn tham American roads. That is because HP overcomes air resistance at high speeds, where there is litle, if any acceleration, left.
Agreed. For non-track use, I'd take the 335i over the M3 in an instant. It also offers an xi AWD version, unlike the M3.
Yes, that was a point I made clear (I think you misead it)......low-end torque IS generally want Americans want, and often use. It is high-end HP, not torque, that is generally more comparable on the German Autobahn tham American roads. That is because HP overcomes air resistance at high speeds, where there is litle, if any acceleration, left.
01-02-09, 07:34 AM
#39
Racer
Imo I don’t think Infiniti has a problem in the prestige department. The only car that Lexus knocks Infiniti over the head with is the LS460. They may need another coupe or sedan in their line up but Infiniti is the closes you can get to a BMW with a better interior. For the record, I find BMW interiors disgusting. I find their interior cold. In ending I think Infiniti is doing ok they just need to continue to make nice cars and concentrate on marketing. Yes, Toyota does a great job at dumb down their lower division. I probably wouldn’t purchase a car in the Toyota line up except the Prius. That’s why Lexus is such a big step from Toyota. Lastly, I truly hate the way Toyota copy other companies ideas.
01-02-09, 08:58 AM
#40
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Great post here, mmarshall.
The low end torque out of the BMW twin turbo 6 for example is outrageous. The car pegs you to the seat with even the slightest blip of the throttle. I am with you with the assesement that there is little reason to splurge on the M3, this engine is magnificent in it's own right. 300lb-ft at just 1,400rpm is astonishing. Honestly, I think low-end torque is useful for American roads as well, espcially in cut/thrust city driving, not to mention on the highway.
The low end torque out of the BMW twin turbo 6 for example is outrageous. The car pegs you to the seat with even the slightest blip of the throttle. I am with you with the assesement that there is little reason to splurge on the M3, this engine is magnificent in it's own right. 300lb-ft at just 1,400rpm is astonishing. Honestly, I think low-end torque is useful for American roads as well, espcially in cut/thrust city driving, not to mention on the highway.
01-06-09, 08:40 AM
#42
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Infiniti, even though they are very nice cars, they just dont seem to do it for me. I loved the 1st gen G35's,and the M45 is okay but they just dont seem to grab my attention or make me want to stop by the dealer..But thats just me!!!
01-06-09, 09:07 AM
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01-06-09, 09:27 AM
#44
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So the figures are in. Percentage declines from previous year.
Audi - down 36%
Acura - down 20%
BMW (not including Mini) - down 15%
Mercedes - down 11%
Lexus - down 21%
Infiniti - down 11%
Audi - down 36%
Acura - down 20%
BMW (not including Mini) - down 15%
Mercedes - down 11%
Lexus - down 21%
Infiniti - down 11%
01-06-09, 09:44 AM
#45
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Even with Lexus down 21% for example, they still sold 260k vehicles as 2007 was a record breaking year with over 320k sold.
My crazy bet is watch for Infiniti to possibly revive the I35 as dealers beg for a product that sells in higher volume.