Mr Johnson

While I appreciate both of your opinions I think would hope that the opinions and comments of actual IS-F owners and dyno graphs would have some more weight. Perhaps in the short time you both got to drive the sound of the intake opening up around those RPM gave you a false sense of added "oomph"? You should try it again and see if you still feel that way. I don't know but I don't feel it and the dyno doesn't really show it either. OTOH.... perhaps I'm just on crack??
I'm trying to figure out where you heard that rumor to be able to understand how much weight I should give it. If it's from a salesman at a dealership it won't hold nearly as much weight as from a Lexus PR or technical resource.


Nice. True for the Mustang folks but not Buick.

I don't mean to pick on you but I'm curious: Do you own *any* of these cars?

I don't have a problem with bench racing to some level. You have to get your data from somewhere. But the opinions of so many here come from those that down own *any* of these class of cars. I respect the opinion of those that actually own an M3, RS4, CTS-V and C-63 above those that have only test driven one or only bench raced them.

I don't think the IS-F is the all-out winner. But my preferences will have me rate the above machines differently. That certainly doesn't mean I need to denigrate Cadillac's attempt or Mercedes approach. I may not prefer them but I can give props to someone that has made a very solid alternative in this category.

I have to agree that in general I find the same as Rominl:

rominl

iTrader: (4)

that's very true and i agree a lot with it. you can only tell so much from a test drive. extensive driving locally or on the track, etc... tells a lot more

kit cat

iTrader: (6)

Where's the "I'm with stupid emoticon" when I need it?

have you guys arguing about a chipped 335i and whatnot driven an IS-F? And a car is not about just going fast or what the power-to-weight ratio is. There are a lot of different elements and factor that make a car that is so hard to put it objective comparable numbers.

I've driven a 335i (it wasn't chipped ) and to be honest, I was more impressed by it on the streets. Truth be told though, that heavy small thick steering is extremely direct and makes me want to drive. BUT, after the end of a 30minute test drive, it made my arms soar! Maybe because I wasn't used to it, but I sure got to relax a bit when I got back to my Lexus. I did miss the direct steering feel when I was driving my Lexus though. But for a daily driven car, a Lexus might more suited, at least for me.

I was expecting a driving feeling like the BMW gave me, and was a little disappointed. This thread shed me some light though....If the IS-F can be that direct on the track as some owners have claimed (since I stupidly overlooked a button...), it might be an awesome car.

Now, if Lexus would throw in a 6MT with a clutch pedal...

mmarshall

True, I don't own an IS-F, but I gave it a long enough test-drive, and worked the throttle enough (within sensible limits on a brand-new engine) to get a pretty good idea of what the throttle characteristics were. And that torque surge, from 3600-4000 RPM, on my test car, was there. That was a fact. For me to say otherwise would be to simply state a falsehood about one of my reviews.....which I will not do.

Perhaps you are correct on later ones. Lexus may have redone the engine computer controls on later models and alteed the torque curve.....I don't know. I know I had an early-production one. So did Mike (1SICKLEX). In fact, Mike sampled one at an early Lexus Drive-a-Thon event, around a track.



It was among some discussion here, several weeks ago, on CAR CHAT theads....I don't remember which one. That's why I stated (and made clear) it was only a rumor, not a fact.

So, I wouldn't overly concern myself with it.....it's not something you can take to the bank.

JKA.nyc

ISn't the CTS-V supposed to compete against the M5 and the E63? the RS4 is extremely overrated also.

primecut

iTrader: (1)

Take my advice, you should stop responding to this thread, because comments like that make you look really bad, and no one is going to take you seriously.

What you really mean is that this is the collective ranking based on all the magazines and websites that you've come across. Now your screen name makes so much sense. Brilliant.

That's interesting, because I have the same experience driving my sister's E90 335i as well. The steering felt very tight and direct, but IMO that feeling is more attributed to the heavyweight steering wheel rather than the actual handling of the car. I'm surprised you lasted 30 minutes, because I was getting annoyed after 5 minutes. It gets unnecessarily tedious. I can imagine that it might be fun for a little while, but I can't imagine cruising with the car. I have to give credit where it's due though, because that car has 0 turbo lag and good torque. Excellent engine.

Back to the ISF torque discussion... I'm afraid that the lack of torque feeling at lower rpms may also be attributed to the non-sport mode gimpy throttle response. It certainly feels like the car doesn't want to go until you step on it or until the second intake opens up. However, as the dyno shows, it is in fact a flat curve. There's no better feeling than passing cars going up the hill in 8th gear.

CDNROCKIES

Nice post primecut! Nice to see another actual owner wading in.

This "rice sound" that has been posted here more than once, is completely laughable and clearly shows the posters lack of knowledge about cars. Apparently, Mustang GT500's and MB C63 AMG's must also be "ricey" with their big V8 growls....lol.

The rankings that pagemaster listed are also ridiculous. I'm not sure if you'll get much argument that the M3 is the best car on the track. But how many driver's buy their car's to strictly track? Most owners are using them as dual purpose vehicles: daily driver and weekend fun car.

Let me start by saying that all of the cars listed are amazing vehicles. It's amusing that it's seems to be, more often than not, bench racers that are providing the criticisms based on what they read in a magazine. Like rominl stated, it isn't usually owners of these cars slagging each other....we all know we have incredible driving machines and they are all excellent for their own reasons.

The CTS-V isn't really a competitor. It targets the M5/6 and the RS5/6 and several of the AMG's. Again, an incredible car.

The RS4 isn't being built anymore firstly, and secondly have a peek at the videos on the F thread, of an RS4 getting owned by an F. Do a little more research, the F is at the very least as good as the RS4.

I think you'd actually get more argument about where the C63 sits.

The bottom line is that there are 4, and only 4 cars that are true competitors to each other. They are the M3, C63 AMG, RS4 and the IS F. Period!

I also agree with primecut, that when driven properly (ie. manual mode, sport mode with paddles) that torque is there at the bottom. If it wasn't there, I wouldn't have so much trouble keeping the PS2's from spinning out....lol.

I have never sat here and argued that the F is the best car ever built, but will continue to defend against some of the ridiculous statements being made in this thread. Ultimately, that decision comes down to the buyer. We each make our decisions based on what best suits our own individual needs.

ffpowerLN

iTrader: (1)

Personally I'll take a bias owner's opinion over someone who has never driven the car in any given day.

I did my fair share of "bench racing" when I was younger but now I realize that no matter how much one reads, the actually seat time behind the wheel cannot be overlooked by any means.

But that's just me.

Mr Johnson

No one is asking you to "state a falsehood".

In case you still don't realize it. I own an "early-production" model. I was at the same track event as Mike. I don't agree. We shall agree to disagree. Doesn't make your opinion a "falsehood" nor my opinion wrong.

Car chat thread rumor? Say no more.
I don't overly concern myself with any internet forum posts.

If I had waited I would have cross-shopped the CTS-V based entirely on the price bracket it occupies. It's a 4 door sport sedan in the 60-65K range. The minor size difference doesn't enter into it for me.

IS-SV

I was at the San Jose car show this weekend. The IS-F still attracted a good sized crowd for a production car. The new Camaro had the most people taking pics. And the IS250C drew a good crowd everytime they cycled the retractable top.

flipside909

I'm not disappointed with the IS F. As a matter of fact, i've owned one for exactly one month now. My 2009 has 3,200 miles on it already.

CDNROCKIES

Nice work!

Drive it like you stole it....lol.

I also put 9500 km (6000 miles) on mine in the first two months.

I8ABMR

I think I would take flipsides opinion over the opinion of a test driver

FKL

I went too, IS-SV. Car i saw attracting attention was the Ford Fusion Hybrid, and everyone was wearing the blue shirts they were handing out. Great looking car.

Overall, I was disappionted that both Mercedes-Benz and Audi were not present (unless I am crazy).

mmarshall

I wasn't stating that you opinion was wrong, or what you experienced.....only that what I experienced about the torque surge (possibly to to valve timing characteristics) in that RPM range was also a fact, and I wasn't going to change my statement either.

Here is my exact experience with the car:

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/car...exus-is-f.html

Well, that's why I said that the part about the suspension running change was not necessarily fact, but rumor. I don't intend to say any more about it.


Nice car, but in the past they have had reliability problems, especially with the rear differential. New 2009 unsold models are also hard to find at dealerships, and also difficult to test-drive (some dealerships don't allow test-drives until a Bill of Sale is committed), although availability, right now, seems to be increasing.