Next Generation Corolla
01-27-09, 02:30 PM
#63
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WOW this thread grew fast! I wish I could have seen this yesterday but I was stuck in meetings all day—
Annd here’s my really long response:
MPLexus301—Ah, yes the infamous Toyota/Subaru RWD coupe project- I inquired about this as well, and the answer I got was not all too pleasing. Basically, as I’m sure you’ve all guessed, it was a No-Go. I can’t say exactly why that is, but it’s pretty much determined at this point that it will not be developed further. =/
As for the tC, the next version of the tC( Not sure if it will be called tC still, or if the name will be changed) has a pretty distinct look, which I think will fit into the Scion brand. It definitely will not be RWD and the pricing points will remain under 20k, to keep it an entry level vehicle.
And for the Corolla, I’ve seen some of the preliminary sketches and I will say, they are on the right path for sure- They were all very aggressive and the rooflines curved in such a way, that they looked like 4 door coupes.
I certainly agree, the Matrix needs a new design as well—I think I am only working on the Corolla right now though—I’m not sure when the Matrix will come into play, or if it will be based off the new Corolla’s design, and just offered as a hatch version of it. The Matrix really hasn’t been discussed.
Yes, we have definitely looked at competition and Corolla is definitely the forgettable, boring, bland car in it’s class- I am hoping that the production vehicle looks close to the sketches, and while some will say that it’s not possible, I do have a little hope- I saw the sketches of the Celica (the last gen) next to a photo of the real deal, and I say, they got pretty close to those sketches! So perhaps there is hope!
pbm317- Thanks for noting your age in there—I can’t really say much regarding any performance aspects of this vehicle, or the Corolla (Because I don’t know anything yet in regards to the performance enhancements) but I do know that at the end of the day, it will be a Corolla and so…can’t expect it to be a lot faster..but we shall see!
Bitkahuna—haha yes, I agree that “kit” was a pretty lame attempt to make it look better! The sketches I saw look more promising
DASHOCKER- Ooohh bigger tires would be nice indeed—but as mmarshall stated, people who want Corollas (or most Toyota vehicles, actually) want smooth rides. This is why we don’t typically offer a wide variety of bigger rims with low profile tires (I don’t see why we can’t offer them as an options though…with disclaimers hehe) – I guess the 18s that were available for the Yaris got many complaints because people didn’t realize you can’t go over potholes fast and not expect damage to occur….
Suislide- thanks for showing that comparison…yeah..that’s pretty sad isn’t it. =/
TRDRAV4—thanks for the link to the ToyotaNation forums—I was looking through there before I started working on this project, but I did want to specifically ask a group of people who probably didn’t have a Corolla, to inquire why they would never consider it.
However, I could definitely get some good feedback from Corolla owners as well- Looks like I need to sign up to yet another forum haha Too many passwords! ahh
Herbvdh—thanks for that input! I’m surprised you actually like the interior (other than A/C controls)—Hmm, does it have anything to do with the fact that everything is simple and relatively easy to locate on the dashboard? Or…what other reason?
1SICKLEX- haha very brutal, but that’s just what we need
thanks for the detailed feedback, with the humor thrown in haha I’m sure the design team will get a kick out of this one =) I can say, the design team who designed the current gen and previous gen Corolla are much older than the team who is working on the next gen Corolla- And so far, they share many of the opinions that I have, and that I’ve seen on this forum and others. Thank God> And not to worry, the sketches don’t resemble a Lexus at ALL
I will say this, in regards to your mention of the design team—the reason why a younger design team was brought in for the Corolla is because old people have been designing the Corolla and Matrix with what they think the young kids will like (obviously fail) and they see that our competitors are way ahead of us. It has also been determined that by about 2025, Toyota’s main customer base will be dying (not to be blunt here, but that’s the plain fact), so we need to start attracting a younger crowd NOW haha- Thankfully they are realizing this and doing something about it. I can only hope the next Corolla actually looks as good as these sketches…otherwise, I was never part of this project (so people don’t’ hunt me down hahaha)
JLSC4-- thanks for your input and age =) We are trying to add a “premium” feel (at least to the interior) of this car, but of course, nothing like a Lexus—as you mentioned, it’s a $16k car, so…it won’t look or feel like a $40k car hehe
TRDFantasy- Interesting point! I agree, it shouldn’t look like a Lexus, and from what I’ve seen, the sketches look nothing like a Lexus As for tacked on body pieces, that is definitely a common complaint of the Corolla (and others) as you’ve seen—so I’ll be sure to dig that point in at my next meeting this week!
Performance, well, I can’t really say anything about that—only working on exterior and interior right now =/ But of course, I’ll make sure these suggestions are heard!
Interior- we are going for a more premium look and feel to the interior, without going to Lexus-luxury of course. Another thing that was brought up is to do away with the “T” shaped interior, and change up the styling—It’s hard to explain without pictures, but the interior sketches I’ve seen are far from boring and bland, but without getting too crazy and spaceship-looking haha. As far as options go, well, again…not my say for this particular project =/
I know we have a long way to go, especially with the other Toyota vehicles, but we have to start somewhere, and Corolla was chosen to be the starting point. –I can say that I’m pretty sure Camry will always be pretty mainstream and “Vanilla” since that’s our signature “one size fits all” kind of car that sells in masses. But we have some work to do on the others, for sure
mmarshall, just out of curiosity, how old are you? Haha you don’t’ have to give exact age if you don’t want, but perhaps an age range?
felixsc300- ah, interesting—so you like the two-tone dashes? Hmm, well we haven’t got into colors just yet, but I’ll certainly keep that in mind for the next couple of weeks !
Dunnojack—Well, the goal is to make the Corolla appeal to a younger audience- I stated this a few times above (but I know it’s a super long post and you all probably don’t wanna read that big thing haha), but essentially, the core customer base of Toyota is older people and by 2025, they are going to stop buying cars because to be straightforward, there aren’t going to be many of them alive by then, so we need to start appealing to a younger crowd with certain vehicles, like the Corolla. (The Avalon will probably always be an old-person vehicle haha)
We are looking to make the exterior sportier, and the interior better looking, without crossing into luxury market—Premium is the word that keeps coming up, especially in regards to the interior and the materials used. We also are trying to get away from the “T” shaped interior, which is typical, especially in the Corolla, while keeping it from looking like the Hondas with the buttons everywhere.
ExTrEmE99 and MaxNine- In regards to the height of the vehicle…well..this was brought up—Nobody likes Wheel Gap. This is what I was told in regards to wheel gap:
The cars cannot have zero or too little wheel gap because of tire chain requirements.
BUT that doesn’t stop us from offering packages that have lowering springs…now…a whole new battle will be having springs that lower the car a decent amount—not SLAM it, but at least get rid of the gap instead of lowing the car .5inches so that there is still a wheel gap…but that will be a battle with engineering, not with the exterior/interior design team =/
Tall and skinny look—hehe yeah, that’s come up a lot too when describing the Corolla—The sketches certainly steer clear of that tall and skinny look—so, hopefully that won’t be an issue for the next gen, hopefully =)
Thanks to everyone again for all of this feedback—I will print out these comments and take them with me to the meetings, to ensure I don’t’ forget anything
Annd here’s my really long response:
MPLexus301—Ah, yes the infamous Toyota/Subaru RWD coupe project- I inquired about this as well, and the answer I got was not all too pleasing. Basically, as I’m sure you’ve all guessed, it was a No-Go. I can’t say exactly why that is, but it’s pretty much determined at this point that it will not be developed further. =/
As for the tC, the next version of the tC( Not sure if it will be called tC still, or if the name will be changed) has a pretty distinct look, which I think will fit into the Scion brand. It definitely will not be RWD and the pricing points will remain under 20k, to keep it an entry level vehicle.
And for the Corolla, I’ve seen some of the preliminary sketches and I will say, they are on the right path for sure- They were all very aggressive and the rooflines curved in such a way, that they looked like 4 door coupes.
I certainly agree, the Matrix needs a new design as well—I think I am only working on the Corolla right now though—I’m not sure when the Matrix will come into play, or if it will be based off the new Corolla’s design, and just offered as a hatch version of it. The Matrix really hasn’t been discussed.
Yes, we have definitely looked at competition and Corolla is definitely the forgettable, boring, bland car in it’s class- I am hoping that the production vehicle looks close to the sketches, and while some will say that it’s not possible, I do have a little hope- I saw the sketches of the Celica (the last gen) next to a photo of the real deal, and I say, they got pretty close to those sketches! So perhaps there is hope!
pbm317- Thanks for noting your age in there—I can’t really say much regarding any performance aspects of this vehicle, or the Corolla (Because I don’t know anything yet in regards to the performance enhancements) but I do know that at the end of the day, it will be a Corolla and so…can’t expect it to be a lot faster..but we shall see!
Bitkahuna—haha yes, I agree that “kit” was a pretty lame attempt to make it look better! The sketches I saw look more promising
DASHOCKER- Ooohh bigger tires would be nice indeed—but as mmarshall stated, people who want Corollas (or most Toyota vehicles, actually) want smooth rides. This is why we don’t typically offer a wide variety of bigger rims with low profile tires (I don’t see why we can’t offer them as an options though…with disclaimers hehe) – I guess the 18s that were available for the Yaris got many complaints because people didn’t realize you can’t go over potholes fast and not expect damage to occur….
Suislide- thanks for showing that comparison…yeah..that’s pretty sad isn’t it. =/
TRDRAV4—thanks for the link to the ToyotaNation forums—I was looking through there before I started working on this project, but I did want to specifically ask a group of people who probably didn’t have a Corolla, to inquire why they would never consider it.
However, I could definitely get some good feedback from Corolla owners as well- Looks like I need to sign up to yet another forum haha Too many passwords! ahh
Herbvdh—thanks for that input! I’m surprised you actually like the interior (other than A/C controls)—Hmm, does it have anything to do with the fact that everything is simple and relatively easy to locate on the dashboard? Or…what other reason?
1SICKLEX- haha very brutal, but that’s just what we need
thanks for the detailed feedback, with the humor thrown in haha I’m sure the design team will get a kick out of this one =) I can say, the design team who designed the current gen and previous gen Corolla are much older than the team who is working on the next gen Corolla- And so far, they share many of the opinions that I have, and that I’ve seen on this forum and others. Thank God> And not to worry, the sketches don’t resemble a Lexus at ALL I will say this, in regards to your mention of the design team—the reason why a younger design team was brought in for the Corolla is because old people have been designing the Corolla and Matrix with what they think the young kids will like (obviously fail) and they see that our competitors are way ahead of us. It has also been determined that by about 2025, Toyota’s main customer base will be dying (not to be blunt here, but that’s the plain fact), so we need to start attracting a younger crowd NOW haha- Thankfully they are realizing this and doing something about it. I can only hope the next Corolla actually looks as good as these sketches…otherwise, I was never part of this project (so people don’t’ hunt me down hahaha)
JLSC4-- thanks for your input and age =) We are trying to add a “premium” feel (at least to the interior) of this car, but of course, nothing like a Lexus—as you mentioned, it’s a $16k car, so…it won’t look or feel like a $40k car hehe
TRDFantasy- Interesting point! I agree, it shouldn’t look like a Lexus, and from what I’ve seen, the sketches look nothing like a Lexus
As for tacked on body pieces, that is definitely a common complaint of the Corolla (and others) as you’ve seen—so I’ll be sure to dig that point in at my next meeting this week!Performance, well, I can’t really say anything about that—only working on exterior and interior right now =/ But of course, I’ll make sure these suggestions are heard!
Interior- we are going for a more premium look and feel to the interior, without going to Lexus-luxury of course. Another thing that was brought up is to do away with the “T” shaped interior, and change up the styling—It’s hard to explain without pictures, but the interior sketches I’ve seen are far from boring and bland, but without getting too crazy and spaceship-looking haha. As far as options go, well, again…not my say for this particular project =/
I know we have a long way to go, especially with the other Toyota vehicles, but we have to start somewhere, and Corolla was chosen to be the starting point. –I can say that I’m pretty sure Camry will always be pretty mainstream and “Vanilla” since that’s our signature “one size fits all” kind of car that sells in masses. But we have some work to do on the others, for sure
mmarshall, just out of curiosity, how old are you? Haha you don’t’ have to give exact age if you don’t want, but perhaps an age range?
felixsc300- ah, interesting—so you like the two-tone dashes? Hmm, well we haven’t got into colors just yet, but I’ll certainly keep that in mind for the next couple of weeks !
Dunnojack—Well, the goal is to make the Corolla appeal to a younger audience- I stated this a few times above (but I know it’s a super long post and you all probably don’t wanna read that big thing haha), but essentially, the core customer base of Toyota is older people and by 2025, they are going to stop buying cars because to be straightforward, there aren’t going to be many of them alive by then, so we need to start appealing to a younger crowd with certain vehicles, like the Corolla. (The Avalon will probably always be an old-person vehicle haha)
We are looking to make the exterior sportier, and the interior better looking, without crossing into luxury market—Premium is the word that keeps coming up, especially in regards to the interior and the materials used. We also are trying to get away from the “T” shaped interior, which is typical, especially in the Corolla, while keeping it from looking like the Hondas with the buttons everywhere.
ExTrEmE99 and MaxNine- In regards to the height of the vehicle…well..this was brought up—Nobody likes Wheel Gap. This is what I was told in regards to wheel gap:
The cars cannot have zero or too little wheel gap because of tire chain requirements.
BUT that doesn’t stop us from offering packages that have lowering springs…now…a whole new battle will be having springs that lower the car a decent amount—not SLAM it, but at least get rid of the gap instead of lowing the car .5inches so that there is still a wheel gap…but that will be a battle with engineering, not with the exterior/interior design team =/
Tall and skinny look—hehe yeah, that’s come up a lot too when describing the Corolla—The sketches certainly steer clear of that tall and skinny look—so, hopefully that won’t be an issue for the next gen, hopefully =)
Thanks to everyone again for all of this feedback—I will print out these comments and take them with me to the meetings, to ensure I don’t’ forget anything
01-27-09, 08:29 PM
#64
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01-27-09, 08:33 PM
#65
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mmarshall, just out of curiosity, how old are you? Haha you don’t’ have to give exact age if you don’t want, but perhaps an age range?
That makes me a lot older than many of you guys, but not exactly ready to cash it in yet, by any means. I've got a lot of life left in me.
01-27-09, 09:49 PM
#66
Lexus Connoisseur
I actually like the current generation Corolla except for a few interior and exterior features. There are too many similar exterior styling cues to the 2IS. The perforated leather interior for the XRS model mimics the IS F's leather interior as far as the blue accents in the perforation. Also the interior lighting is kind of a mess. Amber and light blue back lighting for the speedo cluster and the rest of the dash clash big time. Get rid of the light amber colored backlighting and go back to the nice white or light blue lighting.
01-27-09, 09:55 PM
#67
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I disagree. Good looking cars sell and people overlook their other merits. The last generation Altima is the perfect example. Built like crap and not a good car but looked like a Lexus and sold VERy well.
01-27-09, 10:06 PM
#68
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That adds to what I said though. When Nissan introduced the 3rd-gen Altima, it had virtually no real reputation in North America. The Altima did sell very well thanks mainly to styling, because the car did have quite a bit of issues. The reason the car sold well was because Nissan had little to no reputation in North America at the time. If Nissan right now tried to sell a car with that many problems it would flop, regardless of styling. Nissan now has built up a somewhat respectable reputation in North America so people have higher expectations with new Nissan models.
Why has the Mazda 3 sold so well over the past few years? Same reason, Mazda had virtually little to no reputation before the Mazda 3 was introduced. The Mazda 3 is generally a good car, but it lacks in quite a few areas. The main reason the Mazda 3 has sold well is styling, just like the 3rd-gen Altima.
01-27-09, 10:42 PM
#69
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Just a few days ago, I saw an XRS in the rear view mirror at a light. I was so confused I had to stick my head out and look back. I saw a slick looking car with a Toyota badge... "WTF?!?!" The front IMHO looks quite aggressive, and handsome. Some work could be done on the rear, that is where it falls apart I think.
(edit) oh rite ...
current exterior: doesn't offend me, better than a civic (but that's not hard to do), but doesn't seem super interesting either. That said, if it's a volume seller, then being highly distinctive isn't really a great plan either, you don't want to put buyers off.
current interior: icky, but I would never buy that type of car because I never like their interiors (materials & tactile experience basically). I really am the luxury buyer based largely on touch/feel.
23/female
Last edited by Faymester; 01-27-09 at 10:47 PM.
01-27-09, 10:51 PM
#70
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The best-selling vehicle in history is the Corolla. The Ford F150 historically is a big seller as well.
Why has the Mazda 3 sold so well over the past few years? Same reason, Mazda had virtually little to no reputation before the Mazda 3 was introduced. The Mazda 3 is generally a good car, but it lacks in quite a few areas. The main reason the Mazda 3 has sold well is styling, just like the 3rd-gen Altima.
01-29-09, 08:19 AM
#71
OK.....you can figure it out. I learned to drive in high school, and have been driving (and reviewing cars) for 40 years. Simple enough.
That makes me a lot older than many of you guys, but not exactly ready to cash it in yet, by any means. I've got a lot of life left in me.
That makes me a lot older than many of you guys, but not exactly ready to cash it in yet, by any means. I've got a lot of life left in me.
Faymester—Ah yes, the rear is where it falls apart—funny thing you mentioned that, it was just brought up in the last meeting! I agree!
Mmm a coupe variant, that would be amazing. Well, it actually IS a possibility, but it could always get knocked down by management later =/ The good news is that I heard that Toyota is researching the possibility of creating TWO Corolla designs! One would be for the international sales (this would be the typical econo-box Corolla we’ve seen recently) and the other would be specifically for the US! The US version would of course be the one to carry the more aggressive body styling =) There IS hope!
Thanks for the other input and adding your age in there =) looks like we are the same age!
Interesting points you guys make about the reasons people buy cars (based more on looks or merit/reliability, etc)- I think it really depends on which car and who the target market is- I think we can safely say that MOST of the current Corolla buyers did not buy the car for it’s stunning good looks (I am being sarcastic), but more for it’s price, fuel economy and/or reliability. But very interesting to see the different points of view
flipside909- Ah, thanks for sharing Ryan—Ohhh, good thing you mentioned the interior lighting- that was one thing I did forget to mention last time, but I’ll be sure to mention it at today’s meeting.
Out of curiosity, what color is most pleasing to people for backlighting on the dash/speedometer area? OR, would it be best to offer the option of CHANGING the color? (I know this is possible) –
Again, I thank everybody for responding—I’ll most likely bump this thread from time to time in the next 7 weeks, just to add updates to those who may be interested, and request more feedback =) I appreciate the time you all have taken to participate in this!
01-29-09, 08:52 AM
#72
Lexus Connoisseur
flipside909- Ah, thanks for sharing Ryan—Ohhh, good thing you mentioned the interior lighting- that was one thing I did forget to mention last time, but I’ll be sure to mention it at today’s meeting.
Out of curiosity, what color is most pleasing to people for backlighting on the dash/speedometer area? OR, would it be best to offer the option of CHANGING the color? (I know this is possible) –
. Stay away from the ugly amber, green and even red. Color changing option to suit the driver's needs would be awesome, granted the color is consistent on the speedo cluster and the instrument panel buttons.
01-29-09, 10:01 AM
#73
While we are on this subject, when the Celica died there was some buzz that the next generation of Corolla (current gen now) would get a coupe variant to make up for it. I know there is also the rumored Toyota/Subaru RWD coupe but has any more thought been put into such a car? Between the tC and this rumored new coupe there may or may not be a spot for a Corolla coupe but consider how many variants Honda sells.
If they could design a decent looking 2 door with 140hp 5 or 6AT/MT and price it from $15K I think it would be a great success. Also add a $17-18K XRS version with sportier suspension and touches, a 6MT or 6AT mated to the the new AR 2.5L I4 and call it a day.
If they could design a decent looking 2 door with 140hp 5 or 6AT/MT and price it from $15K I think it would be a great success. Also add a $17-18K XRS version with sportier suspension and touches, a 6MT or 6AT mated to the the new AR 2.5L I4 and call it a day.
Ah ok ok, I get the idea! Thanks for sharing
Faymester—Ah yes, the rear is where it falls apart—funny thing you mentioned that, it was just brought up in the last meeting! I agree!
Mmm a coupe variant, that would be amazing. Well, it actually IS a possibility, but it could always get knocked down by management later =/ The good news is that I heard that Toyota is researching the possibility of creating TWO Corolla designs! One would be for the international sales (this would be the typical econo-box Corolla we’ve seen recently) and the other would be specifically for the US! The US version would of course be the one to carry the more aggressive body styling =) There IS hope!
Thanks for the other input and adding your age in there =) looks like we are the same age!
Interesting points you guys make about the reasons people buy cars (based more on looks or merit/reliability, etc)- I think it really depends on which car and who the target market is- I think we can safely say that MOST of the current Corolla buyers did not buy the car for it’s stunning good looks (I am being sarcastic), but more for it’s price, fuel economy and/or reliability. But very interesting to see the different points of view
Faymester—Ah yes, the rear is where it falls apart—funny thing you mentioned that, it was just brought up in the last meeting! I agree!
Mmm a coupe variant, that would be amazing. Well, it actually IS a possibility, but it could always get knocked down by management later =/ The good news is that I heard that Toyota is researching the possibility of creating TWO Corolla designs! One would be for the international sales (this would be the typical econo-box Corolla we’ve seen recently) and the other would be specifically for the US! The US version would of course be the one to carry the more aggressive body styling =) There IS hope!
Thanks for the other input and adding your age in there =) looks like we are the same age!
Interesting points you guys make about the reasons people buy cars (based more on looks or merit/reliability, etc)- I think it really depends on which car and who the target market is- I think we can safely say that MOST of the current Corolla buyers did not buy the car for it’s stunning good looks (I am being sarcastic), but more for it’s price, fuel economy and/or reliability. But very interesting to see the different points of view
I'm 22, male. I was considering the S/XRS model for a DD but I landed on the tC because I got a deal on it and it's a coupe. I actually like the new Corolla quite a bit but I do agree it resembles the 2IS too much. My girlfriend owns a 08 Corolla and she loves it. I guess my complaint is that it doesn't get some of the cooler things from the tC (standard iPod connection, LED in the mirror housing, supercharger option from the factory). On the other side, the tC should've got folding mirrors, I hate the fact I can't fold my mirrors in. The tC gets you more for your dollar I guess (usually coupes cost more than their sedan counterparts). Optioned out the Corolla XRS compared to the tC is far too expensive for such a weak "performance" version.
Leave the base, LE, XLE, S the way they are.
The XRS should get whole new bumpers and skirts, sport tuned suspension, wheels and the factory supercharger option from TRD.
01-29-09, 03:07 PM
#74
Lexus Fanatic
While we are on this subject, when the Celica died there was some buzz that the next generation of Corolla (current gen now) would get a coupe variant to make up for it. I know there is also the rumored Toyota/Subaru RWD coupe but has any more thought been put into such a car? Between the tC and this rumored new coupe there may or may not be a spot for a Corolla coupe but consider how many variants Honda sells.
01-29-09, 04:39 PM
#75
Lexus Fanatic
OK.....you can figure it out. I learned to drive in high school, and have been driving (and reviewing cars) for 40 years. Simple enough.
That makes me a lot older than many of you guys, but not exactly ready to cash it in yet, by any means. I've got a lot of life left in me.
That makes me a lot older than many of you guys, but not exactly ready to cash it in yet, by any means. I've got a lot of life left in me.
