Help me buy a new SUV
#32
I bought my mother a used MDX after a long used SUV search / fact finding mission
the earlier models 01-03's have a weak tranny design (fails every 100-125k) but the overall build quality is good. The MDXs have a noticeably better driving feel vs the Pilot, not sure why; I think it is a different suspension setup
The 04-06's get a modest power bump and slight facelift but a better tranny. These vehicles hold up really well and are legit for cold weather driving. The new design 07+ are just too ugly for me...
GL
the earlier models 01-03's have a weak tranny design (fails every 100-125k) but the overall build quality is good. The MDXs have a noticeably better driving feel vs the Pilot, not sure why; I think it is a different suspension setup
The 04-06's get a modest power bump and slight facelift but a better tranny. These vehicles hold up really well and are legit for cold weather driving. The new design 07+ are just too ugly for me...
GL
#34
I'm in the market for a midsize SUV with third row seating. I've narrowed it down to the following: Toyota Highlander, Honda Pilot, Mazda CX-9, Mercury MKX.
The Mercury was an "add-on" to my list because the local Lincoln dealer is offering some pretty sick discounts.
A few questions:
1) Of the four, any opinions or favorites?
2) Has anyone bought recently? How desperate are the dealerships and how willing are they to work up from a "lowball" offer? I can't imagine paying much over invoice days... This is probably affected by region--I'm in the Midwest.
3) How do you guys handle "trade ins"? Trade in value can always be adjusted down once you settle on a sale price for the car, so how do you "uncouple" the two transactions?
4) Any pearls on trying to get the "best" deal? Just show up with your offer on a piece of paper and say "take it or leave it"? I'll admit, I'm not a haggler by nature...
5) Has anyone bought from a place like CarMax? How was that experience?
Thanks for any/all advice...
The Mercury was an "add-on" to my list because the local Lincoln dealer is offering some pretty sick discounts.
A few questions:
1) Of the four, any opinions or favorites?
2) Has anyone bought recently? How desperate are the dealerships and how willing are they to work up from a "lowball" offer? I can't imagine paying much over invoice days... This is probably affected by region--I'm in the Midwest.
3) How do you guys handle "trade ins"? Trade in value can always be adjusted down once you settle on a sale price for the car, so how do you "uncouple" the two transactions?
4) Any pearls on trying to get the "best" deal? Just show up with your offer on a piece of paper and say "take it or leave it"? I'll admit, I'm not a haggler by nature...
5) Has anyone bought from a place like CarMax? How was that experience?
Thanks for any/all advice...
I hate driving it and now with our second child, we need a vehicle that we can tolerate on long drives with enough room for a double stroller . So we tried to sell the Pilot, its resale value is so dismal that you might as well just give it away. Since it has less than 25k miles, we decided to just keep it for grocery runs, sell my Q45 and buy an SUV of better quality.
In my opinion, the Pilot is perfect for those with hearing problems or those who don't mind ROAD NOISE and has the time, or maybe don't mind wasting time, going to the dealer for warranty repairs.
#36
Lexus Fanatic
True, but auto manufacturers have little or no control over what people do with hand-held aftermarket stuff....even hand-held NAV/GPS units. And as for radio controls, I always comment, in my auto reviews, on how well they are designed and how easy or difficult they are to operate.
#37
Lexus Fanatic
If you go for the Honda Pilot, be prepared to be disappointed. We have an 05 that we got in 12/04, too many warranty issues and now that it is out-of-warranty, some of the previous problems are back. And the most irritating part of owning a Pilot is the ROAD NOISE. It's actually my wife's car, good thing she works less than 5 miles away.
I hate driving it and now with our second child, we need a vehicle that we can tolerate on long drives with enough room for a double stroller . So we tried to sell the Pilot, its resale value is so dismal that you might as well just give it away. Since it has less than 25k miles, we decided to just keep it for grocery runs, sell my Q45 and buy an SUV of better quality.
In my opinion, the Pilot is perfect for those with hearing problems or those who don't mind ROAD NOISE and has the time, or maybe don't mind wasting time, going to the dealer for warranty repairs.
I hate driving it and now with our second child, we need a vehicle that we can tolerate on long drives with enough room for a double stroller . So we tried to sell the Pilot, its resale value is so dismal that you might as well just give it away. Since it has less than 25k miles, we decided to just keep it for grocery runs, sell my Q45 and buy an SUV of better quality.
In my opinion, the Pilot is perfect for those with hearing problems or those who don't mind ROAD NOISE and has the time, or maybe don't mind wasting time, going to the dealer for warranty repairs.
Last edited by mmarshall; 03-15-09 at 05:38 PM.
#38
Lexus Fanatic
True, but auto manufacturers have little or no control over what people do with hand-held aftermarket stuff....even hand-held NAV/GPS units. And as for radio controls, I always comment, in my auto reviews, on how well they are designed and how easy or difficult they are to operate.
The annoying "I agree" lawyer crap in my Lexus nav adds no value and is not included in Mercedes nav systems for example. Agreed, car makers need to make user friendly electronics to minimize distractions.
#40
Overall, looking for the same things most buyers seek: quality, value, style, ergonomics, livability, etc. I like the BMW X5 and Audi Q7, but I am keeping my budget <$40,000. I am willing to look at 1-2 yr old used SUVs since I will be buying (not leasing) this car and plan on having it for >4 years.
If I left anything out that will help you opine, let me know .
#41
Road noise is significant with a number of Honda-designed vehicles, but in general, they are extremely well-built. It is unusual (but, of course, not unheard of) for a Pilot such as yours to have a lot of warranty issues, although some older Acura TLs and Accords were built with defective automatic transmissions. Consumer Reports, perhaps the best source available, gives the Pilot, like most Hondas, an above-average reliability rating.
The OP should go and test drive all the SUVs in questions to narrow his choice down. In my opinion the Mazda is the most fun to drive, the Toyota has the best ride and the Honda offers the best bang for the buck.
Other SUVs to consider are the CMC Acadia and the Mitsubishi Outlander.
Last edited by madmax2k1; 03-15-09 at 10:36 PM.
#42
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: International
Posts: 1,302
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Intended to be the primary family/people hauler. Most driving to be done in town/city but occasional road trips planned. Want third row b/c my kids play sports and wife is often pooling friends and teammates around. Do not expect to ever use it off-road, but do have to contend with Midwest winter weather (so prefer AWD). Will look to option it out fully (power package, NAV, rear entertainment, etc.), so it matters to me how each manufacturer integrates those options.
#43
Lexus Test Driver
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,279
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It wasn't just "some" select models. This was a mass problem across the product lines, affecting hundreds of thousands of vehicles. It affected the 98-03 Accord, the 99-03 TL, the 04-05 TL, the 01-04 MDX, the 01-04 Pilot, and the Odyssey.
My 02 EX V6 has been through a transmission already and it's slipping on it's second. It hasn't even hit 90K and I have babied the car to no end (including $400 "transmission fluid" change, what a waste), Honda NEVER did address the core problem even in the replacement transmissions. They are still sticking the same design back on these cars, knowing full well they will fail again. My good friend has been to hell and back on his 03 TL. 3 transmissions, yes three. One at 35K, another at 80K, and is now on the last. I'd steer clear of these years in question, because the transmission design is defective and has never been corrected. Go read any Honda forum, or type "honda/acura transmissions" in Google to read up if you have any doubts. When it came time to park another Honda on the driveway, I went with a 5MT - couldn't be happier.
Overall, looking for the same things most buyers seek: quality, value, style, ergonomics, livability, etc. I like the BMW X5 and Audi Q7, but I am keeping my budget <$40,000. I am willing to look at 1-2 yr old used SUVs since I will be buying (not leasing) this car and plan on having it for >4 years.
If I left anything out that will help you opine, let me know .[/COLOR][/FONT]
Zeus69, if you are attracted to those German SUVs, I'd look at the Volkswagen Touraeg, which is the sister to the Audi Q7 and Porsche Cayenne. I searched for a Touraeg 2 (08+) in my local listings and the prices are absurd. $33K for a fully loaded V8 FSI.
Build quality is unsurpassed by much anything else in this segment. Trust me, go drive a Honda Pilot and then a Touareg. I'm not pulling stuff from my *** here. The way the Touareg is built clearly higher than that of it's similarly-sized (and cheaper) Japanese competition. It's on par with X5, Range Rover, and is built better in my opinion than the much more costly Cayenne. It gets a bad rap for it's badge but it's an amazing SUV.
#44
In my extended family, we have a 2001 x5, 2002 MDX, 2003 Pilot. As the youngest male with a toolbox, I get to work on all these vehicles. I own the x5 and would not own one if I lived in the midwest. The issue is that there is a design flaw (oil separator) with cold weather. It is a problem with midwest climates. Plus, the electrical components on German cars are pretty crap compared to Japanese counterparts. I can't tell you how many times I've replaced / cleaned sensors on the BMW--it is sometimes like the highmaintanence arm candy girlfriend I always/never wanted. It's sexy but demanding
I imagine the VW is not much different from the BMW and Mercedes I've had to work on.
If you're not gonna offroad the car, then don't buy a vehicle designed to cross the rubicon trail (land crusier, RRover, Lexus LX/GX, VW/Cayenne). You're lugging around a lot of weight for components you may never use (low range, locking diff, etc)
At the end of the day, a lot of SUV sales are emotional sales rather than rational sales. (eg 4runner over Highlander for most people) We buy horsepower and features we don't really use. Your budget looks to be pushing you to a near-luxury sort of situation. If you can stomach it, a minivan with AWD might be a good choice (lighter, more functional space)
The one piece of advice I've been given that is really useful is this--never own more than one problematic/tempermental/nonreliable car at a time. It's ok but annoying to have one car you need to work on but two is a completely different story.
I imagine the VW is not much different from the BMW and Mercedes I've had to work on.
If you're not gonna offroad the car, then don't buy a vehicle designed to cross the rubicon trail (land crusier, RRover, Lexus LX/GX, VW/Cayenne). You're lugging around a lot of weight for components you may never use (low range, locking diff, etc)
At the end of the day, a lot of SUV sales are emotional sales rather than rational sales. (eg 4runner over Highlander for most people) We buy horsepower and features we don't really use. Your budget looks to be pushing you to a near-luxury sort of situation. If you can stomach it, a minivan with AWD might be a good choice (lighter, more functional space)
The one piece of advice I've been given that is really useful is this--never own more than one problematic/tempermental/nonreliable car at a time. It's ok but annoying to have one car you need to work on but two is a completely different story.