VW reveals race to overtake GM, Toyota
03-27-09, 08:29 AM
#61
^ I don't necessarily disagree with your post but Americans have proven, time and time again, that they mostly care for simple, reliable, dependable transportation that gets them from point A to point B. Camrys, Accords, Corollas, Fusions, Malibus, Civics, etc. They're appliances. Nice, solid, reliable appliances. They're also relatively inexpensive to maintain and own which is nice.
Compared to the competition, VW asks people to pay a premium to buy and own their cars but they do offer some nicer features that the CamCordTima's don't but also sacrifice some of the reliability.
For most Americans the choice is simple, but still, everyone is different and at the end of the day "different strokes for different folks". VW isn't just "basic transportation" and that is what Americans like.
Compared to the competition, VW asks people to pay a premium to buy and own their cars but they do offer some nicer features that the CamCordTima's don't but also sacrifice some of the reliability.
For most Americans the choice is simple, but still, everyone is different and at the end of the day "different strokes for different folks". VW isn't just "basic transportation" and that is what Americans like.
03-30-09, 01:14 PM
#63
Lexus Fanatic
Not necessarily, since the difference (in the chart a couple pages back) shows a statistically insignificant difference between Buick/Jag/Lexus.
03-30-09, 01:36 PM
#64
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Quebec
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Buick's are good if you want a 3.8 litre relic of an engine. 
Its seen as reliable in those JD surveys because half of the owners are in old folks homes/bedridden and the other half cant afford to go to the dealership :P
Lol just kidding buicks arent that bad.
Its seen as reliable in those JD surveys because half of the owners are in old folks homes/bedridden and the other half cant afford to go to the dealership :P
Lol just kidding buicks arent that bad.
03-30-09, 02:16 PM
#65
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,279
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well if we are going to question the validity of the reliability studies (JDpower) when lexus isn't on top, I'll question why Volkswagen is number two from the bottom.
The first question that comes to mind is how can a VW be exponentially less reliable than an Audi - even a BMW, Mercedes or Volvo. It's complete nonsense to actually believe that a Volkswagen Jetta/Golf/Passat is somehow so much less "reliable" than an Audi (which has a good chance of using the same 2.0TFSI), that it appears, what, twelve slots below Audi?
So then why the disconnect between Consumer Reports and JD Power?
It's because JD power is a joke of a ranking service. Their "studies" from everything from mobile phone coverage to these "dependability" studies are deluded from reality. Jaguar higher than Lexus for reliability? - wait, really? Audi far above average while Volkswagen receives second to last? My god, do they just choose their rankings randomly? Where's the empirical evidence and substance behind JD power's nonsense?
The first question that comes to mind is how can a VW be exponentially less reliable than an Audi - even a BMW, Mercedes or Volvo. It's complete nonsense to actually believe that a Volkswagen Jetta/Golf/Passat is somehow so much less "reliable" than an Audi (which has a good chance of using the same 2.0TFSI), that it appears, what, twelve slots below Audi?
Originally Posted by Consumer Reports
If all that consumers cared about were performance, comfort, and safety, Mercedes and Volkswagen models would go to the head of the class. They have the highest average test scores because they ride and handle especially well, have comfortable seats, and have relatively good fuel economy and acceleration.
In recent years those vehicles have lagged in reliability. But that has begun to change, with several models from Mercedes and Volkswagen, as well as BMW, Saab, and Volvo, attaining average or better predicted reliability.
"With an overall score of 78 out of 100 points, Honda was followed closely by Subaru (75), and Toyota (74) in the overall score. Subaru is also the only automaker with 100% of its tested vehicles Recommended, although it has a relatively small model lineup. Mazda (73), came in 4th, followed by Mercedes-Benz, Nissan, Volkswagen, and BMW, all tied at 72."
In recent years those vehicles have lagged in reliability. But that has begun to change, with several models from Mercedes and Volkswagen, as well as BMW, Saab, and Volvo, attaining average or better predicted reliability.
"With an overall score of 78 out of 100 points, Honda was followed closely by Subaru (75), and Toyota (74) in the overall score. Subaru is also the only automaker with 100% of its tested vehicles Recommended, although it has a relatively small model lineup. Mazda (73), came in 4th, followed by Mercedes-Benz, Nissan, Volkswagen, and BMW, all tied at 72."
So then why the disconnect between Consumer Reports and JD Power?
It's because JD power is a joke of a ranking service. Their "studies" from everything from mobile phone coverage to these "dependability" studies are deluded from reality. Jaguar higher than Lexus for reliability? - wait, really? Audi far above average while Volkswagen receives second to last? My god, do they just choose their rankings randomly? Where's the empirical evidence and substance behind JD power's nonsense?
Last edited by FKL; 03-30-09 at 02:20 PM.
03-30-09, 02:41 PM
#67
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,279
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do you care to comment on the valdidity of the points I just outlined or do you wish to continue derailing topics with nonsense?
Please, go focus on your group drive, and do your required thread crapping there.
Please, go focus on your group drive, and do your required thread crapping there.
03-30-09, 02:54 PM
#68
Sorry but I didn't get any of the points from your previous post except:
1. JD Power bad because VW ranks lower
2. CR good because VW ranks higher
So naturally I followed that train of thought to conclude that... The so-called XL-Camry LS460 is the best car in the world because none others scored higher on the "good" CR.
Thread crapping? How's trying to knock on Toyota/Lexus in every possible chance not thread crapping?
1. JD Power bad because VW ranks lower
2. CR good because VW ranks higher
So naturally I followed that train of thought to conclude that... The so-called XL-Camry LS460 is the best car in the world because none others scored higher on the "good" CR.
Thread crapping? How's trying to knock on Toyota/Lexus in every possible chance not thread crapping?
03-30-09, 04:34 PM
#69
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,279
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Please stop making us suffer just because reading comprehension isn't a strong suit of yours.
I prefer to call things like I see them and avoid the rigid line ideology like some, unable to see beyond the brand they own, and god forbid, talk about deficiencies. I'm sorry you can't stand the LS being compared to a Camry, a comparison which I never made, a comparison which you evidently are so unable to man up and get over, you have to plunder threads continuing to talk about it. It's not my or anyone elses fault you take any questioning of Toyota as personal attacks on every front and respond accordingly. Drop the hostile attitude, drop the smart *** remarks, and yes, drop the thread crapping.
In regards to the "studies", the only point being made is the seemingly wides-read foundings between the two, as well as the large spread betwen an Audi and a Volkswagen, which calls it into question.
I prefer to call things like I see them and avoid the rigid line ideology like some, unable to see beyond the brand they own, and god forbid, talk about deficiencies. I'm sorry you can't stand the LS being compared to a Camry, a comparison which I never made, a comparison which you evidently are so unable to man up and get over, you have to plunder threads continuing to talk about it. It's not my or anyone elses fault you take any questioning of Toyota as personal attacks on every front and respond accordingly. Drop the hostile attitude, drop the smart *** remarks, and yes, drop the thread crapping.
In regards to the "studies", the only point being made is the seemingly wides-read foundings between the two, as well as the large spread betwen an Audi and a Volkswagen, which calls it into question.
Last edited by FKL; 03-30-09 at 04:37 PM.
03-30-09, 04:44 PM
#71
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 1,279
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
and with that, the thread has obviously ran it's course. close it down.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
