Is the V8 a dying breed? Auto engineers expect more turbos, smaller engines
04-22-09, 11:13 AM
#16
LOL, the V8's will not die, they will only get bigger and badder, and more desirable than ever.
Today's V6's in premium cars range from 3.5L to 4.0L, which is basically the same displacement as mid-late 90ies 8 cylinder motors. They are also as powerful as mid 90ies 8 cylinder motors, so the justification can be made that nobody needs a V8, but once you drive a modern V8, there's just no comparison.
In fact, I feel that there's going to be a horse power at another level very soon. All the base model four cylinder camrys, accords, and altimas haven't been getting anymore powerful, while their v6 siblings all got monsterous power increase. For instance the V6 camry went from 190hp to 270, that's 80hp upgrade, while as the 4 cylinder got what, maybe 20hp increase? Watch one of them throw the first jab with a ~200hp base model 4 cyl, and the battle will begin.
Today's V6's in premium cars range from 3.5L to 4.0L, which is basically the same displacement as mid-late 90ies 8 cylinder motors. They are also as powerful as mid 90ies 8 cylinder motors, so the justification can be made that nobody needs a V8, but once you drive a modern V8, there's just no comparison.
In fact, I feel that there's going to be a horse power at another level very soon. All the base model four cylinder camrys, accords, and altimas haven't been getting anymore powerful, while their v6 siblings all got monsterous power increase. For instance the V6 camry went from 190hp to 270, that's 80hp upgrade, while as the 4 cylinder got what, maybe 20hp increase? Watch one of them throw the first jab with a ~200hp base model 4 cyl, and the battle will begin.
04-22-09, 11:47 AM
#17
Lead Lap
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: MD
Posts: 4,511
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Today's V6's in premium cars range from 3.5L to 4.0L, which is basically the same displacement as mid-late 90ies 8 cylinder motors. They are also as powerful as mid 90ies 8 cylinder motors, so the justification can be made that nobody needs a V8, but once you drive a modern V8, there's just no comparison.
04-22-09, 12:16 PM
#18
Agreed. I am dissapointed that the Fusion gained 200 lbs. I always commended it for only weighing in at 3100 lbs for the base model. That being said, this model is even more efficient and more powerful.
I think engine sizes have really ballooned to a point that they don't need to be for your average vehicle. I like the Subaru 2.5L car, because Subarus are athletic, rugged, AWD vehicles. But does a Camry need a 180 HP 2.5L? I think a 165 HP, smaller, more efficient powerplant would suffice. Same with the 3.5L. That's alot for the Camry, whereas I can see a vehicle like the Fusion having that option (the new one does) since you can get it in AWD. Who is trying to go fast in a FWD Camry?
I think engine sizes have really ballooned to a point that they don't need to be for your average vehicle. I like the Subaru 2.5L car, because Subarus are athletic, rugged, AWD vehicles. But does a Camry need a 180 HP 2.5L? I think a 165 HP, smaller, more efficient powerplant would suffice. Same with the 3.5L. That's alot for the Camry, whereas I can see a vehicle like the Fusion having that option (the new one does) since you can get it in AWD. Who is trying to go fast in a FWD Camry?
Every V6 camry I see when I drive my IS is trying to go faster than me. Speaking of loseing weight I would have bought a STI if it was available without AWD. In So. CA you need/want power alot more than AWD & the weight that comes with it. Displacement of the engine has a bigger effect on MPG & emissions than the number of cylinders.
04-22-09, 01:11 PM
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
5.0 V-8 for FX 50
5.6 for QX56
They will all soon get the new 5.0 V-8
04-22-09, 01:20 PM
#20
Yes V8's are a dying breed.
Most manufacturers will have to trim their line ups from excess V8s. Right now Lexus has too many V8s in their porfolio for their cars. The 4.3, 4.6 and 5.0. Lexus is having trouble moving the SC430 and the LS460 right now. No wonder why we will see a Ls350 in the future. Maybe not in America but overseas at least. Lexus only really needs one V8 for their cars.
Most manufacturers will have to trim their line ups from excess V8s. Right now Lexus has too many V8s in their porfolio for their cars. The 4.3, 4.6 and 5.0. Lexus is having trouble moving the SC430 and the LS460 right now. No wonder why we will see a Ls350 in the future. Maybe not in America but overseas at least. Lexus only really needs one V8 for their cars.
You seem to imply that standardizing the line with one V8 engine would be the most efficient thing to do while in all honesty, I cannot think of a less efficient way to go about business. Truck V8s won't necessarily work (tuned the same way) in cars, and it would be ridiculous for the LS 460 to employ the firebreathing V8 out of the IS F. Customers would hate it. Different cars have different purposes and intended uses- often times that dictates the need for a different engine.
For example, by your strategy you would likely say that the new GX should get the new 5.7L V8 so that the SUVs all use the same engine. Truthfully, A midsize SUV really doesn't need 385hp (for a number of reasons) and they also have to distinguish the LX as well as justify an $80,000 price tag. This is why the GX is getting a 4.6L 320hp version of the same block that is tuned differently.
Lexus often uses a similar block - 4.6L, 5.0L, and 5.7L are all on the same block I think- among many cars, but they are all tuned differently.
04-22-09, 01:47 PM
#21
executive matchup
04-22-09, 02:31 PM
#24
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: ca
Posts: 1,979
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
its about time. Does anyone really need more than 300hp that a I4 turbo can provide, if so a twin turbo 6 can get up to 400hp if needed (or more see Porsche 911 turbo).
I'm always searching for I4 turbo cars and there is never enough to choose from in the marketplace. The GM I4 turbos can be ordered from the factory with 290hp in the Solstice GXP and Sky Redline, that is a great engine, too bad GM is such a pitiful company they are going to let those models die.... its even direct injected!
Toyota JDM 3SGTE:
US Subbie STI:
US GM LNF:
BMW 7 series V12 j/k:
I'm always searching for I4 turbo cars and there is never enough to choose from in the marketplace. The GM I4 turbos can be ordered from the factory with 290hp in the Solstice GXP and Sky Redline, that is a great engine, too bad GM is such a pitiful company they are going to let those models die.... its even direct injected!
Toyota JDM 3SGTE:
US Subbie STI:
US GM LNF:
BMW 7 series V12 j/k:
Last edited by toy4two; 04-22-09 at 02:40 PM.
04-22-09, 02:38 PM
#25
its about time. Does anyone really need more than 300hp that a I4 turbo can provide, if so a twin turbo 6 can get up to 400hp if needed (or more see Porsche 911 turbo).
I'm always searching for I4 turbo cars and there is never enough to choose from in the marketplace. The GM I4 turbos can be ordered from the factory with 290hp in the Solstice GXP and Sky Redline, that is a great engine, too bad GM is such a pitiful company they are going to let those models die.... its even direct injected!
I'm always searching for I4 turbo cars and there is never enough to choose from in the marketplace. The GM I4 turbos can be ordered from the factory with 290hp in the Solstice GXP and Sky Redline, that is a great engine, too bad GM is such a pitiful company they are going to let those models die.... its even direct injected!
04-22-09, 02:41 PM
#26
Guest
Posts: n/a
^^ Some of us have no intentions of ever buying a 4 cylinder, I don't care if it makes 500hp. I don't like how they feel or sound. they seem fine in light cars but in heavy cars, they just don't cut it for me.
Its not like all 4 cylinders are so fuel efficient either. The 4 cylinder TSX gets the same economy as the 6 cylinder IS 250 for example.
I think people should be allowed a choice, no reason to just hate on V-8s like this article is suggesting.
Its not like all 4 cylinders are so fuel efficient either. The 4 cylinder TSX gets the same economy as the 6 cylinder IS 250 for example.
I think people should be allowed a choice, no reason to just hate on V-8s like this article is suggesting.
04-22-09, 03:55 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
^^ Some of us have no intentions of ever buying a 4 cylinder, I don't care if it makes 500hp. I don't like how they feel or sound. they seem fine in light cars but in heavy cars, they just don't cut it for me.
Its not like all 4 cylinders are so fuel efficient either. The 4 cylinder TSX gets the same economy as the 6 cylinder IS 250 for example.
I think people should be allowed a choice, no reason to just hate on V-8s like this article is suggesting.
Its not like all 4 cylinders are so fuel efficient either. The 4 cylinder TSX gets the same economy as the 6 cylinder IS 250 for example.
I think people should be allowed a choice, no reason to just hate on V-8s like this article is suggesting.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
bad co
Car Chat
11
09-15-11 08:35 AM
