TripleL

As I read through the comments here I was reminded of this C&D Article from January 2008.

2007 BMW 328i vs. 2008 Cadillac CTS DI, 2008 M-B C300 Sport, 2008 Infiniti G35 Sport

Finishing order of that one was:
1. BMW 328i
2. Infiniti G35 Sport
3. Cadillac CTS DI
4. M-B C300 Sport

Threxx

I actually went so far as to remove my ECU to ship it off but then saw how obvious it was that I had removed the ECU (the security screws show obvious damage) and envisioned my engine blowing up and then me hoping the programming was truly as invisible as it was claimed to be, but the security screws giving me away... at that point I reinstalled my ECU and decided to forget about it.

I replaced the A4 in October 07 with my 335i anyway, which is faster than my A4 would have been even with the ECU mod. Of course I had evil thoughts about getting a vishnu or JB connection for it.. which was even more appealing since I could buy one used and resell it after the lease was over for very little cost. In the end I didn't because I'm just too much of a puss I guess... but after reading that BMW has found how to detect modded cars and engine replacements (although very rare) are costing 20 grand... I'm glad, again, that I didn't do it.

I sure hope I'm able to get my 335i to the 1/4-mile track before the lease is up, though. I've ran every car I've ever owned except one at the 1/4-mile track, plus some (including the 335i) at the auto-cross track... it'd be a shame if one of the two fastest cars I've owned to date didn't make it out for a solid 1/4-mile pass. I already went once but they were filming some TV show for the speed channel and so I waited in line for 4 hours and only got one pass where I lit up the tires all the way down the track.

gshb

well its all relative. when compared to an is350 then it rides rough but the g37 is, in my eyes, in between the 135i and 335i. even with sport package the 335i is pretty soft compared to a g37s or sport 135i. i like the sport package on the g37 and 135i a lot. good value for money and rides well enough that i wouldnt consider aftermarket suspension parts at all.

and yah i guess bmw is more expensive. i just always think of the higher end audis as seriously more expensive than normal. s5 for example...

oh yah i forgot, the TL sh-awd is 38k with the only option of tech package. so actually its quite a bargain. a4 2.0 quattro for the same price as the TL sh-awd. tho i remember reading the TL is really slow for 300hp.

speedflex

Sorry. Can't provide a link because I read the print issue. BTW, they were not complimentary towards the TL but somehow the styling ended up as one of the highs for that car.

There's also another G37 vs. Genesis match-up in the same issue (At least I think so. I looked over all the car mags while I was at Borders so could be confused as to which mag it's in) Not gonna tell you how that one turned out.

PsychDoc

Why don't the major car rags all just get together and declare the 3 series "THE BEST VEHICLE EVER MADE, THE BEST SEDAN, BEST COUPE, SUV, TRUCK AND BOAT TOO....THE BEST VEHICLE THAT WILL EVER BE MADE ON THE FACE OF THE EARTH AND THE UNIVERSE."

Friggin' pathetic.

mmarshall

Before you get sarcastic and go off the deep end, have you test-driven any recent 3-series models...or other BMW products? BMW does not necessarily mean perfection. Some of the newer ones from the Chris Bangle design school can be ugly to look at, have the awful I-Drive, come from the factory with defects (see my M3 review last year for some good examples of defects), and often have electrical troubles. But there are few, if any, other vehicles out there with the kind of steering, brake, and chassis engineering/refinement that BMW has. Most of the ones I have sampled have been a true pleasure to drive....especially the 335i. That doesn't mean that I would necessarily buy one, especially if it is out of warranty (my automotive priorities often lie elsewhere), but I can see why they are popular with the auto magazines.

I have been driving for over 40 years, test-driven a LOT of cars, and today's BMW's, like it or not, are probably the best sports sedans I've seen yet. But believe it or not, the closest thing I've seen yet to BMW steering/chassis engineering is the new Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8 Track model....that's a car that has to be driven to be believed.

LexFather

You don't read. Speedflex said the 3 beat the G37 by two points, so it was pretty much a tie. The A4 and TL were WAY behind the other two. The only thing pathetic is the newest car, the TL.

I then see you took my post, copied it on another forum then called me a smug *******. You are a real man.If you want, drive to Ohio where they build it and maybe give them copies of this issue of C&D.

Also tell the child Vtach Ricer I am flattered he mentions me as much as he does on multiple forums. Typical Acura/Honda owner imbecile.

Those like you and me and others that have driven these cars can rationalize while C&D does have BMW on the payroll, we understand why the 328 makes such a great case for itself as the G37. We also know why the TL is dead last. It does not offer much of a compelling reason to get over the Accord. Its nice but nice doesn't cut it. It leads in no categories. Except ugly.

KevinGS

Well, I was just house/dog-sitting this past week, because my buddy's in Europe with his wife. And guess what kind of company car he has? An '08 335i Sedan. I drove the hell out of it all week (with his permission of course). Since he trades his cars in every 18 months (company policy), he allows me to treat them like rental cars.

Sad thing is, I have such respect for his BMW, I can barely abuse it, though I do drive it hard.

And Threxx and Marshall are completely correct.

It is pure magic what BMW has accomplished in driving satisfaction in a sedan: the combination of the brakes, the suspension, the steering and even the engine flexibility is superb. It totally makes driving fun and engaging, right off the factory lot, no suspension mods needed.

AND, the car is compliant. The suspension soaks almost ALL but the worst bumps, yet is totally confidence-inspiring on back roads. Crowns in the road, and mid-turn bumps and dips...nothing upsets the suspension. It just telepathically goes where you steer it, without any drama. And the turn-in is crisp and smooth.

Having driven the Infinity too, it's damn close in feel and precision. It really is, and it's REALLY fast. But the Infiniti steering still doesn't have the same feel...it doesn't inspire the same confidence. So you end up braking earlier, and then accelerating midway through the turn and down the straight....which still makes for a pretty fast run (maybe even faster since the Infiniti engine is so damn strong). But not as fun or as exhilirating to me...I'd rather just steer through the turn with the gas pedal and steering wheel which is all the BMW requires...you can carry A LOT of speed into the turn in a BMW. It's captivating that BMW has dialed in such perfection.

I think part of it is the driving position as well. I feel like I sit more in the BMW, where as the higher dash and more "captain chair" feel of the Infiniti driver's seat makes me feel like I am piloting a taller car from a higher position. Yeah, it may not truly be the case, but perception becomes reality....especially when driving.

And the 3 is right-sized, just big enough to feel roomy yet cozy on the inside, and just small enough (with that excellent steering) to be able to have at it with extreme confidence on the back roads, placing the car on a perfect apex like you're a pro-driver.

Yes, similarly-equipped, the 3 is way more expensive than a loaded Infinity. But if money is no object, I will pick the 3 EVERY time. If I don't have the money, the Infinity would be a nice alternative...but, trust me, it would not be my first choice. It's still the "alternative".

Having said all that, I still chose a Lexus because I drive ALOT. I have 180,000 miles on my 2001 GS, and it's never left me stranded (except for a flat tire). That's why I chose it over a used M5 when I bought it. DURABILITY. But if I had a 10 mile commute, or if I had other cars to drive (to keep the miles low), I would get a BMW, just for the sheer driving enjoyment.

So, say what you want about C&D, but I TOTALLY understand why BMWs keep winning those comparison tests. If you don't have to have the absolute fastest car on the planet, and you actually HAVE the money, the surpreme 'feel' of the 3 series is hard to beat.

The A4? Not nearly as fun, and it feels kind of slow, until you move way up in engine size. The Acura? I can't get past the front end and rear end styling to even care what the car has to offer, and I know it doesn't feel as planted or as quick as the BMW.

The more I drive the BMW, the more I understand why many Bimmer guys are snobs. When you're driving something that feels so good, you feel like all other cars just didn't get it right.

Alas, BMW repairs and maintenance issues are MAJOR headaches and god-awful expensive....which is why Lexus and Infiniti will always be stiff competition for BMW. And that's a good thing, for us the enthusiasts. It means BETTER CARS by all the manufacturers!

But in the meantime, the 3 is the benchmark. No, it's not the cheapest, not the fastest, nor is the interior even the best (I like Audi's)....but if you love driving, and don't feel like buying a car and then spending thousands more in mods to "get the suspension and steering right", then just buy the BMW, and then drive it hard as hell while it's under warranty....then trade it in.

madmax2k1

Very good first hand analysis KevinGS; I think the issue most people are having with C&D ranking is they chose the 328i over the G37. We all agree that the 335i is the benchmark when it comes to sport luxury sedans, however the 328i is nowhere near as engaging or fun to drive at the G37.

JKA.nyc

I thought the 3 series was overrated too... until I drove it. The only thing that kept me from getting one was its unappealing looks in sedan form and extremely unimpressive interior which needs a serious overhaul, and living in the city made the handling trade-off between the 3 and IS almost non existent.

LexFather

Its not the engaging/fun to drive part. I have more fun in some slower cars than faster ones. What is a COMPLETE MOOT point is;

most owners/drivers can't even drive, don't drive the cars fast and don't drive hard enough to notice the difference. As I've stated both the winners of this test also have the lowest lease deals, one of their main arguements for buying it. Most just want a nice car at a nice price.

That said, is nearly impossible to overlook 100hp. There is no way in hell I am choosing a 328 over a G37.

QUite frankly I am about to be over magazines. You realize their tests are all outdated as 95% of the owners don't drive them how they are driven in tests. 3% that do can't drive worth squat and that leaves 2% of actual people that can fully exploit these cars capabilities.

I8ABMR

yes !. Those are the sackless drivers. LOL j/k. I understand what you are saying about the buyers, but there is no way that the 328 is the best of the cars tested. unless you are on BMW's sack.LOL


PS if you drive an IS250 or the 1.8l turbo audi you are really sackless. Grow a pair and go buy a mans car, not a mans car powered by a barbie motor. 200 hp in a 3500 lb car is pathetic and frankly feminine. Just my 2 cents.

CDNROCKIES

335 without question....328....are you kidding?

If the 328 is the pick then it's all about being a BMW brand *****.

KevinGS

1Sick, I agree, a 100hp is hard to overlook. But I would. Here's why....

The 328 is still no slouch in the acceleration department, it just doesn't pull nearly as hard from stop as the 'muscle car' Infinity. Infiniti 60 and 1/4 mile times: 5.4 and 14.0. The BMW 328: 5.9 and 14.6.

Now if you're a stoplight or highway hero and want to be able to stomp on it and trounce most mid-level sedans around you, you get the Infiniti. Because you get some luxury, solid-handling and an outstanding-performance engine.

But, if you actually like a tactile feel of the road without much cabin intrusion, sublime yet superb steering, and a smooth&engaging sounding engine, you get the BMW. Keep in mind, the Infiniti engine is pretty rough around the edges in terms of sound...it doesn't "sound" luxurious, it sounds like a muffled truck engine once it revs to the higher edges of the rev band. Also, the Infiniti suspension though quite compliant is still stiffer "feeling" than the BMW. You feel more pockmarks and bumps on the road.

And truth be told, you can enjoy the steering of the BMW, the compliant suspension and the great-sounding engine in the regular driving that most people do. You don't have to be hauling azz to enjoy a BMW.

So again, if you need that extra 100hp because you want the pure adrenaline rush of haulin' azz, the Infiniti may suffice.

But the 328 with far less hp is plenty fast enough for most people, the engine sounds MUCH better and pulls well if you keep the revs up, has a more compliant suspension, and is all-around more engaging when you're alone on a backroad.

So, all in all, I'd still take the BMW if I had the money and I could get it under warranty...the Infiniti is a real nice car, and is uber-fast, and is quite roomy for a smaller sedan, but it's just not 'special'.

It feels like a "faster alternative", because, in essence, that's what it is....the alternative.

GlobeCLK

iTrader: (5)

I don't think anyone is overrating BMWs. They are really that good in terms of handling. I had my buddy's 06 330i for a week, and it was probably one of the best handling cars I've driven (minus the MR-S of course). It's not 335i or G37 quick but it's definitely quick.

I think people are having problems with this 328i vs G37 comparo is because while the 328i is no slouch and handles exceptionally well, overall the G37 seems to triumph in most other aspects. Afterall, maybe superb handling for the 328i has the edge on the track over the G37, most people don't live on the track. And C&D seems to overly extraggerate the handling aspects as the only criteria of their comparo, which is retarded.