manchurian

pertaining to this thread exactly what has Mercedes invented since Lexus has existed that makes their cars more advanced? Or what about the S55 is more advanced? Not to mention things like direct injection wasn't applied to Mercedes gasoline engines until very recently, so I have no idea what you are trying to say Lexus is copying.

Och

iTrader: (3)

Uh... theres a difference between inventing something, and actually making the invention work, and actually be useful.

newr

so is your wife a Mercedes or a Lexus?

DustinV

I'm a current Mercedes owner and I have had absolutely no problems with my E230 or my previous C200 CDI. I would blindly purchase one again, except that I have my heart set on the Citroen C5 or Skoda Superb as my next car.

Mercedes didn't get to where they are by building poor quality cars. Quality only slipped in the mid-1990s but the company has made very large strides to return to their former level of quality. Their current products are proof of this.

And the guy who started this topic really has no clue what he's talking about. The Mercedes taxis in Europe aren't as barebone as people think they are. Your modern Benz taxi, say the E class, has a lot of electronic and hightech components onboard. They're not simple cars. Furthermore a modern diesel engine, even those base ones found in your standard taxi, are controlled by computer software and other electronics. Mercedes are popular as taxis because they're well-built, comfortable and spacious and their running costs are low overall (diesel).

manchurian

someone needs to read less MB press materials, Mercedes hasn't done much in the past 10 years. And they certainly were never a major innovator in the automotive game. The only thing I can come up in the past 10 years is their smart key.

Then again your average MB fanboi still thinks Mercedes invented the airbag. Toyota though was first to sell side curtain airbags and invented the knee airbag, which MB is now using. Kinda like how MB copied Toyota's Pre-Collision and Night View systems. Oh yeah Toyota beat MB by 8 years to computer controlled direct injection for gasoline engines. Toyota was first to adaptive cruise control. Toyota was first to modern adaptive headlamps. Does MB even offer a variable gear ratio steering rack, something Toyota has had since 2002?

And let's not forget Toyota was first to offer the first hi-fi audio back in 2000. And the first to offer a 5.1 channel surround sound.

Maybe MB should hurry up and copy Toyota's VDIM system since it can react prior to the skid. MB should have waited to copy Toyota's Electronically Controlled Brake instead of releasing their defunct Sensotronic system shortly after Toyota and embarrassing themselves. I'm sure MB is busy trying to figure out how Toyota's Lane Keep system works, we'll see how long it take for them to get on that since it took them forever to even offer a lane departure system.

What MB can do is pay General Motors to design hybrids for them. And of course build smart keys. Oh I almost forgot MB did release that simpleton Attention Assist system, except Toyota's much more advanced Driver Monitoring System monitors the driver's eyes to detect if they are falling asleep.

MB was an innovator before WWII. The idea of comparing a tiny company like MB with their small time engineering projects to a giant and powerhouse like Toyota is pretty funny though. MB is lucky they sold Chrysler before they collapsed but in 10 years MB will be in the same position as GM. A company can't sell cars forever based on an image of innovation they never had.

LexFather

Both companies innovate, both companies wait sometimes and then borrow things. Benz has innovated more b/c it has been around longer. I respect and admire both companies.

Benz also raped Chrysler and left them for dead, very innovative for a car company

CDNROCKIES

I'm also a brand new Mercedes owner, but I'm not going to jump on here and start arguing that they are anywhere near as reliable as Lexus'.

I fully intend to getting around to my review of our new '09 ML 320 Bluetec, but the reliability has been less than impressive so far.

We took delivery of it a little over a month ago. So far:

-it was delivered with a broken wiper blade (just the blade, nothing wrong with the wipers themselves)

-the infamous check engine light came on for a couple of days, and then went away on it's own

-we received our first safety recall today (something about water getting into the power lift gate and shorting something out)

The grand total of time it's actually spent in the shop has been about 15 minutes as they replaced the blade in 5 minutes and it took them like 10 minutes to read the computer for the trouble codes.

These issues have been far more annoying than troublesome. I certainly am not going to sit here and try to justify them like some Benz owners do. For vehicles of this price point this kind of thing shouldn't happen.

I can understand how some MB owners try to justify the advantages of their vehicles in other areas over reliability, but I'm not one of them. We love our ML in many, many ways, but are annoyed and frustrated already with these small issues.

KILLERGS4

just buy both (best of both worlds), and you'll be straight... My MB experience so far is Great, only having to take the car in for service every 13,000 miles is much better than every 5,000 miles w/ the Lexus.

bad co

same with my ml

KA8

iTrader: (1)

Benz's suck! Our mb is still a pita after 3 yrs of ownership. Warranty is nice and all but I'm sick and tired of wasting my time of getting my car in and out of dealership. After so much hesitation my wife and I decided to get rid of our 06 C230 and trade it in for a Lexus GX sometime next month

DustinV

I should make this clear. I am not really a Mercedes fan. I respect the company and there are quite a few cars from them that I like and adore but I also respect other car companies and their products. I'm someone with an appreciation for all kinds of cars from different brands, no matter how good or bad they're rated or perceived as.

I like to be objective, too, and this is the reason you'll often see me arguing in defense of Mercedes or other brands, when they're put down here by some too enthusiastic Lexus fans.

Second, I am sorry to hear about those annoyances with your ML but I wouldn't classify that as a serious reliability problem. Annoying? Sure. Reliability problem? Not really. I think your experience can only get better since the new ML has been praised for good quality and workmanship all around compared to the predecessor model. Here in Europe I recall reading that the ML seems to be a very reliable vehicle, especially the diesel models. My memory is a bit shaky but I believe it was published in either Autozeitung or Auto Motor und Sport.

LexFather

We aren't that bad, no defense is necessary. This isn't a Benz forum We don't have to say anything, the past owners of the product usually chime in and explain their experience and why they dropped the brand or were disapointed with it. It matches the quality/reliability findings over the years. The anomaly is the poster who says their German car is perfect or has less problems than their Lexus. Sure it can happen but its few and far between.

CDNRockies is one of the most straightforward posters here. We congratulated him on the ML purchase when he started a thread and he has chimed in with his "review" thus far and its still the Benz "norm". Surely he did expect this somewhat.

DustinV

LOL

The atmosphere here at CL is quite enjoyable. I like the mixture of people and the many intelligent posts here. I am not online much, but I come here to relax and also have fun. I am not a member on other automotive forums either.

What I meant with "enthusiastic Lexus fans" were some of the "diehard" people. I think you know the type.

LexFather

Yes I do. The ones that say all Benzes break down and Lexus never have problems.

KILLERGS4

real nice... this guy ain't "enthusiastic Lexus fans"...