Acura TL looking pretty good
06-03-09, 06:49 PM
#46
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
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bit, I don't think we have agreed on anything in the past month 
Without going into details after seeing these Megatron Turds on the road and puking each time I've seen one I will quickly say the car is the ugliest luxury branded vehicle made maybe the past 20 years. Mods don't help. God can't help. The devil does not want it in hell.
Jeremy Clarkson would have a seizure
Without going into details after seeing these Megatron Turds on the road and puking each time I've seen one I will quickly say the car is the ugliest luxury branded vehicle made maybe the past 20 years. Mods don't help. God can't help. The devil does not want it in hell. Jeremy Clarkson would have a seizure
besides, i thought car chat needed livening up.
Last edited by bitkahuna; 06-03-09 at 06:54 PM.
06-03-09, 08:08 PM
#47
Lexus Fanatic
The SH-AWD version did a 5.9 sec 0-60 in this review and comparison beating the lighter 280hp Volkswagen CCS that has a 6 speed auto. The 09 TL may not be a rocket but the TL never was hugely fast. Considering this version weighs around 4000lbs, uses a older SOHC engine, is based on a fwd platform, engine is not DI, and it still uses a 5 speed auto 5.9 seconds is not that slow and pretty impressive and in line with what my 5 speed auto GS430 does which is rwd, weighs less, and has a 300hp/325tq v8. There has been some debate on Acurazine about how to properly launch the awd 09 TL and by brake torquing it will actually slow it down because it will start in 2nd gear instead of 1rst and then shift back to first, that is most likely how auto testers have been launching it and why it is getting bad 0-60's. Some of the members were getting 0-60 under 6 seconds by not brake torquing their TL's and these cars were not broken in either.
Although I was disappointed and am not thrilled with the styling of the 09 TL I am liking it better the more I see them on the road. The ones with the painted grill especially in black look very nice. That maroon color does look good.
06-04-09, 07:38 AM
#48
Guest
Posts: n/a
First this is CAR CHAT where people talk about the same cars over and over many times. If you are going to get butthurt and only post in Car Chat when your car is talked about then you have no leg to stand on.
Internet ricers.
Okay I didn't want to say anything but I liked it too
Now for the SH-AWD
First, I am glad to see AWD as an option on the TL and it was a good move by Honda.
What people are totally forgetting is under NORMAL driving conditions the TL is a FWD car. Its 70/30 FWD bias split. If it detects slippage, AWD engages like most normal systems. For SH-AWD to kick in, do you understand HOW MUCH slippage you need? The only time the "SH" (what a retarded name btw) kicks in and there is an extra advantage is when you have totally lost control of the car or you are taking a corner at the track at twice the entry speed and the power is shifted to the specific wheel.
Now what owner is going to do that???? These are mall cars, period. This is another example of marketing and these car magazines fooling people. Instead of talking about the 70/30 FWD bias you will feel 99.5% of the time, 1/2 of the article is talking about the .5% of the time "SH" actually will be advantagous.
Its similar to why the XF-R beat the M5 is EVO (or was it CAR I read so much I can't remember). The XF-R was the more useable car 99% of the time. The M5 was better at that 1% level. NO ONE drives at the 1% level 99% of the time.
So Sh-AWD, Quattro, Attensa, lexuS AWD, 4matic, X-drive, etc etc they all pretty much act the same under normal conditions. Guess what 99% of the time, these luxury cars are drivien NORMALLY.
Sh-AWD 70/30 FWD
Quattro-50/50 unless its a RS car or a new S car then its 40/60 RWD
Lexus/Infiniti/BMW/Benz-30/70 RWD bias
Caddy/Saab/Lincoln I am not sure.
AWD isnt' even some new tech to offer anymore. When Lexus/Infiniti put it on the GS/M35 I knew it was going to expand quickly.
Its clear AWD was made popular with luxury cars with Audi but they can no longer advertise Quattro as some advantage as everyone offers AWD now. Even the LS 460 offers AWD now!
06-04-09, 08:17 AM
#49
Racer
I agree the car doesn't look good but 1SICKLEX some of your post wasn't true.
Specific the statement below.
What people are totally forgetting is under NORMAL driving conditions the TL is a FWD car. Its 70/30 FWD bias split. If it detects slippage, AWD engages like most normal systems. For SH-AWD to kick in, do you understand HOW MUCH slippage you need? The only time the "SH" (what a retarded name btw) kicks in and there is an extra advantage is when you have totally lost control of the car or you are taking a corner at the track at twice the entry speed and the power is shifted to the specific wheel.
Now what owner is going to do that???? These are mall cars, period. This is another example of marketing and these car magazines fooling people. Instead of talking about the 70/30 FWD bias you will feel 99.5% of the time, 1/2 of the article is talking about the .5% of the time "SH" actually will be advantagous.
Which tells me that you haven’t driven a vehicle with Acura SH-AWD? I spent some time with the new MDX and you can totally tell that the vehicle AWD system is being used a lot more than your downgrade it to be. For example even if you pull off fast from a light you can feel how the power is being transfer to the four wheels. I'm no Indy driver and I can tell you Acura SH-AWD does work even when your taken a measly turn on a ramp.
Specific the statement below.
What people are totally forgetting is under NORMAL driving conditions the TL is a FWD car. Its 70/30 FWD bias split. If it detects slippage, AWD engages like most normal systems. For SH-AWD to kick in, do you understand HOW MUCH slippage you need? The only time the "SH" (what a retarded name btw) kicks in and there is an extra advantage is when you have totally lost control of the car or you are taking a corner at the track at twice the entry speed and the power is shifted to the specific wheel.
Now what owner is going to do that???? These are mall cars, period. This is another example of marketing and these car magazines fooling people. Instead of talking about the 70/30 FWD bias you will feel 99.5% of the time, 1/2 of the article is talking about the .5% of the time "SH" actually will be advantagous.
Which tells me that you haven’t driven a vehicle with Acura SH-AWD? I spent some time with the new MDX and you can totally tell that the vehicle AWD system is being used a lot more than your downgrade it to be. For example even if you pull off fast from a light you can feel how the power is being transfer to the four wheels. I'm no Indy driver and I can tell you Acura SH-AWD does work even when your taken a measly turn on a ramp.
06-04-09, 08:35 AM
#50
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I really dislike the current styling of the TL, but the potential for this model, if Acura further refines this in future generations is considerable. They have industry leading vehicle safety, class leading interior styling, and an advanced top of the line sh-awd system that hopefully, with further refinement, they could improve drivetrain efficiency. If they have an iota of sense, they'll do a complete overhaul on the design.
06-04-09, 09:02 AM
#51
Guest
Posts: n/a
I agree the car doesn't look good but 1SICKLEX some of your post wasn't true.
Specific the statement below.
What people are totally forgetting is under NORMAL driving conditions the TL is a FWD car. Its 70/30 FWD bias split. If it detects slippage, AWD engages like most normal systems. For SH-AWD to kick in, do you understand HOW MUCH slippage you need? The only time the "SH" (what a retarded name btw) kicks in and there is an extra advantage is when you have totally lost control of the car or you are taking a corner at the track at twice the entry speed and the power is shifted to the specific wheel.
Now what owner is going to do that???? These are mall cars, period. This is another example of marketing and these car magazines fooling people. Instead of talking about the 70/30 FWD bias you will feel 99.5% of the time, 1/2 of the article is talking about the .5% of the time "SH" actually will be advantagous.
Which tells me that you haven’t driven a vehicle with Acura SH-AWD? I spent some time with the new MDX and you can totally tell that the vehicle AWD system is being used a lot more than your downgrade it to be. For example even if you pull off fast from a light you can feel how the power is being transfer to the four wheels. I'm no Indy driver and I can tell you Acura SH-AWD does work even when your taken a measly turn on a ramp.
Specific the statement below.
What people are totally forgetting is under NORMAL driving conditions the TL is a FWD car. Its 70/30 FWD bias split. If it detects slippage, AWD engages like most normal systems. For SH-AWD to kick in, do you understand HOW MUCH slippage you need? The only time the "SH" (what a retarded name btw) kicks in and there is an extra advantage is when you have totally lost control of the car or you are taking a corner at the track at twice the entry speed and the power is shifted to the specific wheel.
Now what owner is going to do that???? These are mall cars, period. This is another example of marketing and these car magazines fooling people. Instead of talking about the 70/30 FWD bias you will feel 99.5% of the time, 1/2 of the article is talking about the .5% of the time "SH" actually will be advantagous.
Which tells me that you haven’t driven a vehicle with Acura SH-AWD? I spent some time with the new MDX and you can totally tell that the vehicle AWD system is being used a lot more than your downgrade it to be. For example even if you pull off fast from a light you can feel how the power is being transfer to the four wheels. I'm no Indy driver and I can tell you Acura SH-AWD does work even when your taken a measly turn on a ramp.
From day one I have said it is clearly the most advanced AWD system out. I also said its asinine they put it in vehicles where you simply won't feel/use the difference daily. If they had produced the new V-10 coupe thing with SH-AWD, it would have changed perceptions on handling since the car and AWD system is built to eploit the advantages to the limit. SH-AWD on the track will produce a clear difference as you can take the car into corners faster and the computer wizardry will kick in, save your *** and put the power to the exact appropriate wheel. Imagine a .3 second advantage every corner, thats a big difference (hypothetical but I figure SH-AWD would have to be advantagous in corners on a track)I have driven the MDX and new TL SH-AWD. In the MDX, I could not tell a thing. For one its such a big vehicle, I didn't WANT to push it. Its a SUV, why on earth would I want to drive so fast and dangerous in it I could tell the difference in the system???? After tooling it around I figured a couple corners i took fast it probably engaged but its in the wrong vehicle. Since it was a loaner with no salesman I drove it as I wished. It simply wasn't engaging and i ended up not wanting to drive it fast. It makes a great SUV though.
, (gulp) the MDX is my favorite Acura. The interior has grown on me, it has tons of space, is well built and the styling actually doesn't make me want to gouge my eyes out. With the TL SH-AWD I did have a salesman (trying to get a loaner in the future) so I could do what I does.
He let me push it and the first thing you notice is how much bigger the TL is. I DO NOT understand cars trying to get sportier and bigger at the same time. WTF is the point? Sh-AWD in the last gen Tl would have been a grand slam . The engine/tranny felt appropriate but never overpowering. SH-AWD NEEDS overpowering, so you can take a corner much faster than you should and have your *** saved by the system. That is fun, that is when you can point to the advantage of the SH. Otherwise, there is no advantage. Seats were comfy, the dash was nice, quality was nice, the NAV was fine. For the MSRP of 45k I was underwhelmed. 35k would have sounded better but its FWD then. Why no reviews? B/C I will comment on Acura/honda threads but I refuse to start anymore. I can start threads on Audi, BMW, Kia, Goats, Hyundai, Fiat, Ford, GM, Holden, Seat, etc and the threads are civil for the most part and fine. Whenever an Acura thread is started the same thing happens, Honda fans come login, post and turn it to crap, defend their car, cry wolf, don't want to take any blame and the thread gets closed. Its redundant.
Acura is already a magazine darling b/c its from Honda. If they slap SH-AWD in a car with a new more powerful engine to really exploit the advantages of the system, they will have a C&D home run.
That said, surely in the future car makers will adapt this system (I think Porsche will be first soon) and any "SH" advantage will be lost.
06-04-09, 10:05 AM
#52
Mike, couple of points.
First of all it is important to understand that while SH-AWD is marketed as super-handling system, it is not what it's true intent is. If anything its intended for stability, neutral feel, and capability of bad weather driving. The 70/30 FWD bias of the sh-awd system is not a bad thing, it does help the car feel more neutral. I know that RWD is suposed to be better, but in reality its only better at the track in the hands of a professional driver. For most of us who just some agressive driving on city streets and highways, AWD is simply the best, and its even better in rainy or snowy weather.
As far as the SH part of the AWD, you could technically say that it is an advanced level of electronic stability system, that works in conjunction with AWD system, and transfers torque based on the slippage. I'm sure its much better than traditional FWD/RDW stability systems which pretty much cut throttle and apply brakes, and it will save a few idiots who push these cars beyond its limits.
But most importantly, I believe the latest SH-AWD system is able to transfer up to 90% of torque to any single wheel, regardless of the condition of any other wheels. This is often overlooked, but do you realize that there are only a handful of true offroad SUVs that are capable of this? Only SUVs with full locking central, rear and front differential are capable of this. I know Wrangler Rubicon allows that, and probably Mercedes G class, and probably old Range Rovers. And these are part time 4wds, while the SH-AWD is full time, fully electronically controlled system.
Most new offroad capable SUVs, including for instance LC, LX, GX, GC, and so on only allow for locking of central differential, while front and rear differentails are either torsen or clutchpack LSDs. They do not have the capability of transfering much torque to the opposite wheel if the other one is spinning. And with torsen, if one wheel is in the air or ice, you basically wont get any torque to the other wheel. And even most older SUVs had locking central differential and locking rear differential, and the front locking hubs, which connected halfshafts to the open differential.
But while offroad capability of SH-AWD system is often overlooked, of course the unibody design on independant suspension and lack of ground clearance isnt well suited for offroading. But thats a different story.
First of all it is important to understand that while SH-AWD is marketed as super-handling system, it is not what it's true intent is. If anything its intended for stability, neutral feel, and capability of bad weather driving. The 70/30 FWD bias of the sh-awd system is not a bad thing, it does help the car feel more neutral. I know that RWD is suposed to be better, but in reality its only better at the track in the hands of a professional driver. For most of us who just some agressive driving on city streets and highways, AWD is simply the best, and its even better in rainy or snowy weather.
As far as the SH part of the AWD, you could technically say that it is an advanced level of electronic stability system, that works in conjunction with AWD system, and transfers torque based on the slippage. I'm sure its much better than traditional FWD/RDW stability systems which pretty much cut throttle and apply brakes, and it will save a few idiots who push these cars beyond its limits.
But most importantly, I believe the latest SH-AWD system is able to transfer up to 90% of torque to any single wheel, regardless of the condition of any other wheels. This is often overlooked, but do you realize that there are only a handful of true offroad SUVs that are capable of this? Only SUVs with full locking central, rear and front differential are capable of this. I know Wrangler Rubicon allows that, and probably Mercedes G class, and probably old Range Rovers. And these are part time 4wds, while the SH-AWD is full time, fully electronically controlled system.
Most new offroad capable SUVs, including for instance LC, LX, GX, GC, and so on only allow for locking of central differential, while front and rear differentails are either torsen or clutchpack LSDs. They do not have the capability of transfering much torque to the opposite wheel if the other one is spinning. And with torsen, if one wheel is in the air or ice, you basically wont get any torque to the other wheel. And even most older SUVs had locking central differential and locking rear differential, and the front locking hubs, which connected halfshafts to the open differential.
But while offroad capability of SH-AWD system is often overlooked, of course the unibody design on independant suspension and lack of ground clearance isnt well suited for offroading. But thats a different story.
Last edited by Och; 06-04-09 at 10:14 AM.
06-04-09, 10:33 AM
#53
Guest
Posts: n/a
Och, I said from day one when it debuted, SH-AWD is the most advanced AWD system today
06-04-09, 10:40 AM
#54
Yeah, but you seem to downplay its role quite a bit by saying that they install in into cars where it wont make a difference. Its true that it wont make the car handle like a ferrari, but like I said, it will save a few idiots from getting into accidents.
