Faceoff: 2009 BMW 335d v. 2009 Lexus GS 450h
07-24-09, 12:01 PM
#16
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Yes, it does:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/au...09bmw335d.html
But I don't see how lack of urea would make the test irrelevant. The selective catalysis process has absolutely nothing to do with fuel economy, which is the reason this test was done--to see if you could have a fun, sporty RWD luxury sedan that still gets great mileage.
To assure the required exhaust cleanliness, the 335d features a complicated three-piece emissions system which consists of an oxidation catalyst, a diesel particulate filter and a Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR) catalyst. It's the injection of what BMW calls AdBlue (otherwise known as ammonia) within the SCR catalyst that makes this engine cleaner than your average diesel.
Such a system has been the subject of some debate for years, as it introduces yet another fluid that needs refilling. BMW says not to worry, as the 335d's two urea tanks should provide enough AdBlue to last until a typical oil change is needed. It will be added as a part of BMW's standard maintenance program, so you're good for the first 50,000 miles. No word on what happens if you don't fill the tanks after the free maintenance period is over.
Such a system has been the subject of some debate for years, as it introduces yet another fluid that needs refilling. BMW says not to worry, as the 335d's two urea tanks should provide enough AdBlue to last until a typical oil change is needed. It will be added as a part of BMW's standard maintenance program, so you're good for the first 50,000 miles. No word on what happens if you don't fill the tanks after the free maintenance period is over.
But I don't see how lack of urea would make the test irrelevant. The selective catalysis process has absolutely nothing to do with fuel economy, which is the reason this test was done--to see if you could have a fun, sporty RWD luxury sedan that still gets great mileage.
07-24-09, 12:58 PM
#18
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That certainly makes it more worthwhile.
I must say I am disspointed by the GSh and Lexus. It came out in '07 and its not particularily more efficient (on paper) than the 460, nor is it all that much more powerful. The sales of it suck. Lexus really needs to do some updating here. Or offer say a GS350h - 370h to entice hybrid buyers.
I must say I am disspointed by the GSh and Lexus. It came out in '07 and its not particularily more efficient (on paper) than the 460, nor is it all that much more powerful. The sales of it suck. Lexus really needs to do some updating here. Or offer say a GS350h - 370h to entice hybrid buyers.
07-24-09, 04:29 PM
#19
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But I don't see how lack of urea would make the test irrelevant. The selective catalysis process has absolutely nothing to do with fuel economy, which is the reason this test was done--to see if you could have a fun, sporty RWD luxury sedan that still gets great mileage.
07-24-09, 09:35 PM
#20
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gs is neat, technically amazing, quick, but heavy, not really sporty.
07-25-09, 01:53 AM
#22
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While it might not affect fuel economy, i dont think they nitrous oxide and particulate pollution justifies the fuel savings. A hybrid is at least both economical and clean with a sulev raiting and good air pollution scores as tested by the epa. Without urea, the diesel soot would be so dirty, it really just hurts the earth more
And you don't need urea to cut down on diesel emissions - Cummins is using a new DPF that actually injects diesel at certain times to keep the catalyst hot to burn up more PM and NOx emissions. It's used on buses and garbage trucks. Toyota and Honda have their urea-free systems in Japan and Europe.
I would never own a German car for three simple reasons - maintenance, insurance, and reliability.
07-25-09, 05:23 AM
#23
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My BMW has cost me roughly $1200 in maintenance and repairs--INCLUDING brakes and tires--over the 9 years I've owned it (take those out and it's more like $600), costs $39/mo to insure (maximum legal coverage, $250 deductible) and has never left me stranded.
Last edited by geko29; 07-25-09 at 06:23 AM.
07-25-09, 07:07 AM
#24
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07-25-09, 11:18 AM
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07-25-09, 11:34 AM
#27
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Geezus they are valid reasons. He didn't imply anything to say they don't sell and we both know people buy all sorts of cars with problems.
The Capt Save a German cape is old
07-25-09, 12:06 PM
#28
As for maintenance? First 3 years you don't worry about it and if you get the extended maintenance plan it'll be 5 years/100k. $1300 maintenance for 5 years/100k miles is pretty darn good.
As for the article, totally different cars. One is more sporty and one emulates sport but is a very comfortable car. I have a 335i and now and then when I take my parents out I drive their GS350.
07-26-09, 11:40 AM
#29
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07-26-09, 12:16 PM
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Your loss then. My BMW has cost me roughly $1200 in maintenance and repairs--INCLUDING brakes and tires--over the 9 years I've owned it (take those out and it's more like $600), costs $39/mo to insure (maximum legal coverage, $250 deductible) and has never left me stranded.
My BMW has cost me roughly $1200 in maintenance and repairs--INCLUDING brakes and tires--over the 9 years I've owned it (take those out and it's more like $600), costs $39/mo to insure (maximum legal coverage, $250 deductible) and has never left me stranded.